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Best of Hillsong Conference

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January 11, 2017
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Four Qualities People Want in a Leader

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Best of Hillsong Conference

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  • - Brian Houston: Well, I love
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  • the Hillsong Conference.
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  • Now, for 30 years starting
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  • in Australia, this conference
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  • has been all about blessing
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  • people everywhere.
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  • We're amazed at the lean-in we
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  • get all around the world
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  • from pastors, churches,
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  • and believers
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  • who want to grow together.
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  • The atmosphere
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  • within the conference
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  • is something to behold.
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  • So I want you to come
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  • on this journey and enjoy
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  • the experience for yourself
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  • as we hear an inspiring message
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  • from Hillsong Conference
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  • - A.R. Bernard: Leadership is
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  • the ability to identify gifts,
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  • talents, and abilities
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  • and strength in people.
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  • Leadership requires maturity,
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  • decisiveness, consistency,
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  • - A.R.: Good morning, Hillsong.
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  • You may be seated.
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  • There are four things that God
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  • wants from a man.
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  • Any men in the house today?
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  • Now, you're roaring like lions.
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  • Thank you.
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  • But there are four things
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  • that God wants from a man:
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  • maturity, decisiveness,
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  • consistency, and strength.
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  • There are four things
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  • that a woman wants from a man:
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  • maturity, decisiveness,
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  • consistency, and strength.
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  • There are four things that men
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  • struggle with in life: maturity,
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  • decisiveness, consistency,
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  • and strength.
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  • We live in a world
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  • where relationships
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  • are greatly challenged.
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  • Eighty-five percent
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  • of relationships, unfortunately,
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  • are doomed to fail.
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  • Forty to fifty percent
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  • of first marriages end
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  • in divorce.
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  • And the second time around,
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  • the rate goes up to 60%.
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  • And that's why we need
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  • the advantage of having Christ
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  • in our lives and Christ
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  • in our relationships,
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  • because the odds against us
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  • are very high in this world,
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  • in this society
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  • in which we live.
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  • Another thing
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  • beyond relationships is,
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  • beyond the challenge
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  • of relationships in our day,
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  • is that this last generation
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  • of women have experienced
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  • unprecedented wealth
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  • and education.
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  • More women are in positions
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  • of power and strength as CEOS
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  • in corporations.
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  • They are also in positions
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  • of leadership.
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  • Government around the world
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  • has expanded
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  • the presence of women in power.
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  • Sixty percent--all right,
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  • you can give women
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  • a round of applause, c'mon.
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  • C'mon, ladies.
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  • Sixty percent
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  • of college enrollment today
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  • is female.
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  • Only forty percent is male.
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  • So there is
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  • an emerging female power class
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  • that many men are not prepared
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  • to deal with.
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  • That's why I wrote this book.
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  • It's called "Four Things Women
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  • Want from a Man."
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  • The audacity of me to tell women
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  • what they want.
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  • But after 44 years of marriage
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  • to the same woman,
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  • 38 years of ministry
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  • and counseling,
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  • maybe I learned a few things.
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  • But I will tell you
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  • my greatest credential
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  • that I present to you
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  • is the number-one complaint
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  • that women have about men
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  • is that men don't listen.
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  • C'mon, ladies,
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  • don't chicken out on me here.
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  • I'll try it again.
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  • The number-one complaint
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  • that women have about men
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  • is that men don't listen.
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  • You're starting to get
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  • into this.
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  • So when I finished
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  • the manuscript of the book,
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  • I presented it to my wife.
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  • She read it.
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  • She looked up at me,
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  • smiled, and said,
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  • "You've been listening."
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  • So those are
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  • the greatest credentials
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  • that I present to you.
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  • Maturity doesn't come with age.
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  • You can have
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  • a 70-year-old adolescent.
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  • You could have a 20-year-old
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  • who's very mature.
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  • So maturity doesn't come
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  • with age.
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  • It begins with the acceptance
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  • of responsibility.
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  • I cannot tell you how many women
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  • that I interviewed
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  • when putting the book together
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  • would say to me,
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  • "I just wish he would grow up."
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  • And what she means is
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  • two things.
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  • Number one, she wants him
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  • to accept responsibility
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  • for his words, his thoughts,
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  • his motives, his actions,
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  • and his attitudes,
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  • especially his words.
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  • She wants to know that when he
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  • says something, he'll own it.
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  • When he says something,
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  • he'll own it.
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  • Secondly, she means decorum.
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  • And decorum is knowing
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  • when and how to act,
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  • conduct one's selves
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  • in any given circumstance
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  • or situation.
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  • She wants that from the man.
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  • Because when men face situations
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  • that are intimidating
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  • and challenging, too often men
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  • regress into adolescence,
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  • forcing the woman
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  • to become his mother,
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  • and then getting angry with her
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  • for mothering him.
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  • If I'm not preachin' to you,
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  • don't worry about it.
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  • C'mon, ladies,
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  • don't chicken out on this.
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  • C'mon, grace and truth came
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  • by Jesus Christ.
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  • So let's have some truth, amen?
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  • That's the reality.
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  • So she wants him to be mature.
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  • She wants him to know
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  • how to conduct himself.
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  • She wants him to have decorum.
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  • Secondly, she wants him to be
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  • decisive.
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  • Now, it's a woman's prerogative
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  • to change her mind.
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  • I understand
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  • the double standard.
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  • However, she wants the man
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  • to be decisive.
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  • And in order to be decisive,
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  • you have to have a set of values
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  • and principles that you
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  • subscribe to that guide
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  • your decision-making process.
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  • Because then you could make
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  • decisions quickly
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  • and confidently.
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  • And that's what decisiveness
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  • is all about.
  • 00:08:07.200 --> 00:08:10.200
  • She wants the man to be
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  • consistent.
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  • She wants his words
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  • and his actions,
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  • his values and his actions,
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  • to be congruent, to line up.
  • 00:08:19.230 --> 00:08:22.230
  • She wants to know that if he
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  • says that this is
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  • what's important to him,
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  • because our values are
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  • what's important to us,
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  • what's most important to us,
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  • what we stand for, what we're
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  • willing to pay the price for,
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  • what we're willing to die for.
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  • Those are our values.
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  • And she wants to know
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  • that his actions are consistent
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  • with what he claims to be
  • 00:08:39.120 --> 00:08:41.240
  • most important to him in life.
  • 00:08:42.150 --> 00:08:45.150
  • She wants consistency.
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  • She wants strength.
  • 00:08:48.270 --> 00:08:51.000
  • And I don't mean
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  • that macho strength where he
  • 00:08:51.220 --> 00:08:53.220
  • shows and flexes his muscles.
  • 00:08:54.250 --> 00:08:57.250
  • Because true strength affords
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  • a man to be gentle and kind.
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  • So his strength is demonstrated
  • 00:09:05.020 --> 00:09:07.170
  • in his gentleness.
  • 00:09:07.170 --> 00:09:10.100
  • And Proverbs says
  • 00:09:10.100 --> 00:09:11.070
  • that, "A man's kindness
  • 00:09:11.070 --> 00:09:13.000
  • You may not have recognized it
  • 00:09:22.290 --> 00:09:24.170
  • - A.R.: These four qualities
  • 00:09:31.140 --> 00:09:33.160
  • are not just the qualities
  • 00:09:33.160 --> 00:09:35.020
  • that God wants in a man,
  • 00:09:35.020 --> 00:09:36.130
  • women want in a man, but these
  • 00:09:36.130 --> 00:09:38.040
  • are also the four qualities
  • 00:09:38.040 --> 00:09:41.020
  • - A.R.: Strength is also
  • 00:09:54.210 --> 00:09:57.210
  • the quality of spirit,
  • 00:09:57.210 --> 00:10:00.190
  • the courage to live out
  • 00:10:00.230 --> 00:10:03.230
  • his convictions,
  • 00:10:03.230 --> 00:10:05.180
  • especially under pressure.
  • 00:10:08.000 --> 00:10:11.000
  • Because when a man has
  • 00:10:11.000 --> 00:10:12.110
  • a set of values and principles
  • 00:10:12.110 --> 00:10:14.280
  • and convictions that he
  • 00:10:14.280 --> 00:10:16.090
  • subscribes to, then the woman
  • 00:10:16.130 --> 00:10:19.130
  • can feel safe and secure
  • 00:10:19.130 --> 00:10:21.240
  • in the relationship, give him
  • 00:10:21.240 --> 00:10:24.040
  • the freedom to come and go
  • 00:10:24.040 --> 00:10:26.120
  • as he wishes, because she
  • 00:10:26.120 --> 00:10:28.180
  • believes that his subscription
  • 00:10:28.180 --> 00:10:31.130
  • to those values and the strength
  • 00:10:31.130 --> 00:10:33.250
  • in his life to live out
  • 00:10:33.250 --> 00:10:35.100
  • his convictions will keep him
  • 00:10:35.100 --> 00:10:37.070
  • from compromising
  • 00:10:37.070 --> 00:10:38.250
  • those convictions,
  • 00:10:38.250 --> 00:10:40.010
  • and therefore, her heart
  • 00:10:40.010 --> 00:10:41.110
  • can safely trust in him.
  • 00:10:45.260 --> 00:10:48.260
  • But here's what I've learned,
  • 00:10:48.260 --> 00:10:51.260
  • and I want to go to our text
  • 00:10:52.080 --> 00:10:55.080
  • for today.
  • 00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:57.200
  • I've learned
  • 00:10:57.200 --> 00:10:58.060
  • that these four qualities
  • 00:10:58.110 --> 00:11:01.130
  • are not just the qualities
  • 00:11:01.130 --> 00:11:02.230
  • that God wants in a man,
  • 00:11:02.230 --> 00:11:04.000
  • women want in a man,
  • 00:11:04.000 --> 00:11:05.050
  • but these are also
  • 00:11:05.050 --> 00:11:06.020
  • the four qualities that people
  • 00:11:06.050 --> 00:11:09.050
  • want in a leader.
  • 00:11:11.180 --> 00:11:14.180
  • Leadership.
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  • Leadership.
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  • There is a vacuum of leadership
  • 00:11:18.130 --> 00:11:21.030
  • in our world.
  • 00:11:21.030 --> 00:11:22.220
  • Leadership is the ability
  • 00:11:22.220 --> 00:11:24.020
  • to move people
  • 00:11:24.020 --> 00:11:25.060
  • in a specific direction.
  • 00:11:25.090 --> 00:11:28.090
  • Leadership is the ability
  • 00:11:28.090 --> 00:11:29.180
  • to identify gifts, talents,
  • 00:11:29.180 --> 00:11:32.060
  • and abilities and strength
  • 00:11:32.060 --> 00:11:33.170
  • in people, and bring them out,
  • 00:11:33.170 --> 00:11:36.160
  • and show them
  • 00:11:36.160 --> 00:11:37.050
  • how to apply them.
  • 00:11:37.140 --> 00:11:40.140
  • Leadership brings out
  • 00:11:40.140 --> 00:11:41.170
  • the best in people.
  • 00:11:41.170 --> 00:11:43.230
  • Leadership is about teaching
  • 00:11:43.230 --> 00:11:45.190
  • people how to respond quickly
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  • to change.
  • 00:11:48.160 --> 00:11:51.020
  • And change is the only constant
  • 00:11:51.180 --> 00:11:54.180
  • in life.
  • 00:11:54.280 --> 00:11:57.280
  • Change is the only constant
  • 00:11:57.280 --> 00:12:00.250
  • in life.
  • 00:12:00.250 --> 00:12:01.230
  • And change is the essence
  • 00:12:01.230 --> 00:12:03.270
  • of maturation.
  • 00:12:03.270 --> 00:12:06.030
  • You'll never mature in life
  • 00:12:06.030 --> 00:12:08.120
  • unless you're willing to change.
  • 00:12:11.130 --> 00:12:14.130
  • A stubborn person will always be
  • 00:12:14.130 --> 00:12:16.090
  • an ignorant person because they
  • 00:12:16.090 --> 00:12:18.250
  • refuse to be taught.
  • 00:12:19.080 --> 00:12:22.080
  • So change is essential.
  • 00:12:22.230 --> 00:12:25.230
  • And how that change is processed
  • 00:12:25.230 --> 00:12:28.080
  • is critical to good growth
  • 00:12:28.080 --> 00:12:30.290
  • versus bad growth.
  • 00:12:32.120 --> 00:12:35.120
  • Leadership requires maturity,
  • 00:12:36.120 --> 00:12:39.120
  • decisiveness, consistency,
  • 00:12:39.120 --> 00:12:41.200
  • and strength.
  • 00:12:41.200 --> 00:12:43.230
  • Little bit
  • 00:12:43.230 --> 00:12:44.270
  • about the maturity aspect
  • 00:12:44.270 --> 00:12:47.030
  • of leadership.
  • 00:12:47.030 --> 00:12:49.070
  • Ministry is people.
  • 00:12:50.270 --> 00:12:53.270
  • Ministry is people.
  • 00:12:56.000 --> 00:12:59.000
  • Ministry is people.
  • 00:13:01.010 --> 00:13:04.010
  • You cannot do ministry if you
  • 00:13:04.010 --> 00:13:06.230
  • don't love people.
  • 00:13:08.200 --> 00:13:11.200
  • And it's not always easy
  • 00:13:11.200 --> 00:13:14.150
  • to love people.
  • 00:13:18.080 --> 00:13:21.080
  • Ten people have experienced
  • 00:13:21.080 --> 00:13:22.170
  • what I'm talking about.
  • 00:13:22.170 --> 00:13:24.120
  • Thank you for your handclap
  • 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:25.200
  • back there.
  • 00:13:25.200 --> 00:13:26.100
  • I appreciate it.
  • 00:13:26.100 --> 00:13:27.200
  • We're here.
  • 00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:28.120
  • We're right here.
  • 00:13:30.030 --> 00:13:33.030
  • There's a wonderful passage
  • 00:13:33.030 --> 00:13:34.170
  • in Matthew chapter 9, verse 36.
  • 00:13:36.270 --> 00:13:39.270
  • And Jesus had just gone through
  • 00:13:39.270 --> 00:13:42.040
  • a process of ministry,
  • 00:13:42.040 --> 00:13:44.170
  • healing people,
  • 00:13:44.170 --> 00:13:45.290
  • dealing with their sickness,
  • 00:13:45.290 --> 00:13:47.150
  • diseases, their issues.
  • 00:13:48.000 --> 00:13:51.000
  • And he pauses
  • 00:13:51.030 --> 00:13:54.030
  • to just look out at the people,
  • 00:13:54.030 --> 00:13:56.210
  • It reads as follows: "But when
  • 00:14:00.020 --> 00:14:02.150
  • he saw the multitudes, he was
  • 00:14:02.270 --> 00:14:05.270
  • moved with compassion for them,
  • 00:14:07.000 --> 00:14:10.000
  • because they were weary,
  • 00:14:11.030 --> 00:14:14.030
  • scattered, they were like sheep
  • 00:14:15.290 --> 00:14:18.290
  • having no shepherd."
  • 00:14:19.280 --> 00:14:22.280
  • who needed leadership.
  • 00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:29.240
  • They had their issues.
  • 00:14:29.240 --> 00:14:31.160
  • They had their challenges.
  • 00:14:31.160 --> 00:14:33.180
  • And those issues and challenges
  • 00:14:33.180 --> 00:14:35.050
  • filled them with anxiety.
  • 00:14:35.110 --> 00:14:38.110
  • So when they heard about this
  • 00:14:38.110 --> 00:14:39.220
  • Jesus and how effectively he
  • 00:14:40.030 --> 00:14:43.030
  • was ministering to the needs
  • 00:14:43.030 --> 00:14:44.130
  • of people, they would gather
  • 00:14:44.130 --> 00:14:46.240
  • in huge crowds,
  • 00:14:46.240 --> 00:14:48.150
  • no matter where he was,
  • 00:14:48.150 --> 00:14:49.220
  • find him, and come to him.
  • 00:14:50.190 --> 00:14:53.190
  • And he,
  • 00:14:53.190 --> 00:14:54.180
  • like the quintessential leader,
  • 00:14:54.180 --> 00:14:56.220
  • looked out at the crowd,
  • 00:14:56.220 --> 00:14:58.180
  • and what he saw moved him
  • 00:15:01.030 --> 00:15:04.030
  • with compassion.
  • 00:15:04.030 --> 00:15:06.010
  • He saw the deep
  • 00:15:06.010 --> 00:15:07.150
  • and profound need that people
  • 00:15:07.160 --> 00:15:10.160
  • have for good leadership.
  • 00:15:12.100 --> 00:15:15.100
  • The prophets of old said
  • 00:15:15.100 --> 00:15:17.210
  • that Messiah, when he would come
  • 00:15:17.210 --> 00:15:19.270
  • and express the kingdom,
  • 00:15:20.280 --> 00:15:23.280
  • that he would bring shepherds
  • 00:15:23.280 --> 00:15:26.070
  • after his own heart.
  • 00:15:26.070 --> 00:15:27.260
  • And the Old Testament use
  • 00:15:27.260 --> 00:15:28.240
  • of the word "shepherd"
  • 00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:30.140
  • is not to be confused
  • 00:15:30.140 --> 00:15:31.230
  • with our use of it today
  • 00:15:31.230 --> 00:15:33.150
  • because we think
  • 00:15:33.150 --> 00:15:34.030
  • of a local pastor.
  • 00:15:34.030 --> 00:15:35.110
  • But the word "shepherd" was used
  • 00:15:35.110 --> 00:15:37.020
  • to describe any level
  • 00:15:37.020 --> 00:15:38.220
  • of leadership, whether sacred
  • 00:15:38.220 --> 00:15:40.240
  • or secular.
  • 00:15:40.240 --> 00:15:43.010
  • Because God sees leaders
  • 00:15:43.010 --> 00:15:44.210
  • as shepherds, someone who has
  • 00:15:44.210 --> 00:15:47.010
  • compassion for the sheep,
  • 00:15:47.010 --> 00:15:48.190
  • who understands their need
  • 00:15:48.190 --> 00:15:51.030
  • for guidance, for wisdom,
  • 00:15:51.030 --> 00:15:53.280
  • for direction,
  • 00:15:53.280 --> 00:15:55.040
  • for understanding.
  • 00:15:55.040 --> 00:15:57.240
  • And Jesus looked out at them,
  • 00:15:57.240 --> 00:16:00.250
  • and he was moved
  • 00:16:00.250 --> 00:16:01.240
  • with compassion.
  • 00:16:02.030 --> 00:16:05.030
  • He saw them weary
  • 00:16:05.030 --> 00:16:07.040
  • because the challenges of life,
  • 00:16:07.040 --> 00:16:08.180
  • the issues that they
  • 00:16:08.180 --> 00:16:09.260
  • were dealing with, and it's
  • 00:16:09.260 --> 00:16:11.210
  • the same familiar issues
  • 00:16:11.210 --> 00:16:13.230
  • that many of us are challenged
  • 00:16:13.230 --> 00:16:15.050
  • with, wore them down and they
  • 00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:19.240
  • were looking for resolution.
  • 00:16:19.240 --> 00:16:22.000
  • They were looking for answers.
  • 00:16:22.180 --> 00:16:25.180
  • They were scattered.
  • 00:16:25.180 --> 00:16:28.010
  • And if we look at that word,
  • 00:16:28.010 --> 00:16:29.120
  • it means "chaos."
  • 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:32.040
  • It means that things were
  • 00:16:32.040 --> 00:16:34.030
  • all over the place.
  • 00:16:34.030 --> 00:16:35.040
  • There was no sense of order
  • 00:16:35.040 --> 00:16:36.230
  • or structure.
  • 00:16:36.290 --> 00:16:39.290
  • And, of course, this was
  • 00:16:39.290 --> 00:16:41.240
  • another thing that he
  • 00:16:41.240 --> 00:16:42.230
  • would bring to them
  • 00:16:42.230 --> 00:16:44.170
  • in his messages and his healing.
  • 00:16:44.170 --> 00:16:46.240
  • The moment you take
  • 00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:47.190
  • responsibility for someone else,
  • 00:16:47.190 --> 00:16:50.050
  • - A.R.: Grace allows God
  • 00:16:55.280 --> 00:16:58.000
  • to look beyond
  • 00:16:58.000 --> 00:17:00.150
  • the high requirements
  • 00:17:00.150 --> 00:17:02.160
  • of the law.
  • 00:17:02.160 --> 00:17:04.040
  • But truth is what brings
  • 00:17:04.040 --> 00:17:05.190
  • the change necessary to move us
  • 00:17:05.220 --> 00:17:08.220
  • from that condition that grace
  • 00:17:08.220 --> 00:17:10.200
  • found us in and lead us
  • 00:17:10.200 --> 00:17:12.280
  • into a pathway of growth,
  • 00:17:12.280 --> 00:17:15.080
  • - A.R.: When people come to us,
  • 00:17:26.030 --> 00:17:29.030
  • it must be assumed that they
  • 00:17:29.260 --> 00:17:32.260
  • admit that they need God
  • 00:17:33.120 --> 00:17:36.120
  • in their life.
  • 00:17:36.120 --> 00:17:38.100
  • That's a basic
  • 00:17:38.100 --> 00:17:39.040
  • and fair assumption,
  • 00:17:39.040 --> 00:17:40.270
  • that when people come to church,
  • 00:17:40.270 --> 00:17:42.210
  • when they come to ministry,
  • 00:17:42.210 --> 00:17:45.100
  • they admit that they have a need
  • 00:17:45.130 --> 00:17:48.130
  • for God in their life.
  • 00:17:48.130 --> 00:17:50.250
  • But they come with anxieties.
  • 00:17:52.050 --> 00:17:55.050
  • They come wrestling with issues.
  • 00:17:55.170 --> 00:17:58.170
  • They come needing guidance
  • 00:17:58.170 --> 00:18:00.250
  • and direction.
  • 00:18:00.250 --> 00:18:02.090
  • And they come with expectations,
  • 00:18:02.250 --> 00:18:05.250
  • sometimes reasonable, sometimes
  • 00:18:05.250 --> 00:18:08.190
  • unreasonable expectation.
  • 00:18:08.190 --> 00:18:11.070
  • And remember, disappointment
  • 00:18:11.070 --> 00:18:12.200
  • in life is never based
  • 00:18:12.200 --> 00:18:13.210
  • upon what you find.
  • 00:18:13.210 --> 00:18:15.030
  • It's also based upon what you
  • 00:18:15.030 --> 00:18:16.230
  • expected to find.
  • 00:18:16.290 --> 00:18:19.290
  • So when what you find
  • 00:18:19.290 --> 00:18:21.140
  • doesn't meet your expectations,
  • 00:18:21.150 --> 00:18:24.150
  • you become disappointed.
  • 00:18:24.150 --> 00:18:27.080
  • And the degree of disappointment
  • 00:18:27.080 --> 00:18:30.080
  • is determined by the distance
  • 00:18:30.080 --> 00:18:32.050
  • between your expectation
  • 00:18:32.230 --> 00:18:35.230
  • and the legitimacy
  • 00:18:35.230 --> 00:18:36.200
  • of that expectation,
  • 00:18:36.200 --> 00:18:37.240
  • and reality.
  • 00:18:37.240 --> 00:18:39.280
  • I tell women all the time,
  • 00:18:39.280 --> 00:18:41.040
  • I say, "Look, when you
  • 00:18:41.040 --> 00:18:41.280
  • get married, on honeymoon night
  • 00:18:41.280 --> 00:18:44.240
  • you go to bed with the ideal,
  • 00:18:44.240 --> 00:18:46.210
  • but you wake up
  • 00:18:46.210 --> 00:18:47.100
  • with the reality."
  • 00:18:49.220 --> 00:18:52.220
  • So expectations
  • 00:18:52.220 --> 00:18:53.240
  • have to be managed.
  • 00:18:53.240 --> 00:18:56.160
  • But the people that come to us,
  • 00:18:56.160 --> 00:18:58.080
  • as leaders,
  • 00:18:58.080 --> 00:18:59.280
  • don't know how to manage
  • 00:18:59.280 --> 00:19:01.060
  • those expectations.
  • 00:19:01.060 --> 00:19:03.150
  • And sometimes those expectations
  • 00:19:03.150 --> 00:19:05.010
  • are so high that when we,
  • 00:19:05.010 --> 00:19:06.280
  • as leaders, don't measure up
  • 00:19:06.280 --> 00:19:08.210
  • to them, the individuals
  • 00:19:08.210 --> 00:19:10.220
  • who come get disappointed.
  • 00:19:12.050 --> 00:19:15.050
  • That's the reality
  • 00:19:15.050 --> 00:19:16.170
  • of leadership.
  • 00:19:16.280 --> 00:19:19.280
  • 2 Chronicles chapter 1,
  • 00:19:19.280 --> 00:19:21.280
  • verse 10, Solomon is
  • 00:19:26.140 --> 00:19:29.140
  • in a great situation
  • 00:19:29.140 --> 00:19:32.050
  • because he's about to take on
  • 00:19:32.050 --> 00:19:33.240
  • the leadership of a nation,
  • 00:19:35.060 --> 00:19:38.060
  • a nation that has been through
  • 00:19:38.060 --> 00:19:40.140
  • a lot.
  • 00:19:40.140 --> 00:19:42.150
  • Under his father's leadership,
  • 00:19:42.150 --> 00:19:44.080
  • David, they've witnessed
  • 00:19:44.080 --> 00:19:46.220
  • failures in leadership,
  • 00:19:46.220 --> 00:19:48.060
  • weakness in leadership,
  • 00:19:48.060 --> 00:19:49.250
  • and at the same time,
  • 00:19:49.250 --> 00:19:50.250
  • strength in leadership.
  • 00:19:50.250 --> 00:19:53.160
  • Solomon now steps into position
  • 00:19:53.160 --> 00:19:56.020
  • and his prayer
  • 00:19:56.020 --> 00:19:58.000
  • is quite interesting.
  • 00:19:58.000 --> 00:19:59.040
  • His request is
  • 00:19:59.040 --> 00:20:00.000
  • quite interesting,
  • 00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:01.100
  • and I call it a prayer.
  • 00:20:01.100 --> 00:20:03.230
  • Because he has the experience
  • 00:20:03.230 --> 00:20:05.280
  • of seeing his father, David,
  • 00:20:06.070 --> 00:20:09.070
  • as a leader.
  • 00:20:09.070 --> 00:20:11.040
  • He had the experience
  • 00:20:11.040 --> 00:20:12.080
  • of watching David deal
  • 00:20:12.080 --> 00:20:14.230
  • with not only the people
  • 00:20:14.230 --> 00:20:16.210
  • in the kingdom,
  • 00:20:16.210 --> 00:20:17.220
  • but his own family.
  • 00:20:17.220 --> 00:20:19.240
  • And if you read the story about
  • 00:20:19.240 --> 00:20:20.280
  • David's life, you know that he
  • 00:20:20.280 --> 00:20:22.240
  • had a lot of family issues,
  • 00:20:23.130 --> 00:20:26.130
  • quite dysfunctional family.
  • 00:20:26.130 --> 00:20:29.120
  • So now the leadership mantle
  • 00:20:29.120 --> 00:20:31.270
  • is being given to Solomon.
  • 00:20:32.120 --> 00:20:35.120
  • And God says, "Whatever you
  • 00:20:35.120 --> 00:20:37.040
  • want, I'll give it to you."
  • 00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:41.000
  • verse 10 Solomon says:
  • 00:20:44.040 --> 00:20:47.040
  • "Give me wisdom," but then he
  • 00:20:50.220 --> 00:20:53.220
  • gets a little detailed.
  • 00:20:53.220 --> 00:20:56.120
  • He said, "Give me wisdom,
  • 00:20:56.120 --> 00:20:58.250
  • so that I can go out and come in
  • 00:21:03.060 --> 00:21:06.060
  • amongst your people;
  • 00:21:07.290 --> 00:21:10.290
  • because who can judge
  • 00:21:10.290 --> 00:21:13.090
  • this great nation of people?"
  • 00:21:13.090 --> 00:21:16.000
  • And he understood
  • 00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:17.040
  • good judgment.
  • 00:21:19.270 --> 00:21:22.270
  • But his words are critical.
  • 00:21:24.000 --> 00:21:27.000
  • He said, "Give me the wisdom,
  • 00:21:27.000 --> 00:21:29.090
  • not just wisdom to lead,
  • 00:21:29.090 --> 00:21:31.000
  • but wisdom to go out
  • 00:21:34.020 --> 00:21:37.020
  • and to come in."
  • 00:21:37.020 --> 00:21:38.250
  • Because he understood
  • 00:21:38.250 --> 00:21:40.170
  • that his leadership
  • 00:21:40.170 --> 00:21:41.260
  • would require him to be
  • 00:21:41.260 --> 00:21:44.190
  • amongst the people,
  • 00:21:44.190 --> 00:21:46.060
  • have a rapport with the people,
  • 00:21:46.190 --> 00:21:49.190
  • a loving understanding
  • 00:21:49.190 --> 00:21:52.060
  • and trusting relationship
  • 00:21:52.060 --> 00:21:54.010
  • with the people.
  • 00:21:54.010 --> 00:21:54.290
  • But at the same time,
  • 00:21:54.290 --> 00:21:56.250
  • he would have to have
  • 00:21:56.250 --> 00:21:58.140
  • a degree of detachment
  • 00:21:58.140 --> 00:22:01.010
  • from the very people that he
  • 00:22:01.010 --> 00:22:02.210
  • was called to lead.
  • 00:22:03.240 --> 00:22:06.240
  • He had to be in a place
  • 00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:09.000
  • where their personal agendas,
  • 00:22:10.000 --> 00:22:13.000
  • personal emotions,
  • 00:22:13.000 --> 00:22:14.100
  • personal anxieties
  • 00:22:14.100 --> 00:22:15.290
  • and challenges did not become
  • 00:22:15.290 --> 00:22:18.020
  • so overwhelming to him that he
  • 00:22:18.020 --> 00:22:20.210
  • could not separate himself
  • 00:22:20.210 --> 00:22:22.190
  • from them in order to lead them.
  • 00:22:25.100 --> 00:22:28.100
  • See, because as leaders,
  • 00:22:28.100 --> 00:22:29.160
  • although we are
  • 00:22:29.160 --> 00:22:30.210
  • amongst the people,
  • 00:22:30.210 --> 00:22:32.070
  • moving within the people,
  • 00:22:32.070 --> 00:22:34.000
  • navigating with the people,
  • 00:22:34.000 --> 00:22:35.240
  • hearing and feeling
  • 00:22:35.240 --> 00:22:37.060
  • with compassion their issues,
  • 00:22:37.060 --> 00:22:39.080
  • their challenges, in order
  • 00:22:39.100 --> 00:22:42.100
  • to lead them objectively,
  • 00:22:42.100 --> 00:22:44.220
  • we've got to be able
  • 00:22:44.220 --> 00:22:46.050
  • to separate ourselves
  • 00:22:46.050 --> 00:22:47.280
  • from those realities
  • 00:22:47.280 --> 00:22:49.280
  • that they're dealing with
  • 00:22:49.280 --> 00:22:51.020
  • in order to speak truth
  • 00:22:51.020 --> 00:22:52.190
  • into their lives.
  • 00:22:52.190 --> 00:22:54.040
  • You cannot lead people
  • 00:22:54.040 --> 00:22:56.200
  • that you're afraid of.
  • 00:22:56.200 --> 00:22:59.050
  • I'mma try that one more time.
  • 00:22:59.050 --> 00:23:01.200
  • You cannot lead people
  • 00:23:01.200 --> 00:23:03.280
  • that you're afraid of.
  • 00:23:03.280 --> 00:23:06.140
  • You cannot lead people that you
  • 00:23:06.170 --> 00:23:09.170
  • are bound by.
  • 00:23:10.290 --> 00:23:13.290
  • And it's so easy to go out
  • 00:23:14.080 --> 00:23:17.080
  • amongst the people, love them,
  • 00:23:17.080 --> 00:23:19.190
  • interact with them, hear
  • 00:23:19.190 --> 00:23:21.130
  • their needs, feel their needs.
  • 00:23:22.080 --> 00:23:25.080
  • But if you're not careful,
  • 00:23:25.080 --> 00:23:26.290
  • you can become so entangled
  • 00:23:26.290 --> 00:23:29.040
  • in those needs that you
  • 00:23:29.040 --> 00:23:31.010
  • cannot lead them objectively.
  • 00:23:32.140 --> 00:23:35.140
  • Because when you get entangled,
  • 00:23:35.140 --> 00:23:38.000
  • you have second thoughts
  • 00:23:38.000 --> 00:23:40.200
  • about speaking the truth
  • 00:23:40.200 --> 00:23:43.050
  • I shared with you that change is
  • 00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:53.250
  • the only constant in life.
  • 00:23:54.070 --> 00:23:57.070
  • Truth brings the conviction
  • 00:23:57.200 --> 00:24:00.220
  • necessary for change.
  • 00:24:01.000 --> 00:24:04.000
  • That's why Jesus' prayer for us
  • 00:24:04.000 --> 00:24:06.060
  • is that, "Sanctify them
  • 00:24:06.060 --> 00:24:08.260
  • with your truth.
  • 00:24:08.260 --> 00:24:11.170
  • Your Word is truth."
  • 00:24:12.270 --> 00:24:15.270
  • What separates us from the lie,
  • 00:24:15.270 --> 00:24:18.040
  • what separates us
  • 00:24:18.040 --> 00:24:19.200
  • from the illusions, is truth.
  • 00:24:22.040 --> 00:24:25.040
  • So truth brings the conviction
  • 00:24:25.040 --> 00:24:27.060
  • necessary for change.
  • 00:24:27.060 --> 00:24:30.010
  • Because you will not change
  • 00:24:30.150 --> 00:24:33.150
  • unless you're willing
  • 00:24:33.150 --> 00:24:34.200
  • to be confronted by the truth
  • 00:24:35.280 --> 00:24:38.280
  • about your situation.
  • 00:24:41.010 --> 00:24:44.010
  • All truth is confrontational.
  • 00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:48.200
  • All truth is confrontational.
  • 00:24:50.130 --> 00:24:53.130
  • All truth is confrontational.
  • 00:24:55.060 --> 00:24:58.060
  • But you will not change
  • 00:24:58.060 --> 00:25:00.040
  • in life unless you're willing
  • 00:25:00.040 --> 00:25:02.040
  • to be confronted
  • 00:25:02.040 --> 00:25:03.070
  • with the truth.
  • 00:25:03.070 --> 00:25:05.280
  • And again,
  • 00:25:05.280 --> 00:25:07.100
  • grace allows God to look
  • 00:25:07.100 --> 00:25:10.020
  • beyond the high requirements
  • 00:25:10.290 --> 00:25:13.290
  • of the law of righteousness,
  • 00:25:14.060 --> 00:25:17.060
  • and see our needs,
  • 00:25:17.060 --> 00:25:19.080
  • and deal with our needs.
  • 00:25:19.080 --> 00:25:20.230
  • But truth is what brings
  • 00:25:20.230 --> 00:25:22.170
  • the change necessary to move us
  • 00:25:22.200 --> 00:25:25.200
  • from that condition that grace
  • 00:25:25.200 --> 00:25:27.220
  • found us in and lead us
  • 00:25:27.220 --> 00:25:29.280
  • into a pathway of growth,
  • 00:25:29.280 --> 00:25:32.040
  • - A.R.: Love is the willingness
  • 00:25:38.040 --> 00:25:41.010
  • to tell you the truth,
  • 00:25:41.010 --> 00:25:42.290
  • knowing that that truth and only
  • 00:25:42.290 --> 00:25:45.140
  • - A.R.: Maturation is
  • 00:25:59.160 --> 00:26:01.020
  • the essence of true growth
  • 00:26:02.180 --> 00:26:05.180
  • and development.
  • 00:26:05.180 --> 00:26:07.100
  • Everything has been called
  • 00:26:07.100 --> 00:26:09.090
  • to mature, relationships
  • 00:26:10.040 --> 00:26:13.040
  • to mature.
  • 00:26:13.040 --> 00:26:14.010
  • So Solomon deeply and profoundly
  • 00:26:14.010 --> 00:26:16.280
  • with his words, understood
  • 00:26:16.280 --> 00:26:18.090
  • that, "Okay, I need some wisdom
  • 00:26:18.090 --> 00:26:20.190
  • to go out,
  • 00:26:20.190 --> 00:26:21.250
  • be one with the people,
  • 00:26:21.250 --> 00:26:23.060
  • interact with them,
  • 00:26:23.060 --> 00:26:24.150
  • let them understand that I have
  • 00:26:24.150 --> 00:26:26.130
  • compassion.
  • 00:26:26.130 --> 00:26:27.090
  • I feel for you.
  • 00:26:27.090 --> 00:26:29.020
  • I'm feeling you here.
  • 00:26:29.020 --> 00:26:30.110
  • I understand what you're
  • 00:26:30.110 --> 00:26:31.050
  • going through.
  • 00:26:31.050 --> 00:26:31.260
  • But at the same time, you must
  • 00:26:31.260 --> 00:26:33.240
  • understand that I have to have
  • 00:26:33.240 --> 00:26:35.260
  • a certain rapport so that I
  • 00:26:36.240 --> 00:26:39.240
  • can be honest and speak
  • 00:26:39.240 --> 00:26:41.220
  • into your life."
  • 00:26:42.200 --> 00:26:45.200
  • And that's why I say you
  • 00:26:45.200 --> 00:26:46.190
  • cannot lead people
  • 00:26:46.190 --> 00:26:48.110
  • if you're afraid of them.
  • 00:26:48.110 --> 00:26:50.130
  • Because you'll be afraid to tell
  • 00:26:50.130 --> 00:26:52.110
  • them what they really need
  • 00:26:52.110 --> 00:26:54.190
  • to hear in order to change
  • 00:26:54.190 --> 00:26:57.180
  • their condition.
  • 00:27:01.220 --> 00:27:04.220
  • True leaders are willing to take
  • 00:27:04.220 --> 00:27:06.250
  • that risk.
  • 00:27:06.250 --> 00:27:07.250
  • True friends are willing to take
  • 00:27:07.250 --> 00:27:09.280
  • that risk.
  • 00:27:09.280 --> 00:27:11.190
  • Because if you're a true friend,
  • 00:27:11.190 --> 00:27:13.030
  • you'll tell me what's wrong
  • 00:27:13.030 --> 00:27:14.210
  • with me, and you'll risk
  • 00:27:14.210 --> 00:27:16.270
  • the friendship.
  • 00:27:16.270 --> 00:27:19.020
  • Because Jesus said, "Whatever
  • 00:27:19.020 --> 00:27:20.040
  • you wanna save in life, you
  • 00:27:20.040 --> 00:27:21.160
  • better be willing to lose it."
  • 00:27:22.280 --> 00:27:25.280
  • And too often, trying to save
  • 00:27:25.280 --> 00:27:27.250
  • something that we're not willing
  • 00:27:27.250 --> 00:27:29.020
  • to lose, we end up losing it
  • 00:27:29.020 --> 00:27:30.280
  • anyway.
  • 00:27:30.280 --> 00:27:31.280
  • Turn to your neighbor and say,
  • 00:27:31.280 --> 00:27:32.230
  • "He's talkin' about somebody
  • 00:27:32.230 --> 00:27:33.260
  • you know."
  • 00:27:40.030 --> 00:27:43.030
  • So Solomon understood it,
  • 00:27:43.030 --> 00:27:46.000
  • and it was a brilliant request.
  • 00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:48.190
  • Because that's the part
  • 00:27:48.190 --> 00:27:50.050
  • of leadership that we
  • 00:27:50.050 --> 00:27:51.020
  • find tough.
  • 00:27:51.020 --> 00:27:52.030
  • A friend of mine
  • 00:27:52.030 --> 00:27:53.030
  • who's a clinical psychologist,
  • 00:27:53.030 --> 00:27:55.090
  • Dr. Derrick Sweet,
  • 00:27:55.090 --> 00:27:57.060
  • we were talking and he said,
  • 00:27:57.060 --> 00:27:58.260
  • "You have no idea when you
  • 00:27:58.260 --> 00:28:00.190
  • get up on stage every Sunday,"
  • 00:28:00.190 --> 00:28:03.130
  • he said,
  • 00:28:03.130 --> 00:28:04.020
  • "everybody in that audience
  • 00:28:04.020 --> 00:28:05.270
  • is projecting on you."
  • 00:28:05.270 --> 00:28:07.280
  • I said, "Really?"
  • 00:28:07.280 --> 00:28:08.200
  • He said, "Yeah.
  • 00:28:08.200 --> 00:28:10.130
  • People are projecting
  • 00:28:10.130 --> 00:28:11.280
  • either their successes
  • 00:28:11.280 --> 00:28:12.290
  • or their failures because you
  • 00:28:12.290 --> 00:28:14.270
  • are the representation of God
  • 00:28:14.270 --> 00:28:17.140
  • in their life.
  • 00:28:17.140 --> 00:28:18.180
  • So if they feel God is failing
  • 00:28:18.180 --> 00:28:19.270
  • them, guess who gets the blame?"
  • 00:28:21.260 --> 00:28:24.260
  • The leader gets the blame.
  • 00:28:24.260 --> 00:28:26.270
  • And that's the reality.
  • 00:28:26.270 --> 00:28:27.240
  • And I get it.
  • 00:28:27.240 --> 00:28:28.150
  • It comes with the territory.
  • 00:28:28.150 --> 00:28:30.150
  • Let's go quickly
  • 00:28:30.150 --> 00:28:31.240
  • to Acts chapter 26, verse 17.
  • 00:28:34.200 --> 00:28:37.200
  • In the book of Acts
  • 00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:39.260
  • the Apostle Paul is standing
  • 00:28:39.260 --> 00:28:41.150
  • before King Agrippa.
  • 00:28:41.150 --> 00:28:44.110
  • And he's basically sharing
  • 00:28:44.110 --> 00:28:46.210
  • his testimony, his story,
  • 00:28:46.210 --> 00:28:49.070
  • of how he got converted
  • 00:28:49.070 --> 00:28:51.140
  • and how Christ came
  • 00:28:51.140 --> 00:28:52.110
  • into his life.
  • 00:28:52.220 --> 00:28:55.220
  • And he moves
  • 00:28:55.220 --> 00:28:57.130
  • from that personal testimony
  • 00:28:57.130 --> 00:28:59.110
  • into a broader testimony
  • 00:28:59.110 --> 00:29:01.250
  • about his call to ministry,
  • 00:29:01.250 --> 00:29:04.020
  • his call to leadership.
  • 00:29:04.230 --> 00:29:07.230
  • Let's look at his words.
  • 00:29:08.090 --> 00:29:11.090
  • Now, if you know the story
  • 00:29:11.090 --> 00:29:12.160
  • of the Apostle Paul,
  • 00:29:12.160 --> 00:29:14.050
  • you know that he was knocked
  • 00:29:14.050 --> 00:29:15.170
  • off his beast, blinded,
  • 00:29:15.170 --> 00:29:17.220
  • Verse 16, Acts chapter 26:
  • 00:29:20.110 --> 00:29:23.110
  • "'But rise and stand
  • 00:29:23.110 --> 00:29:24.270
  • on your feet; for I
  • 00:29:24.270 --> 00:29:26.180
  • have appeared to you
  • 00:29:26.180 --> 00:29:28.000
  • for this purpose, to make you
  • 00:29:28.000 --> 00:29:30.140
  • a minister and a witness
  • 00:29:31.150 --> 00:29:34.150
  • both of the things which you
  • 00:29:34.150 --> 00:29:36.020
  • have seen and of the things
  • 00:29:36.020 --> 00:29:38.010
  • which I will yet reveal to you.
  • 00:29:38.040 --> 00:29:41.040
  • I will deliver you
  • 00:29:41.040 --> 00:29:42.120
  • from the Jewish people,
  • 00:29:42.120 --> 00:29:43.150
  • as well as from the Gentiles,
  • 00:29:43.150 --> 00:29:44.180
  • to whom I now send you,
  • 00:29:44.180 --> 00:29:46.060
  • to open their eyes,
  • 00:29:46.060 --> 00:29:48.150
  • in order to turn them
  • 00:29:48.150 --> 00:29:50.100
  • from darkness to light,
  • 00:29:50.100 --> 00:29:52.160
  • and from the power of Satan
  • 00:29:52.160 --> 00:29:54.230
  • to God, that they may receive
  • 00:29:54.230 --> 00:29:57.050
  • forgiveness of sins
  • 00:29:57.050 --> 00:29:58.200
  • and an inheritance among those
  • 00:29:58.200 --> 00:30:01.130
  • who are sanctified by faith
  • 00:30:01.130 --> 00:30:03.050
  • in me.'"
  • 00:30:03.050 --> 00:30:03.230
  • Wow, that really sums up
  • 00:30:03.230 --> 00:30:05.230
  • what ministry is about.
  • 00:30:05.230 --> 00:30:07.190
  • Because we are indeed called
  • 00:30:07.190 --> 00:30:09.130
  • to turn people from darkness
  • 00:30:09.130 --> 00:30:12.130
  • to light, from the power
  • 00:30:12.130 --> 00:30:14.030
  • of Satan to the power of God.
  • 00:30:14.230 --> 00:30:17.230
  • That's our call.
  • 00:30:17.230 --> 00:30:19.170
  • And to introduce them
  • 00:30:19.170 --> 00:30:21.010
  • to that inheritance that comes
  • 00:30:21.010 --> 00:30:22.260
  • to them, that abundant life
  • 00:30:22.260 --> 00:30:25.140
  • that comes to us,
  • 00:30:25.140 --> 00:30:26.170
  • as a result of Christ's work
  • 00:30:27.040 --> 00:30:30.040
  • on that cross.
  • 00:30:30.040 --> 00:30:31.130
  • But I want you to notice
  • 00:30:31.130 --> 00:30:32.040
  • something very carefully here.
  • 00:30:32.040 --> 00:30:34.040
  • I read through it quickly
  • 00:30:34.040 --> 00:30:35.050
  • purposefully.
  • 00:30:35.050 --> 00:30:36.020
  • Verse 17: "'I will deliver you
  • 00:30:36.130 --> 00:30:39.130
  • from the Jewish people,
  • 00:30:39.130 --> 00:30:42.120
  • as well as from the Gentiles,
  • 00:30:42.120 --> 00:30:45.010
  • to whom I now send you.'"
  • 00:30:45.010 --> 00:30:47.280
  • And I read this, I said,
  • 00:30:47.280 --> 00:30:48.220
  • "Wait a minute, wait a minute,
  • 00:30:48.220 --> 00:30:49.140
  • wait.
  • 00:30:49.140 --> 00:30:51.130
  • God has to deliver him
  • 00:30:51.130 --> 00:30:54.110
  • from the people
  • 00:30:54.110 --> 00:30:56.050
  • Why?
  • 00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:02.190
  • What is it
  • 00:31:02.190 --> 00:31:03.090
  • about that relationship
  • 00:31:03.090 --> 00:31:04.140
  • that Paul would have to be free
  • 00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:06.150
  • from in order to minister
  • 00:31:06.150 --> 00:31:09.080
  • to them?"
  • 00:31:09.080 --> 00:31:10.270
  • Well, it goes right back
  • 00:31:10.270 --> 00:31:12.020
  • to the words of Solomon.
  • 00:31:12.020 --> 00:31:14.210
  • He said, "I need wisdom
  • 00:31:14.210 --> 00:31:16.200
  • to go out and to come back in."
  • 00:31:17.150 --> 00:31:20.150
  • Paul is saying that God,
  • 00:31:20.150 --> 00:31:23.120
  • in this call upon his life,
  • 00:31:23.120 --> 00:31:25.220
  • the apostle was saying,
  • 00:31:25.220 --> 00:31:27.010
  • "Wow, I have to be free
  • 00:31:28.180 --> 00:31:31.180
  • from the very people that God
  • 00:31:31.180 --> 00:31:33.100
  • is sending me to set free.
  • 00:31:33.190 --> 00:31:36.190
  • Because if I'm not free,
  • 00:31:36.190 --> 00:31:38.160
  • how can I free them?"
  • 00:31:43.260 --> 00:31:46.260
  • Leadership is setting
  • 00:31:46.260 --> 00:31:49.070
  • the example.
  • 00:31:49.070 --> 00:31:51.150
  • Leadership is understanding
  • 00:31:51.210 --> 00:31:54.210
  • that there has to be a rapport,
  • 00:31:54.210 --> 00:31:57.180
  • a loving, trusting understanding
  • 00:31:57.180 --> 00:31:59.270
  • relationship with the people
  • 00:31:59.270 --> 00:32:01.120
  • we lead.
  • 00:32:01.120 --> 00:32:02.110
  • But at the same time,
  • 00:32:02.110 --> 00:32:03.200
  • we must be able to step back
  • 00:32:03.200 --> 00:32:06.070
  • and be objective in interacting
  • 00:32:07.160 --> 00:32:10.160
  • with them and leading them.
  • 00:32:11.080 --> 00:32:14.080
  • That's the only way that we
  • 00:32:14.080 --> 00:32:16.060
  • can lead them.
  • 00:32:16.060 --> 00:32:18.020
  • It's true no matter
  • 00:32:18.020 --> 00:32:19.020
  • what context of leadership
  • 00:32:19.020 --> 00:32:20.270
  • you find yourself in.
  • 00:32:20.270 --> 00:32:23.200
  • It could be in ministry.
  • 00:32:23.200 --> 00:32:25.230
  • It could be at work.
  • 00:32:25.230 --> 00:32:27.170
  • It could be in the home.
  • 00:32:27.170 --> 00:32:29.170
  • It could be in community.
  • 00:32:29.170 --> 00:32:32.010
  • No matter what type
  • 00:32:32.010 --> 00:32:33.070
  • of leadership or level
  • 00:32:33.070 --> 00:32:34.240
  • of leadership,
  • 00:32:34.240 --> 00:32:36.040
  • you need the wisdom to know
  • 00:32:36.040 --> 00:32:39.030
  • how to be close,
  • 00:32:39.030 --> 00:32:42.010
  • and at the same time, separated,
  • 00:32:42.010 --> 00:32:45.000
  • so that you can love.
  • 00:32:45.230 --> 00:32:48.230
  • Some people find it difficult
  • 00:32:50.100 --> 00:32:53.100
  • to be loved
  • 00:32:53.100 --> 00:32:55.090
  • because the very person
  • 00:32:55.090 --> 00:32:57.190
  • that they want that love from
  • 00:32:57.190 --> 00:33:00.180
  • is so entangled with them
  • 00:33:00.180 --> 00:33:02.270
  • and their issues that they find
  • 00:33:02.270 --> 00:33:05.000
  • it difficult to experience
  • 00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:06.190
  • that love.
  • 00:33:06.190 --> 00:33:09.070
  • In order for me to love you,
  • 00:33:09.070 --> 00:33:11.210
  • guess what?
  • 00:33:11.210 --> 00:33:12.250
  • I have to be able to be
  • 00:33:12.250 --> 00:33:13.210
  • objective with you.
  • 00:33:13.230 --> 00:33:16.230
  • Otherwise,
  • 00:33:16.230 --> 00:33:17.290
  • I cannot truly love you.
  • 00:33:18.080 --> 00:33:21.080
  • Because love is the willingness
  • 00:33:21.260 --> 00:33:24.260
  • to tell you the truth
  • 00:33:24.260 --> 00:33:26.220
  • about your situation,
  • 00:33:26.220 --> 00:33:28.200
  • even at the risk of you
  • 00:33:28.200 --> 00:33:30.020
  • getting upset with me,
  • 00:33:30.020 --> 00:33:31.290
  • but knowing that that truth
  • 00:33:31.290 --> 00:33:34.060
  • and only that truth
  • 00:33:34.060 --> 00:33:35.230
  • will set you free.
  • 00:33:40.200 --> 00:33:43.200
  • Leadership requires maturity,
  • 00:33:44.040 --> 00:33:47.040
  • decisiveness, consistency,
  • 00:33:47.050 --> 00:33:50.050
  • but it also requires strength.
  • 00:33:51.070 --> 00:33:54.070
  • And I tell people, don't go
  • 00:33:54.070 --> 00:33:57.050
  • into ministry because you
  • 00:33:57.050 --> 00:33:59.090
  • like the way it looks.
  • 00:34:00.290 --> 00:34:03.290
  • Don't go into ministry
  • 00:34:03.290 --> 00:34:06.110
  • because you're wrestling
  • 00:34:06.110 --> 00:34:07.170
  • with your own identity crisis
  • 00:34:07.170 --> 00:34:09.090
  • and you think you can resolve it
  • 00:34:09.090 --> 00:34:11.030
  • by becoming a minister.
  • 00:34:12.090 --> 00:34:15.090
  • Because all you will do is
  • 00:34:15.090 --> 00:34:16.180
  • to pass that crisis on
  • 00:34:16.180 --> 00:34:18.150
  • to the people that you lead.
  • 00:34:18.150 --> 00:34:21.150
  • And we've seen enough of that.
  • 00:34:21.150 --> 00:34:23.190
  • Don't go into ministry because
  • 00:34:23.190 --> 00:34:25.290
  • you failed in the world and you
  • 00:34:25.290 --> 00:34:27.290
  • recognize that failure
  • 00:34:27.290 --> 00:34:29.220
  • in the world as a call from God.
  • 00:34:33.000 --> 00:34:36.000
  • Go into ministry if there's
  • 00:34:36.000 --> 00:34:38.090
  • a genuine call.
  • 00:34:38.090 --> 00:34:40.060
  • I mean, he called you.
  • 00:34:43.090 --> 00:34:46.090
  • Go into ministry when there's
  • 00:34:46.090 --> 00:34:48.100
  • a conviction in your heart
  • 00:34:48.120 --> 00:34:51.120
  • that, "For no other purpose
  • 00:34:51.120 --> 00:34:53.000
  • in life I'm born.
  • 00:34:53.060 --> 00:34:56.060
  • I've been gifted.
  • 00:34:56.060 --> 00:34:57.240
  • God is invested in me.
  • 00:34:57.240 --> 00:34:59.270
  • My personality, my psyche,
  • 00:34:59.270 --> 00:35:01.260
  • everything about me is
  • 00:35:01.260 --> 00:35:03.240
  • a total package that God
  • 00:35:03.240 --> 00:35:06.010
  • is now summoning
  • 00:35:06.010 --> 00:35:07.090
  • for a divine vocation because he
  • 00:35:07.270 --> 00:35:10.270
  • wants to use me to take somebody
  • 00:35:10.270 --> 00:35:13.240
  • out of darkness and bring them
  • 00:35:13.240 --> 00:35:16.040
  • into the light of Jesus Christ."
  • 00:35:19.210 --> 00:35:22.210
  • Don't go into ministry
  • 00:35:22.210 --> 00:35:24.190
  • if you are afraid of people.
  • 00:35:24.260 --> 00:35:27.260
  • Because if you're afraid
  • 00:35:27.260 --> 00:35:28.220
  • of them, you can't lead them.
  • 00:35:30.250 --> 00:35:33.250
  • Be called.
  • 00:35:33.250 --> 00:35:36.180
  • Be strong.
  • 00:35:36.180 --> 00:35:39.000
  • Be courageous.
  • 00:35:39.000 --> 00:35:41.060
  • Be real.
  • 00:35:41.060 --> 00:35:43.070
  • And understand that it takes
  • 00:35:43.070 --> 00:35:46.030
  • both rapport and detachment
  • 00:35:46.280 --> 00:35:49.280
  • in order to be
  • 00:35:49.280 --> 00:35:51.180
  • an effective leader.
  • 00:35:52.070 --> 00:35:55.070
  • I pray that this has blessed you
  • 00:35:55.070 --> 00:35:57.130
  • - Niyah Rahmaan: Now, what
  • 00:36:05.180 --> 00:36:06.050
  • would you say to that person
  • 00:36:06.050 --> 00:36:07.020
  • that's, you know, hearing,
  • 00:36:07.020 --> 00:36:08.150
  • you know, the voice of God
  • 00:36:08.150 --> 00:36:09.230
  • saying,
  • 00:36:09.230 --> 00:36:10.080
  • "When are you stepping out?"
  • 00:36:10.080 --> 00:36:11.160
  • - Trevon Gross: Great question.
  • 00:36:11.160 --> 00:36:12.050
  • It's simply this:
  • 00:36:12.050 --> 00:36:14.010
  • delayed obedience
  • 00:36:14.010 --> 00:36:15.120
  • is disobedience.
  • 00:36:15.120 --> 00:36:17.000
  • If you know God is saying it,
  • 00:36:17.000 --> 00:36:19.240
  • - Brian: Well, every year we
  • 00:36:28.120 --> 00:36:29.040
  • are privileged to have delegates
  • 00:36:29.040 --> 00:36:30.200
  • from all around the world attend
  • 00:36:30.200 --> 00:36:32.080
  • Hillsong Conference.
  • 00:36:32.080 --> 00:36:33.290
  • I never take it for granted
  • 00:36:33.290 --> 00:36:35.090
  • that we have people
  • 00:36:35.090 --> 00:36:36.000
  • from so many different
  • 00:36:36.000 --> 00:36:37.000
  • denominations and backgrounds
  • 00:36:37.000 --> 00:36:38.170
  • attend conference, and we know
  • 00:36:38.170 --> 00:36:40.160
  • everyone has their own story
  • 00:36:40.160 --> 00:36:42.110
  • to tell.
  • 00:36:42.110 --> 00:36:43.160
  • Niyah is one of our team
  • 00:36:43.160 --> 00:36:44.260
  • from Hillsong Los Angeles.
  • 00:36:44.260 --> 00:36:46.170
  • She was able to capture
  • 00:36:46.170 --> 00:36:47.190
  • just a few of the stories
  • 00:36:47.190 --> 00:36:49.170
  • - Niyah: We're backstage
  • 00:36:53.000 --> 00:36:53.190
  • at Hillsong Conference, and I'm
  • 00:36:53.190 --> 00:36:55.000
  • joined by Pastor Trevon Gross
  • 00:36:55.000 --> 00:36:57.080
  • from Hope Cathedral
  • 00:36:57.080 --> 00:36:58.200
  • in Jackson, New Jersey.
  • 00:36:58.230 --> 00:37:01.250
  • Is that correct?
  • 00:37:01.250 --> 00:37:02.180
  • Well, welcome.
  • 00:37:02.180 --> 00:37:03.130
  • It's good to have you.
  • 00:37:03.130 --> 00:37:04.140
  • - Trevon: Honored to be here
  • 00:37:04.140 --> 00:37:05.020
  • today.
  • 00:37:05.020 --> 00:37:05.140
  • - Niyah: Wonderful.
  • 00:37:05.140 --> 00:37:05.290
  • Now, tell us
  • 00:37:05.290 --> 00:37:06.200
  • about Hope Cathedral.
  • 00:37:06.200 --> 00:37:08.020
  • - Trevon: Sure, Hope Cathedral,
  • 00:37:08.020 --> 00:37:08.260
  • my wife and I planted
  • 00:37:08.260 --> 00:37:09.220
  • that church
  • 00:37:09.220 --> 00:37:10.120
  • a little over 13 years ago
  • 00:37:10.120 --> 00:37:12.090
  • to be a place where we
  • 00:37:12.090 --> 00:37:13.280
  • would intentionally touch people
  • 00:37:13.280 --> 00:37:15.250
  • with the love of God
  • 00:37:15.250 --> 00:37:17.000
  • so that they would become
  • 00:37:17.000 --> 00:37:17.280
  • fully devoted followers
  • 00:37:17.280 --> 00:37:18.290
  • of Jesus Christ.
  • 00:37:18.290 --> 00:37:19.290
  • - Niyah: Incredible.
  • 00:37:19.290 --> 00:37:20.210
  • Incredible.
  • 00:37:20.210 --> 00:37:21.060
  • Tell us a little bit
  • 00:37:21.060 --> 00:37:21.240
  • about that journey.
  • 00:37:21.240 --> 00:37:22.190
  • - Trevon: Absolutely.
  • 00:37:22.190 --> 00:37:23.080
  • So I was born and raised
  • 00:37:23.080 --> 00:37:24.180
  • in the church.
  • 00:37:24.180 --> 00:37:25.120
  • I was always say,
  • 00:37:25.120 --> 00:37:26.030
  • "I was born on a Thursday,
  • 00:37:26.030 --> 00:37:27.090
  • in church on Sunday,
  • 00:37:27.090 --> 00:37:28.150
  • and I've been in church
  • 00:37:28.150 --> 00:37:29.180
  • my entire life."
  • 00:37:29.180 --> 00:37:31.100
  • And I was in this denomination
  • 00:37:31.100 --> 00:37:32.200
  • my entire life.
  • 00:37:32.200 --> 00:37:33.230
  • And so that's all I ever knew.
  • 00:37:33.230 --> 00:37:35.040
  • All of my friendships
  • 00:37:35.040 --> 00:37:35.250
  • and all of the connections,
  • 00:37:35.250 --> 00:37:36.270
  • and I started to be drawn
  • 00:37:36.270 --> 00:37:38.020
  • in directions
  • 00:37:38.020 --> 00:37:38.290
  • that really didn't please God.
  • 00:37:38.290 --> 00:37:41.040
  • And there were friendships
  • 00:37:41.040 --> 00:37:42.200
  • with other pastors
  • 00:37:42.200 --> 00:37:43.150
  • that were doing things
  • 00:37:43.150 --> 00:37:44.160
  • that I knew weren't pleasing
  • 00:37:44.160 --> 00:37:45.290
  • to God, but they were
  • 00:37:45.290 --> 00:37:46.250
  • the only friends I had.
  • 00:37:46.250 --> 00:37:48.000
  • And I saw myself being drawn
  • 00:37:48.000 --> 00:37:49.220
  • into a life that I knew
  • 00:37:49.220 --> 00:37:51.050
  • would not please God.
  • 00:37:51.050 --> 00:37:52.110
  • And so I had to make
  • 00:37:52.110 --> 00:37:53.090
  • that principle decision,
  • 00:37:53.090 --> 00:37:54.180
  • "Do I stay here and lose my wife
  • 00:37:54.180 --> 00:37:57.010
  • and my son?
  • 00:37:57.010 --> 00:37:58.060
  • Or do I make the decision
  • 00:37:58.060 --> 00:37:59.250
  • to say, 'This is really
  • 00:37:59.250 --> 00:38:01.020
  • the place that isn't for me
  • 00:38:01.020 --> 00:38:03.130
  • right now, and God has
  • 00:38:03.130 --> 00:38:04.160
  • something more for me'?"
  • 00:38:04.160 --> 00:38:05.060
  • And so my wife and I, we prayed
  • 00:38:05.060 --> 00:38:06.080
  • about it, and God opened up
  • 00:38:06.080 --> 00:38:07.170
  • a door for us to transition
  • 00:38:07.170 --> 00:38:10.010
  • to another ministry
  • 00:38:10.010 --> 00:38:11.080
  • where we could serve, and work,
  • 00:38:11.080 --> 00:38:13.180
  • and just provide a fresh start.
  • 00:38:13.180 --> 00:38:16.030
  • - Niyah: Wow.
  • 00:38:16.030 --> 00:38:16.230
  • How hard is that
  • 00:38:16.230 --> 00:38:17.170
  • to kinda, just, even step out
  • 00:38:17.170 --> 00:38:19.100
  • on faith and say, you know,
  • 00:38:19.100 --> 00:38:20.230
  • "I'm gonna move
  • 00:38:20.230 --> 00:38:21.080
  • and press forward"?
  • 00:38:21.080 --> 00:38:22.070
  • - Trevon: Oh, it's difficult.
  • 00:38:22.070 --> 00:38:23.030
  • It is.
  • 00:38:23.030 --> 00:38:23.200
  • And everything within me was
  • 00:38:23.200 --> 00:38:25.000
  • nervous.
  • 00:38:25.000 --> 00:38:25.180
  • I mean, that fear
  • 00:38:25.180 --> 00:38:26.100
  • was gripping me.
  • 00:38:26.100 --> 00:38:27.010
  • And that held me on
  • 00:38:27.010 --> 00:38:28.100
  • probably longer than I
  • 00:38:28.100 --> 00:38:29.240
  • should have because I
  • 00:38:29.240 --> 00:38:30.260
  • just couldn't take that step.
  • 00:38:30.260 --> 00:38:32.180
  • And we knew it was something
  • 00:38:32.180 --> 00:38:33.250
  • that God wanted us to do
  • 00:38:33.250 --> 00:38:34.210
  • that was pleasing to him.
  • 00:38:34.210 --> 00:38:35.230
  • And it hasn't always been easy,
  • 00:38:35.230 --> 00:38:37.280
  • but God has been there with us
  • 00:38:37.280 --> 00:38:39.140
  • and kept us step by step
  • 00:38:39.140 --> 00:38:41.010
  • throughout the process.
  • 00:38:41.010 --> 00:38:42.000
  • - Niyah: Wow.
  • 00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:42.180
  • And now, you started
  • 00:38:42.180 --> 00:38:44.230
  • Hope Cathedral.
  • 00:38:44.230 --> 00:38:45.170
  • What was that like?
  • 00:38:45.170 --> 00:38:47.060
  • Now, you're starting
  • 00:38:47.060 --> 00:38:48.000
  • a brand-new, without the,
  • 00:38:48.000 --> 00:38:50.140
  • you know, kinda, the family
  • 00:38:50.140 --> 00:38:52.020
  • that you kinda knew
  • 00:38:52.020 --> 00:38:53.100
  • from your old church.
  • 00:38:53.100 --> 00:38:54.040
  • What was that like?
  • 00:38:54.040 --> 00:38:55.010
  • - Trevon: It was a challenge.
  • 00:38:55.010 --> 00:38:56.020
  • Now, when I first left
  • 00:38:56.020 --> 00:38:56.290
  • the denomination--so remember,
  • 00:38:56.290 --> 00:38:58.140
  • I've been in church
  • 00:38:58.140 --> 00:38:59.060
  • and I've been in ministry.
  • 00:38:59.060 --> 00:38:59.290
  • I received my call in ministry
  • 00:38:59.290 --> 00:39:01.020
  • at 9 years old.
  • 00:39:01.020 --> 00:39:02.240
  • So I've been in the church
  • 00:39:02.240 --> 00:39:04.040
  • and in the pulpit my whole life.
  • 00:39:04.040 --> 00:39:06.280
  • So that first Sunday that I
  • 00:39:06.280 --> 00:39:08.040
  • woke up and I wasn't a pastor
  • 00:39:08.040 --> 00:39:10.140
  • anymore, that really,
  • 00:39:11.070 --> 00:39:14.070
  • that messed with me.
  • 00:39:14.070 --> 00:39:15.080
  • In fact, I can honestly look
  • 00:39:15.080 --> 00:39:16.070
  • back now and say I went through
  • 00:39:16.070 --> 00:39:17.220
  • about 3 months of depression,
  • 00:39:17.220 --> 00:39:20.000
  • where I didn't even go
  • 00:39:20.000 --> 00:39:20.290
  • to church.
  • 00:39:20.290 --> 00:39:22.020
  • I would get up
  • 00:39:22.020 --> 00:39:22.170
  • on a Sunday morning
  • 00:39:22.170 --> 00:39:23.160
  • and I'd feel lost.
  • 00:39:23.160 --> 00:39:24.180
  • What do you with yourself?
  • 00:39:24.180 --> 00:39:25.290
  • And I--that was
  • 00:39:25.290 --> 00:39:26.180
  • a difficult time, you know?
  • 00:39:26.180 --> 00:39:28.040
  • And thankfully,
  • 00:39:28.040 --> 00:39:28.190
  • my wife gave me grace.
  • 00:39:28.190 --> 00:39:29.160
  • She would take our son
  • 00:39:29.160 --> 00:39:31.060
  • and daughter
  • 00:39:31.060 --> 00:39:31.230
  • and would go ahead and go
  • 00:39:31.230 --> 00:39:34.080
  • to church, and she
  • 00:39:34.080 --> 00:39:35.050
  • wouldn't say a word to me.
  • 00:39:35.050 --> 00:39:36.120
  • She knew I was just, you know,
  • 00:39:36.120 --> 00:39:37.090
  • I needed my space
  • 00:39:37.090 --> 00:39:38.020
  • to work everything out.
  • 00:39:38.020 --> 00:39:39.160
  • And then one Sunday I said,
  • 00:39:39.160 --> 00:39:40.140
  • "Hey," you know,
  • 00:39:40.140 --> 00:39:41.040
  • "where are you going to church?"
  • 00:39:41.040 --> 00:39:42.050
  • And she told me.
  • 00:39:42.050 --> 00:39:42.210
  • And I said,
  • 00:39:42.210 --> 00:39:43.060
  • "I'm going with you."
  • 00:39:43.060 --> 00:39:43.290
  • And that began the process
  • 00:39:43.290 --> 00:39:45.170
  • of coming back.
  • 00:39:45.170 --> 00:39:46.200
  • And then, and here's what
  • 00:39:46.200 --> 00:39:47.140
  • I've found, is that even though
  • 00:39:47.140 --> 00:39:48.240
  • I left the pastorate,
  • 00:39:48.240 --> 00:39:49.280
  • I had never really been
  • 00:39:49.280 --> 00:39:51.010
  • a regular member of a church.
  • 00:39:51.010 --> 00:39:53.120
  • So I went to a church and I
  • 00:39:53.120 --> 00:39:55.170
  • started serving just like I
  • 00:39:55.170 --> 00:39:56.250
  • always preached to everybody
  • 00:39:56.250 --> 00:39:58.010
  • else to serve, you know?
  • 00:39:58.010 --> 00:39:59.140
  • And so I started giving,
  • 00:39:59.140 --> 00:40:00.290
  • and serving, and being there,
  • 00:40:00.290 --> 00:40:02.240
  • and being available.
  • 00:40:02.240 --> 00:40:03.160
  • Not as Pastor Trevon
  • 00:40:03.160 --> 00:40:05.010
  • as Reverend Gross,
  • 00:40:05.010 --> 00:40:06.010
  • but simply as Trevon,
  • 00:40:06.010 --> 00:40:07.260
  • the person who wanted
  • 00:40:07.260 --> 00:40:08.220
  • to please God.
  • 00:40:08.220 --> 00:40:09.120
  • And that was
  • 00:40:09.120 --> 00:40:09.270
  • a wonderful perspective
  • 00:40:09.270 --> 00:40:11.140
  • for our entire family
  • 00:40:11.140 --> 00:40:12.170
  • because my wife and I, we
  • 00:40:12.170 --> 00:40:13.250
  • had been married at that point
  • 00:40:13.250 --> 00:40:14.250
  • probably about 10 years,
  • 00:40:14.250 --> 00:40:17.060
  • but we had never sat together
  • 00:40:17.060 --> 00:40:18.170
  • in church.
  • 00:40:18.170 --> 00:40:20.200
  • Because she was always on
  • 00:40:20.200 --> 00:40:21.130
  • that designated first lady row,
  • 00:40:21.130 --> 00:40:23.200
  • and I was always
  • 00:40:23.200 --> 00:40:24.110
  • in what they call "the pulpit."
  • 00:40:24.110 --> 00:40:26.010
  • And so we hadn't even sat
  • 00:40:26.010 --> 00:40:27.070
  • together in church until we made
  • 00:40:27.070 --> 00:40:30.010
  • this transition.
  • 00:40:30.010 --> 00:40:31.050
  • So we were comfortable.
  • 00:40:31.050 --> 00:40:31.280
  • We were enjoying life.
  • 00:40:31.280 --> 00:40:33.110
  • And then one night, I get
  • 00:40:33.110 --> 00:40:35.290
  • this vision of me standing back
  • 00:40:35.290 --> 00:40:38.120
  • in the pulpit, preaching.
  • 00:40:38.120 --> 00:40:41.020
  • And it sent shockwaves.
  • 00:40:41.020 --> 00:40:43.150
  • Because initially, to me, I'm
  • 00:40:43.150 --> 00:40:45.030
  • like, "God, I'm kind of okay.
  • 00:40:45.030 --> 00:40:47.050
  • I'm okay."
  • 00:40:47.050 --> 00:40:47.280
  • Yeah, I was like, "I like
  • 00:40:47.280 --> 00:40:48.160
  • preaching, and I can probably
  • 00:40:48.160 --> 00:40:49.280
  • still do that on the side when I
  • 00:40:49.280 --> 00:40:50.290
  • feel like it, but I'm actually
  • 00:40:50.290 --> 00:40:52.170
  • kinda likin' this life."
  • 00:40:52.170 --> 00:40:54.130
  • And so I just kinda, you know, I
  • 00:40:54.130 --> 00:40:55.170
  • heard it and I kinda ignored it.
  • 00:40:55.170 --> 00:40:57.170
  • And it kept coming back.
  • 00:40:57.170 --> 00:40:58.210
  • It kept coming back.
  • 00:40:58.210 --> 00:40:59.170
  • It kept coming back.
  • 00:40:59.170 --> 00:41:00.250
  • And so I said, "Well, okay,
  • 00:41:00.250 --> 00:41:01.210
  • well, I gotta process this
  • 00:41:01.210 --> 00:41:02.130
  • with my wife."
  • 00:41:02.130 --> 00:41:03.040
  • So in one of our moments I said,
  • 00:41:03.040 --> 00:41:04.150
  • "Well, honey, what would you
  • 00:41:04.150 --> 00:41:05.270
  • think about me starting
  • 00:41:05.270 --> 00:41:06.250
  • a church?"
  • 00:41:06.250 --> 00:41:08.020
  • And there were two things
  • 00:41:08.020 --> 00:41:09.040
  • that we had kind of said
  • 00:41:09.040 --> 00:41:09.280
  • jokingly that we never wanted
  • 00:41:09.280 --> 00:41:11.150
  • to do.
  • 00:41:11.150 --> 00:41:12.070
  • Number one was start a church,
  • 00:41:12.070 --> 00:41:14.180
  • and number two was live
  • 00:41:14.180 --> 00:41:15.160
  • - Niyah: And God did both.
  • 00:41:18.090 --> 00:41:19.030
  • - Trevon: So here we are,
  • 00:41:19.030 --> 00:41:19.210
  • living in New Jersey.
  • 00:41:19.210 --> 00:41:20.260
  • And now God says,
  • 00:41:20.260 --> 00:41:22.160
  • "Start a church."
  • 00:41:22.160 --> 00:41:24.040
  • - Niyah: Wow.
  • 00:41:24.040 --> 00:41:25.110
  • Wow.
  • 00:41:25.110 --> 00:41:25.260
  • Now, let's rewind.
  • 00:41:25.260 --> 00:41:26.160
  • Let's go back 'cause you said
  • 00:41:26.160 --> 00:41:27.100
  • that God spoke to you and was
  • 00:41:27.100 --> 00:41:28.240
  • just like, "Start a church."
  • 00:41:28.240 --> 00:41:30.070
  • Like, "It's time to step out."
  • 00:41:30.070 --> 00:41:31.120
  • How do I hear God's voice?
  • 00:41:31.120 --> 00:41:32.170
  • What does that sound like?
  • 00:41:32.170 --> 00:41:33.280
  • - Trevon: Sure.
  • 00:41:33.280 --> 00:41:34.130
  • There are two ways God
  • 00:41:34.130 --> 00:41:35.070
  • principally relates to me,
  • 00:41:35.070 --> 00:41:36.260
  • and we call it,
  • 00:41:36.260 --> 00:41:37.210
  • "Heard from God,"
  • 00:41:37.210 --> 00:41:38.220
  • but it's really more
  • 00:41:38.220 --> 00:41:39.130
  • of an impression or a sense.
  • 00:41:39.130 --> 00:41:40.210
  • So one way is through visions
  • 00:41:40.210 --> 00:41:42.000
  • or dreams.
  • 00:41:42.000 --> 00:41:42.210
  • So I will, when I'm sleeping,
  • 00:41:42.210 --> 00:41:44.070
  • the same picture
  • 00:41:44.070 --> 00:41:45.090
  • or the same scene
  • 00:41:45.090 --> 00:41:46.150
  • will just continue to play.
  • 00:41:46.150 --> 00:41:47.250
  • And when I wake up,
  • 00:41:47.250 --> 00:41:48.140
  • it's like I've been there.
  • 00:41:48.140 --> 00:41:50.040
  • But the second way,
  • 00:41:50.040 --> 00:41:51.090
  • which is also important,
  • 00:41:51.090 --> 00:41:52.070
  • is what I call,
  • 00:41:52.070 --> 00:41:53.000
  • "An intrusive thought."
  • 00:41:53.000 --> 00:41:55.040
  • It's just a thought you
  • 00:41:55.040 --> 00:41:55.260
  • just can't shake.
  • 00:41:55.260 --> 00:41:56.240
  • It's not something
  • 00:41:56.240 --> 00:41:57.250
  • you're thinking about.
  • 00:41:57.250 --> 00:41:58.200
  • And so, I was sitting at my desk
  • 00:41:58.200 --> 00:42:00.030
  • and working,
  • 00:42:00.030 --> 00:42:00.260
  • and then this intrusive thought
  • 00:42:00.260 --> 00:42:02.220
  • came, "Start a church."
  • 00:42:02.220 --> 00:42:04.210
  • And I'm like, "Start a--?
  • 00:42:04.210 --> 00:42:06.240
  • That's crazy.
  • 00:42:06.240 --> 00:42:07.160
  • No way."
  • 00:42:07.160 --> 00:42:08.060
  • And it just,
  • 00:42:08.060 --> 00:42:08.220
  • but that intrusive thought
  • 00:42:08.220 --> 00:42:09.190
  • would never leave.
  • 00:42:09.190 --> 00:42:10.230
  • - Niyah: Incredible.
  • 00:42:10.230 --> 00:42:11.090
  • Incredible.
  • 00:42:11.090 --> 00:42:11.240
  • So now, how did you make
  • 00:42:11.240 --> 00:42:13.130
  • that transition?
  • 00:42:13.130 --> 00:42:14.060
  • - Trevon: Honestly, that was
  • 00:42:14.060 --> 00:42:15.220
  • where we did not do a good job.
  • 00:42:15.220 --> 00:42:17.120
  • And here's why.
  • 00:42:17.120 --> 00:42:18.130
  • So God told me to start
  • 00:42:18.130 --> 00:42:19.130
  • the church.
  • 00:42:19.130 --> 00:42:20.010
  • I said, "Okay, God,
  • 00:42:20.010 --> 00:42:20.210
  • I'm gonna get to it," you know?
  • 00:42:20.210 --> 00:42:21.290
  • And oftentimes,
  • 00:42:21.290 --> 00:42:22.140
  • that's what we do, you know?
  • 00:42:22.140 --> 00:42:23.070
  • We, you know,
  • 00:42:23.070 --> 00:42:23.230
  • it's kind of delayed obedience,
  • 00:42:23.230 --> 00:42:25.010
  • you know,
  • 00:42:25.010 --> 00:42:25.160
  • or in-process obedience,
  • 00:42:25.160 --> 00:42:27.170
  • where it's like, you know,
  • 00:42:27.170 --> 00:42:28.100
  • "I intend to obey you,
  • 00:42:28.100 --> 00:42:30.050
  • just not right now."
  • 00:42:30.050 --> 00:42:31.210
  • And that's really what I
  • 00:42:31.210 --> 00:42:32.060
  • was doing.
  • 00:42:32.060 --> 00:42:32.210
  • I was dragging my feet.
  • 00:42:32.210 --> 00:42:33.240
  • And then I had this sense
  • 00:42:33.240 --> 00:42:35.110
  • where God was, you know, saying,
  • 00:42:35.110 --> 00:42:36.170
  • "When are you gonna start?"
  • 00:42:36.170 --> 00:42:37.290
  • And once again,
  • 00:42:37.290 --> 00:42:38.150
  • it was that intrusive thought,
  • 00:42:38.150 --> 00:42:40.100
  • that intrusive thought
  • 00:42:40.100 --> 00:42:41.040
  • that said, "If you don't want
  • 00:42:41.040 --> 00:42:42.160
  • to do it, there's somebody else
  • 00:42:42.160 --> 00:42:44.120
  • who will."
  • 00:42:44.120 --> 00:42:45.070
  • So I said,
  • 00:42:45.070 --> 00:42:45.280
  • "Okay, God, I'm gonna obey you."
  • 00:42:45.280 --> 00:42:47.020
  • So we went out and bought
  • 00:42:47.020 --> 00:42:48.040
  • 20 chairs, put 'em
  • 00:42:48.040 --> 00:42:49.180
  • in our family room.
  • 00:42:49.180 --> 00:42:50.220
  • I bought a podium.
  • 00:42:50.220 --> 00:42:52.000
  • And we didn't know anybody,
  • 00:42:52.000 --> 00:42:53.290
  • 'cause we'd moved
  • 00:42:53.290 --> 00:42:54.140
  • to a new community.
  • 00:42:54.140 --> 00:42:55.070
  • My wife just sent out
  • 00:42:55.070 --> 00:42:56.130
  • some little notes to people
  • 00:42:56.130 --> 00:42:57.160
  • who we saw in karate class,
  • 00:42:57.160 --> 00:42:59.000
  • and teachers at school,
  • 00:42:59.000 --> 00:43:00.220
  • and all that kinda stuff.
  • 00:43:00.220 --> 00:43:01.150
  • So 17 people showed up
  • 00:43:01.150 --> 00:43:03.180
  • that first Sunday
  • 00:43:03.180 --> 00:43:04.200
  • in our family room.
  • 00:43:04.200 --> 00:43:05.220
  • We stayed there
  • 00:43:05.220 --> 00:43:06.190
  • for about a month and a half,
  • 00:43:06.190 --> 00:43:08.000
  • and then we moved
  • 00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:08.150
  • to a local elementary school.
  • 00:43:08.150 --> 00:43:09.270
  • And we were there for 7 years.
  • 00:43:09.270 --> 00:43:11.090
  • And then God blessed us
  • 00:43:11.090 --> 00:43:11.290
  • with our own 10-acre campus,
  • 00:43:11.290 --> 00:43:13.220
  • and we've been there since then.
  • 00:43:13.220 --> 00:43:16.050
  • - Niyah: Wow.
  • 00:43:16.050 --> 00:43:16.200
  • Now, what would you say
  • 00:43:16.200 --> 00:43:17.090
  • to that person that's, you know,
  • 00:43:17.090 --> 00:43:18.200
  • hearing, you know,
  • 00:43:18.200 --> 00:43:19.260
  • the voice of God saying,
  • 00:43:19.260 --> 00:43:20.230
  • "When are you stepping out?
  • 00:43:20.230 --> 00:43:22.150
  • When you are stepping out?"
  • 00:43:22.150 --> 00:43:23.040
  • But you're like,
  • 00:43:23.040 --> 00:43:23.190
  • "Well, God, I'm in the process.
  • 00:43:23.190 --> 00:43:25.000
  • I'm doing it."
  • 00:43:25.000 --> 00:43:25.160
  • You know, kinda like you did.
  • 00:43:25.160 --> 00:43:27.020
  • What would say to them to,
  • 00:43:27.020 --> 00:43:28.070
  • you know what I'm saying,
  • 00:43:28.070 --> 00:43:29.020
  • as far as their tarrying,
  • 00:43:29.020 --> 00:43:30.120
  • their stalling here?
  • 00:43:30.120 --> 00:43:31.080
  • - Trevon: Great question.
  • 00:43:31.080 --> 00:43:31.270
  • It's simply this:
  • 00:43:31.270 --> 00:43:33.230
  • delayed obedience
  • 00:43:33.230 --> 00:43:35.010
  • is disobedience.
  • 00:43:35.010 --> 00:43:37.210
  • If you know God is saying it,
  • 00:43:37.210 --> 00:43:40.130
  • step out and do it.
  • 00:43:40.130 --> 00:43:41.150
  • You won't have all the answers.
  • 00:43:41.150 --> 00:43:42.270
  • And God has been sustaining us,
  • 00:43:42.270 --> 00:43:45.120
  • and God has caused the ministry
  • 00:43:45.120 --> 00:43:46.150
  • to grow and advance.
  • 00:43:46.150 --> 00:43:48.090
  • We've had the challenges,
  • 00:43:48.090 --> 00:43:49.150
  • and we've gone through
  • 00:43:49.150 --> 00:43:50.040
  • the difficult times.
  • 00:43:50.040 --> 00:43:52.010
  • But never once did we
  • 00:43:52.010 --> 00:43:53.130
  • ever question were we
  • 00:43:53.130 --> 00:43:54.150
  • in the will of God.
  • 00:43:54.150 --> 00:43:55.260
  • And that's important because
  • 00:43:55.260 --> 00:43:56.290
  • when you're going through
  • 00:43:56.290 --> 00:43:57.200
  • the difficult moments,
  • 00:43:57.200 --> 00:43:58.240
  • you need to know,
  • 00:43:58.240 --> 00:43:59.220
  • if you don't know anything else,
  • 00:43:59.220 --> 00:44:00.270
  • like who's gonna help you,
  • 00:44:00.270 --> 00:44:01.230
  • or whatever else, when you know,
  • 00:44:01.230 --> 00:44:03.080
  • "At least I'm obeying God,"
  • 00:44:03.080 --> 00:44:04.260
  • then you are assured
  • 00:44:04.260 --> 00:44:06.170
  • that he's going to intervene
  • 00:44:06.170 --> 00:44:07.160
  • somehow.
  • 00:44:07.160 --> 00:44:08.150
  • And sometimes it was
  • 00:44:08.150 --> 00:44:09.030
  • at the last possible moment.
  • 00:44:09.030 --> 00:44:11.150
  • But he comes through.
  • 00:44:11.150 --> 00:44:12.130
  • I have never known him
  • 00:44:12.130 --> 00:44:14.010
  • in all this time to never keep
  • 00:44:14.010 --> 00:44:16.130
  • his Word.
  • 00:44:16.130 --> 00:44:17.190
  • He's always been there for us.
  • 00:44:17.190 --> 00:44:19.180
  • - Niyah: You are incredible.
  • 00:44:19.180 --> 00:44:21.020
  • And I thank you so, so much
  • 00:44:21.020 --> 00:44:22.150
  • for sharing your story.
  • 00:44:22.150 --> 00:44:23.150
  • We can keep going because I have
  • 00:44:23.150 --> 00:44:25.030
  • a lot more questions for you,
  • 00:44:25.030 --> 00:44:26.150
  • but I know for the sake of time.
  • 00:44:26.150 --> 00:44:27.250
  • But thank you so, so much
  • 00:44:27.250 --> 00:44:29.030
  • for sharing your journey
  • 00:44:29.030 --> 00:44:29.280
  • with us.
  • 00:44:29.280 --> 00:44:30.150
  • I was inspired.
  • 00:44:30.150 --> 00:44:31.110
  • I was encouraged.
  • 00:44:31.110 --> 00:44:32.070
  • I know our viewers at home
  • 00:44:32.070 --> 00:44:33.180
  • were inspired and encouraged
  • 00:44:33.180 --> 00:44:35.020
  • as well.
  • 00:44:35.020 --> 00:44:35.280
  • So you guys don't wanna go
  • 00:44:35.280 --> 00:44:36.200
  • anywhere because there are
  • 00:44:36.200 --> 00:44:37.220
  • so many other stories here
  • 00:44:37.220 --> 00:44:39.100
  • at Hillsong Conference,
  • 00:44:39.100 --> 00:44:40.110
  • and it's all happening
  • 00:44:40.110 --> 00:44:41.230
  • right here
  • 00:44:41.230 --> 00:44:42.110
  • - Brian: I believe there is
  • 00:44:47.170 --> 00:44:48.040
  • power in music to lift
  • 00:44:48.040 --> 00:44:49.120
  • people's eyes heavenwards.
  • 00:44:49.120 --> 00:44:51.040
  • A lot of heart and passion
  • 00:44:51.040 --> 00:44:52.190
  • go into the making
  • 00:44:52.190 --> 00:44:53.170
  • of all our albums.
  • 00:44:53.170 --> 00:44:54.250
  • We really wanna see people
  • 00:44:54.250 --> 00:44:55.270
  • like you worship and glorify
  • 00:44:55.270 --> 00:44:57.280
  • Behold the Father's heart
  • 00:45:20.250 --> 00:45:23.250
  • The mystery he lavishes
  • 00:45:24.000 --> 00:45:27.000
  • on us
  • 00:45:27.010 --> 00:45:30.010
  • As deep cries out to deep
  • 00:45:31.230 --> 00:45:34.230
  • Oh, how desperately
  • 00:45:34.230 --> 00:45:36.130
  • he wants us
  • 00:45:40.070 --> 00:45:43.070
  • The things of earth
  • 00:45:43.070 --> 00:45:46.060
  • stand next to him
  • 00:45:46.060 --> 00:45:47.280
  • Like a candle to the sun
  • 00:45:50.240 --> 00:45:53.240
  • Unfailing Father
  • 00:45:56.050 --> 00:45:59.050
  • What compares
  • 00:45:59.050 --> 00:46:00.250
  • to his great love?
  • 00:46:06.000 --> 00:46:09.000
  • Behold his holy Son
  • 00:46:12.150 --> 00:46:15.150
  • The Lion and the Lamb
  • 00:46:15.150 --> 00:46:18.000
  • given to us
  • 00:46:18.270 --> 00:46:21.270
  • The Word became a man
  • 00:46:23.220 --> 00:46:26.220
  • That my soul should know
  • 00:46:26.220 --> 00:46:28.090
  • its Savior
  • 00:46:32.000 --> 00:46:35.000
  • Forsaken for the sake
  • 00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:37.100
  • of all mankind
  • 00:46:37.100 --> 00:46:39.290
  • Salvation is in his blood
  • 00:46:42.190 --> 00:46:45.190
  • Jesus Messiah
  • 00:46:48.050 --> 00:46:51.050
  • The righteous died for love
  • 00:46:55.210 --> 00:46:58.210
  • Oh, it wasn't over
  • 00:47:01.020 --> 00:47:04.020
  • For he is the risen one
  • 00:47:08.210 --> 00:47:11.210
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:47:15.040 --> 00:47:18.040
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:47:21.180 --> 00:47:24.180
  • How great your love is
  • 00:47:28.020 --> 00:47:31.020
  • How great your love is
  • 00:47:33.140 --> 00:47:36.140
  • - Joel Houston: C'mon.
  • 00:47:36.140 --> 00:47:37.240
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:47:41.010 --> 00:47:44.010
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:47:47.190 --> 00:47:50.190
  • How great your love is
  • 00:47:54.010 --> 00:47:57.010
  • How great your love is
  • 00:48:00.210 --> 00:48:03.210
  • Behold, I have a friend
  • 00:48:22.120 --> 00:48:25.120
  • The Spirit breathing
  • 00:48:25.120 --> 00:48:26.270
  • holy fire within
  • 00:48:28.190 --> 00:48:31.190
  • My ever present help
  • 00:48:33.160 --> 00:48:36.160
  • Speaking truth
  • 00:48:36.160 --> 00:48:37.100
  • when I can't find it
  • 00:48:41.130 --> 00:48:44.130
  • Light up this broken heart
  • 00:48:44.130 --> 00:48:47.040
  • And light my way
  • 00:48:47.040 --> 00:48:49.140
  • Until my time on earth
  • 00:48:49.140 --> 00:48:51.030
  • is done
  • 00:48:52.110 --> 00:48:55.110
  • Oh, Holy Spirit
  • 00:48:57.240 --> 00:49:00.260
  • Breathe in me
  • 00:49:00.260 --> 00:49:02.130
  • like kingdom come
  • 00:49:05.150 --> 00:49:08.150
  • Oh, Holy Spirit
  • 00:49:10.270 --> 00:49:13.270
  • Let your work in me
  • 00:49:14.020 --> 00:49:17.020
  • be done
  • 00:49:17.020 --> 00:49:19.060
  • Oh, yeah
  • 00:49:19.060 --> 00:49:21.150
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:49:24.290 --> 00:49:27.290
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:49:31.120 --> 00:49:34.120
  • How great your love is
  • 00:49:37.220 --> 00:49:40.220
  • How great your love is
  • 00:49:44.060 --> 00:49:47.060
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:49:50.240 --> 00:49:53.240
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:49:57.090 --> 00:50:00.090
  • How great your love is
  • 00:50:03.220 --> 00:50:06.220
  • How great your love is
  • 00:50:10.060 --> 00:50:13.060
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:50:16.220 --> 00:50:19.220
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:50:23.050 --> 00:50:26.050
  • How great your love is
  • 00:50:29.170 --> 00:50:32.170
  • How great your love is
  • 00:50:36.010 --> 00:50:39.010
  • Then sings my soul
  • 00:50:41.120 --> 00:50:44.120
  • My God
  • 00:50:44.190 --> 00:50:47.190
  • He who was
  • 00:50:47.190 --> 00:50:49.100
  • and is to come
  • 00:50:50.260 --> 00:50:53.260
  • Prepare the way
  • 00:50:54.020 --> 00:50:57.020
  • Until the work on earth
  • 00:50:57.260 --> 00:51:00.280
  • Watch as the clouds
  • 00:51:06.180 --> 00:51:09.030
  • he rides swing low
  • 00:51:10.130 --> 00:51:13.130
  • Lift up the sound
  • 00:51:13.130 --> 00:51:15.290
  • As he makes our praise
  • 00:51:15.290 --> 00:51:18.150
  • his throne
  • 00:51:19.120 --> 00:51:22.120
  • - Joel: C'mon, lift up
  • 00:51:25.120 --> 00:51:25.290
  • Behold, the Lord our God
  • 00:51:38.250 --> 00:51:41.250
  • - Niyah: Don't miss out
  • 00:51:50.010 --> 00:51:50.160
  • on the opportunity to experience
  • 00:51:50.160 --> 00:51:52.060
  • Hillsong Conference
  • 00:51:52.060 --> 00:51:52.270
  • for yourself.
  • 00:51:52.270 --> 00:51:53.260
  • To find out more
  • 00:51:53.260 --> 00:51:54.210
  • and to register,
  • 00:51:54.210 --> 00:51:55.140
  • and to register,
  • 00:51:55.140 --> 00:51:56.140