Better Together

Become an Agent of Hope | Better Together Episode 1179

July 16, 2026 | S8 E1179 | 50:59

Hope is not found in our circumstances. True and lasting hope can only be found in trusting a sovereign God. When we place our hope in Him, disappointment fades, purpose is revealed, and impact is multiplied. | TBN Prayer Line: 714-731-1000

#Faith #Hope #TrustGod #Heaven #Disappointed #Future #Discouragement #Hopelessness #Despair #Purpose #Testimony #Witness/Witnessing #Community #Bitterness #LaurieCrouch #SheilaWalsh #JackieHillPerry #ToniCollier #LisaWhittle

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Better Together | Become an Agent of Hope | Better Together Episode 1179 | July 16, 2026

Laurie crouch: our hope is actually a person, and when we
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Choose to follow jesus, we accept the call to become an
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Agent of hope in our corner of the world.
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Come on, let's talk about it.
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♪♪♪
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Elyse mahan: today, i wanna talk about hope, 'cause i think hope
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Is, it's very thematic.
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We talk about it a lot.
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But what is it?
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And i wanna make sure we're not confusing it with positive
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Thinking or circumstantial.
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And i think for me growing up in church, i put the two together,
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Faith and hope.
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But then, like, if i think about it, why is the bible got verses
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In it that talk about faith and hope in the same verse if
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They're not different things?
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And i think for me, i'd always attached my hope and my faith
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To circumstances.
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To see god, god did this in the past in this situation, so he
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Can heal you of this again now.
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Because he proved it, he can do it again; as opposed to
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Understanding that hope is one of the attributes and
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Characteristics of who our god is.
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And he is hope, a person of hope.
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And i think for me, in 2023, at the very beginning of 2023, it
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Had been seven years since i got divorced, and i was the girl
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That thought i was getting remarried in a good six months.
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I was like, "i'll grieve, i'll heal.
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But then i'm getting back on the wagon, lord."
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Okay, listen, like, that was my timeline.
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And every year that passed, a little bit of hope was chipped
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Away, i think.
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And i had already a little bit felt like the "almost-girl"
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In life.
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Like, i had almost got stuff.
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I was almost there for the job or the promotion or the ministry
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Invitation or the guy to invite into whatever it was in
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School or--
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I was an almost girl, and so when i was married for almost a
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Year, it just kind of locked in something in my life, and this
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Disappointment started getting infected in my heart.
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But instead of dealing with it healing, i just bandaged it up
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And kept doing ministry.
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Probably bandaged it up with ministry, if i'm honest.
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And so 2023 comes, and i've been dating this guy for a year that,
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Looking back now, was not the guy for me at all.
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And there was a lot of differences, but i think if i'm
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Honest, the little girl in me felt like, "but this'll be good.
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Now this'll be the good thing.
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I can change, i can do this."
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I've told a version of this story before, but when he broke
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Up with me, not an important detail, but just worth
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Mentioning that it was on facetime.
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So i was just--
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Toni collier: no, 'cause what are you doing?
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Elyse: just thought i'd mention it.
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Not important.
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And i remember being as devastated as when i went
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Through my divorce.
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And i remember laying in my bed having a panic attack that night
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And really not being able to catch my breath, and my best
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Friend, who i lived with, she had to literally tell me to
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Count my breathing and it's gonna be okay.
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And i just, it, everything fell apart, and it almost felt like
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That little bit of hope was snuffed out then.
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Lisa whittle: we all go through feelings in our life.
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Sometimes we feel like god is distant.
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We feel like we're farther away from god.
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But the christian life is not a feelings management system.
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It is the reality that we know according to the word of god
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That his presence is with us.
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And so we're going to have those times where we feel like god
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Isn't there, and those are the times that we know that as we
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Draw near to god, he draws near to us.
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Sometimes when we're in those moments, our tendency is to pull
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Away from god, and in reality what we need to do is we need to
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Draw into god because we know that he will then draw to us,
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And remember that his presence is with us.
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So, it's not about how we feel.
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Our feelings are important, but they're not the things that
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Drive our life.
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And so, it may feel right now like things aren't working, but
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Trust the word of god that says that he will be faithful to do
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It and bring good into your life.
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That's scripture, and that's true always.
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Elyse: god starts stirring in me that the seasons are changing,
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That i start thinking, "i think i'm gonna move out
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Of california.
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I think just god's got something new."
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And so we actually decided to close down the ministries that
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We had created together, her and i, and really put ourselves into
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This, like, wilderness season, this waiting season, if you
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Will, of god.
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What do you have next? like, willingly.
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Like, we put our stuff in storage and did not re-sign
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Our lease.
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And i look back on it, i'm like, "wow, we really, we went--"
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Toni: went for it.
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Elyse: we went all in. i don't know--yeah.
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And yet i can look back now and know that god could not bring my
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Next season of so many suddenlies without healing the
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Disappointment that had rotted away at my heart at that point.
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And we've shared on and off camera today that verse that
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Talks about hope deferred makes the heart sick.
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Ironically, it's one of the first verses i committed to
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Memory accidentally as a church kid.
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But it has become a theme in my life of god having to heal
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Deferred hope.
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And i remember my best friend, after a few months of me doing
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Ministry, helping people, but not having any hope, she took me
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Down to huntington beach, and she sat me down and she said,
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"elyse, you have stopped believing god, and it is time to
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Believe again."
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And i got really upset, and then realized that she was correct.
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And we prayed, and we wrote down--and i'm not a
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Big journaler.
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Sometimes it feels like my brain is moving faster than my hand
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Can, and so--but we journaled down what we were believing for,
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And she was believing for family, and i was believing for
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A new season in ministry, and then she told me to stop lying.
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And then i actually wrote down that i still really want
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A family.
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And i wondered if god could do it.
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And she said, "god can do it.
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And i'm gonna preach to you the same message that i heard you
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Preach last weekend.
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But this time it's for you."
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And at the end of that, we prayed, and we stood up, and she
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Made me run around the lifeguard station seven times.
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Toni: right, because that's--we got a storm--
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Elyse: just, it was like a very father abraham kind of moment.
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If you're in kids church and we're singing the songs.
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And it was one of those where we were doing something that felt
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So silly at the time, but i had to shake myself out of what i
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Was going through, and that started a journey for me of
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Clinging again to hope.
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Not to the belief that god was gonna make this situation right
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But that he who is hope would see that it was good again.
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Toni: the truth is, our hope as believers, man, it's hard.
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It's difficult to hope in an unseen god, especially when our
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Seen circumstances are dark, hard, and messy.
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But the truth is it's the mark of a believer to say, "i
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Still believe."
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It's john 11, it's martha rushing up to jesus and saying,
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"if you were here, my brother would not have died."
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And still i know that god will give you whatever you want.
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That is an act of boldness and grit.
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That's real hope.
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Elyse: and i remember during that season, disappointment, it
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Just kept rearing its head up again.
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It just kept coming back.
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It was like this hurdle that kept tripping me up.
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But the really beautiful thing is that i had friends in my
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World that were there in those moments.
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I remember this incredible friend dawn, who actually came
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In through our ministry, and she's a few decades my senior,
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And we just became great friends.
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And her and her husband retired and lived on this boat in orange
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County, and i remember she would take me onto this boat and she
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Would just say, "elyse, you are objectively spectacular.
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And my prayer is that god is bringing you the man that would
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Help you see that too.
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You are objectively spectacular."
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It's become this in-joke.
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We'll text each other, "you are objectively spectacular."
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And i had another friend i went to visit, holly, who's been on
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This show a lot, and she said, "you need to sit down with my
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Friend lisa."
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And i remember sitting down with lisa, who immediately--you know
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Those people that you can tell have just been through life, but
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There is such an attraction about them?
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You're like, you talk--like, you tell the truth, you have such a
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Real relationship with the father, the son, the holy spirit
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That i want more of that.
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She was that woman. she called them the triplets.
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She, everything she did, like, she just had this way of
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Breaking down things that just soar into my soul, and she would
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Text me.
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I was just reading through some of the texts at lunch, and just
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Spoke hope over me and courage into me in that season.
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And i think back on some of these women in my life that, in
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A season where i was wrestling with disappointment and allowing
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God to heal the discouragement and the disappointment of the
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Almosts, the hope became the anchor.
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And all of a sudden, i thought i was, like, looking for a
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Ministry job, honestly, in that season of seeing what god had
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Next, but i was hoping again.
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And i look back now and realize it was the first time in my life
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My hope was no longer connected to a circumstance or a outcome.
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It wasn't, "god, you're gonna bring my husband," and it
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Wasn't, "god, you're gonna open the door to church."
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I wouldn't have been able to articulate it, but it was
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Probably the first time that i was like, "you are hope.
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You are the one that is going to actually do this."
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And it was in the october of that year, about two weeks
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After--you talked early this week about being on the floor in
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Your bedroom just crying, and i had a moment like that, just, i
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Think, of releasing what had been pent up for so long, trying
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To protect the reputation of god, trying to--and really admit
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I'm disappointed.
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It's hard for god to heal something that we won't name.
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And really saying, "i have, i am heartbroken because i feel like
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You have not listened."
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And god to say, "well, i've been needing to heal this first and
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You haven't been willing to come to me with it."
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Jackie hill perry: i think it's definitely safe to tell god we
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Are disappointed.
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That is why i love lamentations.
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That is why i love habakkuk.
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That's, that is why i love, even, the garden of gethsemane.
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He's not expressing disappointment, but he is
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Expressing wanting a different circumstance, right?
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And so, i think it's when we're honest with god in that way that
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He changes our perspectives, because his ways are not our
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Ways, and his thoughts are not our thoughts.
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So there will be experiences that we have that just don't
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Make sense, and i think when we bring those types of things
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Before god, i think is when the holy spirit begins to reorient
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Us, where we see like, "oh, you actually know what
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You're doing."
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And then it's at that point where we just kinda see that
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Like, "no, you are working all things together for my good."
00:11:07.623 --> 00:11:12.895
So, yes, it is definitely safe.
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Elyse: and it was a couple weeks after that that i got introduced
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To tim, who's my husband.
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Moved later on, a few months later, to lakeland, florida;
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Became a mom to two beautiful girls.
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Right after we got married, became their stepmom.
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Now have our son, laker.
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Life did a suddenly after the waiting, and yet hope was the
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Thing right before god had that thing for me that it was, like,
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That last thing that the--and the biggest temptation was to
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Let go of hope.
00:11:44.426 --> 00:11:45.795
And hebrews, 6 verse 19, "this hope [this confident assurance]
00:11:45.795 --> 00:11:51.967
We have as an anchor of the soul [it cannot slip and it cannot
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Break down under whatever pressure bears upon it]
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A safe and steadfast hope that enters within the veil [of the
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Heavenly temple, that most holy place in which the very presence
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Of god dwells]."
00:12:05.214 --> 00:12:07.116
And i'm just reminded today that we often call something hope,
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But maybe what it actually is is it's a circumstance that we want
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God to right in our life.
00:12:16.592 --> 00:12:18.794
And the anchor comes when we're reminded that he is the one that
00:12:18.794 --> 00:12:23.432
Is our hope, and it is, i, even as i'm saying it, i know it is
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So much harder to do than just say, to hold onto the anchor
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That is hope.
00:12:32.341 --> 00:12:33.676
But my story is that the discouragement, the
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Disappointment, the fear of hoping again, that was a thing
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That needed healing, and god used so many women in my life in
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That season to be that hope to point me towards him.
00:12:45.621 --> 00:12:49.525
And so today, i'd just love to spend a few moments talking
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About hope and where you've wrestled with it, where you've
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Had people be it for you and point to him who is it for you.
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What has that looked like for you guys?
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'cause that's a very real wrestle, especially in a very
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Broken world.
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Lisa: when you start talking about hope, i always go to
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Romans 5:5.
00:13:08.544 --> 00:13:10.045
The hope that will not disappoint, hope, him, because
00:13:10.045 --> 00:13:16.151
Things are so utterly disappointing.
00:13:16.151 --> 00:13:18.254
In my life, the hope that has been squashed has come
00:13:18.254 --> 00:13:22.258
Through disappointments.
00:13:22.258 --> 00:13:24.260
And then i'm even reading in verse 6, "when we were utterly
00:13:24.260 --> 00:13:29.832
Helpless, christ came at just the right time and died for
00:13:29.832 --> 00:13:33.936
Us sinners."
00:13:33.936 --> 00:13:35.771
And in another version, when it talks in romans 5:5, it is, it
00:13:35.771 --> 00:13:41.010
Mentions the word, "the expectation will not
00:13:41.010 --> 00:13:44.213
Disappoint us."
00:13:44.213 --> 00:13:45.581
And i think that's what it is, right?
00:13:45.581 --> 00:13:47.416
It is the hope that will not disappoint, jesus, meets
00:13:47.416 --> 00:13:51.654
Our expectations.
00:13:51.654 --> 00:13:53.289
And what else in this world do we have expectation in that is
00:13:53.289 --> 00:13:57.693
Not in, at some level disappointing, you know?
00:13:57.693 --> 00:14:01.363
And so for me, that's where i always go.
00:14:01.363 --> 00:14:04.433
"the hope that will not disappoint," romans 5:5.
00:14:04.433 --> 00:14:06.402
The hope that will not disappoint always brings me back
00:14:06.402 --> 00:14:09.204
To jesus.
00:14:09.204 --> 00:14:11.473
Lisa: i love the fact that every day has new mercies and the lord
00:14:11.473 --> 00:14:17.212
Wants us to bring our hearts to him and tell him what we
00:14:17.212 --> 00:14:20.849
Are desiring.
00:14:20.849 --> 00:14:22.184
I think it's good to hope for things that we want and that we
00:14:22.184 --> 00:14:25.321
Desire, and we pray that the lord would bring those to us.
00:14:25.321 --> 00:14:30.426
I don't think we should be afraid of that.
00:14:30.426 --> 00:14:32.094
I don't think we should feel like that those things are too
00:14:32.094 --> 00:14:36.165
Small, too silly, that god doesn't care about them.
00:14:36.165 --> 00:14:39.935
Anyone who would bottle our tears, count the numbers of
00:14:39.935 --> 00:14:42.771
Hairs on our head, bends down to listen when we pray is very
00:14:42.771 --> 00:14:48.444
Interested in the things that we're hopeful for.
00:14:48.444 --> 00:14:51.947
Sheila walsh: connect with us on social media and share your
00:14:51.947 --> 00:14:54.216
Favorite moments from today.
00:14:54.216 --> 00:14:55.684
Toni: we can't wait for you to join us.
00:14:55.684 --> 00:14:58.654
Laurie: let's keep the conversation going.
00:14:58.654 --> 00:15:00.889
You can find the "better together" podcast on your
00:15:00.889 --> 00:15:03.192
Favorite listening platform.
00:15:03.192 --> 00:15:04.994
Subscribe today.
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00:15:09.007 --> 00:15:09.432
♪♪♪
00:15:09.733 --> 00:15:17.140
Toni: i think one of the ways for us to become more aware
00:15:17.140 --> 00:15:19.709
About the people around us who really are looking for hope is
00:15:19.709 --> 00:15:22.879
For us to understand that we are not the only people struggling.
00:15:22.879 --> 00:15:25.815
I mean, sometimes we just are sitting in our pain, wallowing
00:15:25.815 --> 00:15:28.885
In the things that have hurt us, the people that have betrayed
00:15:28.885 --> 00:15:31.755
Us, that we just forget to look up and around.
00:15:31.755 --> 00:15:34.524
And the truth is, for many of us, our pain is not worth it at
00:15:34.524 --> 00:15:37.660
All, okay?
00:15:37.660 --> 00:15:38.995
Maybe even for all of us, but it's also not wasted.
00:15:38.995 --> 00:15:41.731
And when we decide to assign purpose and meaning to our pain,
00:15:41.731 --> 00:15:45.735
It actually helps us heal more.
00:15:45.735 --> 00:15:47.504
So look around, spread around some hope, and help someone else
00:15:47.504 --> 00:15:50.373
In the middle of their pain too.
00:15:50.373 --> 00:15:54.844
Lisa: i think for me in my life, hope has been heavily tied to
00:15:56.012 --> 00:16:01.151
Someone calling out my potential, which is a little
00:16:01.151 --> 00:16:03.486
Bit different.
00:16:03.486 --> 00:16:04.854
But i think for me, that racked, as a young woman with
00:16:04.854 --> 00:16:07.891
Insecurities, never quite feeling like the giftings that
00:16:07.891 --> 00:16:11.694
God had given me or a personality that i couldn't
00:16:11.694 --> 00:16:15.065
Quite understand, which was really different from my mother,
00:16:15.065 --> 00:16:17.634
Who was, like, this sort of quintessential, perfect, quiet,
00:16:17.634 --> 00:16:25.208
Beautiful woman that i looked up to but i knew i could never be.
00:16:25.208 --> 00:16:30.413
'cause i had all this, like, fire inside of me.
00:16:30.413 --> 00:16:33.716
And that was really inconvenient.
00:16:33.716 --> 00:16:35.552
When you were growing up in the church in, like, the '70s and
00:16:35.552 --> 00:16:38.688
'80s that--be anything except for be fiery, right, as a woman.
00:16:38.688 --> 00:16:42.292
And i'm like, "god, why did you make me like this?
00:16:42.292 --> 00:16:44.661
I don't understand myself at all."
00:16:44.661 --> 00:16:46.796
And so i wanted to serve jesus, i loved jesus, but i didn't
00:16:46.796 --> 00:16:50.967
Understand me.
00:16:50.967 --> 00:16:52.535
And so i didn't have the hope that i could be used for the
00:16:52.535 --> 00:16:56.739
Kingdom of god.
00:16:56.739 --> 00:16:58.208
And so i think for me, hope has been tied to someone saying, "i
00:16:58.208 --> 00:17:03.947
See something in you that is worthy of the kingdom of god.
00:17:03.947 --> 00:17:08.685
I see something in you that has merit, and it's tied to the one
00:17:08.685 --> 00:17:12.655
Who created you, gifted you, and has purpose for your life."
00:17:12.655 --> 00:17:17.560
Because hope is very tied to purpose, hugely tied to purpose.
00:17:17.560 --> 00:17:22.265
If you are purposeless, you have no hope in your life.
00:17:22.265 --> 00:17:26.402
And so, i think a huge message for anyone listening is your
00:17:26.402 --> 00:17:31.474
Hope comes from christ, who died for you and gave you
00:17:31.474 --> 00:17:35.478
Great purpose.
00:17:35.478 --> 00:17:37.280
No matter what people have called you, or how you felt
00:17:37.280 --> 00:17:39.849
Tagged, or what circumstances have happened to you, the hope
00:17:39.849 --> 00:17:43.353
Who will not disappoint has called you and gifted you, and
00:17:43.353 --> 00:17:47.524
You are created imago dei, in the image of god.
00:17:47.524 --> 00:17:50.093
That's true for every human being.
00:17:50.093 --> 00:17:52.362
And so that's been really important for me in my life is
00:17:52.362 --> 00:17:54.564
Someone who has said, "i see something in you," even when
00:17:54.564 --> 00:17:57.667
Other people have maybe not given me that same, you know,
00:17:57.667 --> 00:18:01.671
That same sort of definition, right?
00:18:01.671 --> 00:18:05.408
Toni: hope being tied to purpose, really, for me is the
00:18:05.408 --> 00:18:08.311
Great commission.
00:18:08.311 --> 00:18:09.646
It's that my purpose is to spread the gospel to the ends of
00:18:09.646 --> 00:18:11.881
The earth, to make disciples after jesus.
00:18:11.881 --> 00:18:14.918
And so when i think about this idea of my hope and my grit and
00:18:14.918 --> 00:18:18.555
My perseverance being tied to my purpose, i think about the
00:18:18.555 --> 00:18:22.325
All-out grin the lord must have knowing that my purpose is not
00:18:22.325 --> 00:18:26.663
To have instagram followers or likes and comments, but it's to
00:18:26.663 --> 00:18:30.099
Make him known.
00:18:30.099 --> 00:18:31.601
That is really hopeful.
00:18:31.601 --> 00:18:34.537
Sheila: when you read that hope will not disappoint, it makes
00:18:34.537 --> 00:18:37.674
Me, it's like i wish i could sit down with paul at that moment
00:18:37.674 --> 00:18:40.944
And talk about--because then, and he'll also write somewhere
00:18:40.944 --> 00:18:43.479
Else "these light and momentary troubles."
00:18:43.479 --> 00:18:47.116
And i remember reading that one morning when my friend, one of
00:18:47.116 --> 00:18:49.652
My friends had just told me her cancer was back again.
00:18:49.652 --> 00:18:53.223
Something else had happened to somebody else, and i'm like,
00:18:53.223 --> 00:18:54.991
"lord, these are not light and momentary troubles."
00:18:54.991 --> 00:18:58.995
So why would paul say that?
00:18:58.995 --> 00:19:00.897
We're told that paul was taken to the third heaven, which is,
00:19:00.897 --> 00:19:04.734
We know that's where jesus is right now.
00:19:04.734 --> 00:19:06.569
Those who died in christ are there.
00:19:06.569 --> 00:19:08.838
And he saw things and heard things he was not allowed to
00:19:08.838 --> 00:19:11.941
Talk about.
00:19:11.941 --> 00:19:13.309
It was too spectacular.
00:19:13.309 --> 00:19:15.044
And so, i think when he's writing letters later on, it's
00:19:15.044 --> 00:19:19.048
Like, "listen, honestly, if you guys had a clue, if you even had
00:19:19.048 --> 00:19:23.686
One second of a view of what is waiting for you, this hope will
00:19:23.686 --> 00:19:30.326
Not disappoint," because he got to see something that was
00:19:30.326 --> 00:19:34.764
So spectacular.
00:19:34.764 --> 00:19:36.165
There were no words for it.
00:19:36.165 --> 00:19:37.767
So for me, there's something about an eternal perspective.
00:19:37.767 --> 00:19:41.371
I used to think, i wanted things to work out on this earth here,
00:19:41.371 --> 00:19:46.075
Life here because i felt like--i remember when i was a teenager
00:19:46.075 --> 00:19:49.979
Saying to my mom, "look, i know it's not likely, but if i die
00:19:49.979 --> 00:19:53.349
Before you, would you bury me with some books?
00:19:53.349 --> 00:19:55.685
Because i don't wanna be bored."
00:19:55.685 --> 00:19:57.320
'cause i thought, you know--
00:19:57.320 --> 00:19:58.688
Elyse: wow.
00:19:58.688 --> 00:20:00.023
Sheila: well, i'm thinking what am i gonna read, you know, when
00:20:00.023 --> 00:20:01.624
I'm out there.
00:20:01.624 --> 00:20:02.959
But i think when you have this perspective of, because
00:20:02.959 --> 00:20:06.129
Everything in life is intrinsically disappointing.
00:20:06.129 --> 00:20:08.998
You're thinking, "if i just had that house," and you get the
00:20:08.998 --> 00:20:11.134
House, you know.
00:20:11.134 --> 00:20:12.468
If i were just married, if it was just this, if it was
00:20:12.468 --> 00:20:14.470
Just that.
00:20:14.470 --> 00:20:15.805
Nothing's quite--but i have learned, oh, to steward that
00:20:15.805 --> 00:20:19.375
Longing because it's holy space.
00:20:19.375 --> 00:20:23.046
You know, it's like this is a promise of what god already has
00:20:23.046 --> 00:20:27.016
For us.
00:20:27.016 --> 00:20:28.384
That, and some people might not get to see all of it on
00:20:28.384 --> 00:20:30.853
This earth.
00:20:30.853 --> 00:20:32.221
But we have this eternal hope that won't disappoint.
00:20:32.221 --> 00:20:35.191
The artists will paint with colors they've never
00:20:35.191 --> 00:20:36.993
Seen before.
00:20:36.993 --> 00:20:38.361
And musicians will write songs with notes that came from, that
00:20:38.361 --> 00:20:41.030
We've no idea where they came from.
00:20:41.030 --> 00:20:43.266
That i just think, and it's probably 'cause i'm older than
00:20:43.266 --> 00:20:46.402
Most of you, too, but there's something about
00:20:46.402 --> 00:20:49.772
This understanding.
00:20:49.772 --> 00:20:51.307
I'm claustrophobic, and so i don't like mris or cat scans or
00:20:51.307 --> 00:20:54.544
Whatever it is where you go in a big tube, like you're--
00:20:54.544 --> 00:20:56.746
Elyse: i don't know anyone that loves them, to be fair.
00:20:56.746 --> 00:20:59.215
Sheila: yeah, no, that's true, but it makes me panic just a
00:20:59.215 --> 00:21:01.718
Wee bit.
00:21:01.718 --> 00:21:03.086
And i'm in that and the guy said, "here's your panic button,
00:21:03.086 --> 00:21:06.422
'cause you'll be in there by your, you know, by yourself.
00:21:06.422 --> 00:21:08.491
I'll be in the other room."
00:21:08.491 --> 00:21:09.826
And the minute he said that, i thought, "no, i won't.
00:21:09.826 --> 00:21:11.661
I will not be in there by myself."
00:21:11.661 --> 00:21:13.396
This understanding of there is nowhere in my life i've ever
00:21:13.396 --> 00:21:17.333
Gone, whether it was a psychiatric hospital, a
00:21:17.333 --> 00:21:20.503
Bankruptcy court, anywhere where i've ever gone where jesus has
00:21:20.503 --> 00:21:24.874
Not been there.
00:21:24.874 --> 00:21:26.376
And yet, and the hope is, oh, gosh, you think this is great?
00:21:26.376 --> 00:21:29.946
Just wait.
00:21:29.946 --> 00:21:31.280
You haven't even begun to see what i'm gonna do.
00:21:31.280 --> 00:21:35.451
Toni: i think the only way for us to walk in eternal hope that
00:21:35.451 --> 00:21:39.088
Doesn't disappoint is for us to know that our hope does not come
00:21:39.088 --> 00:21:42.792
Or grow in the context of this world.
00:21:42.792 --> 00:21:46.262
It is a heavenly hope.
00:21:46.262 --> 00:21:48.064
It is a hope for the future.
00:21:48.064 --> 00:21:49.399
It's a hope that absolutely says, "this life is not my
00:21:49.399 --> 00:21:53.236
Finishing place.
00:21:53.236 --> 00:21:54.604
It's just my holding place."
00:21:54.604 --> 00:21:55.938
And i think the only way for us to really, fully understand that
00:21:55.938 --> 00:21:59.075
Is to wake up with heaven in mind every single day.
00:21:59.075 --> 00:22:02.979
Elyse: i remember when you, like, the first time i ever
00:22:02.979 --> 00:22:05.248
Heard it was when we were filming this, which goes back to
00:22:05.248 --> 00:22:07.717
My point of, like, the reason i come here is to learn.
00:22:07.717 --> 00:22:10.720
And you're talking about psalm 23, and, "for you are with me,"
00:22:10.720 --> 00:22:15.258
That in the original was you, me...
00:22:15.258 --> 00:22:19.095
There's no separation.
00:22:19.095 --> 00:22:20.663
Sheila: in the hebrew, the, those extra words were for--and
00:22:20.663 --> 00:22:22.799
So they made sense as english, you are with me.
00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:25.067
In the original hebrew, it's "i will not fear for you, me."
00:22:25.067 --> 00:22:29.705
Can't get a thread between us.
00:22:29.705 --> 00:22:31.674
Elyse: beautiful.
00:22:31.674 --> 00:22:33.009
Toni: i've been sitting here just, like, processing hope.
00:22:33.009 --> 00:22:35.845
Hope has just been a really tricky thing for me in
00:22:35.845 --> 00:22:38.748
This season.
00:22:38.748 --> 00:22:40.650
I've been wrestling with these questions around, but what is
00:22:40.650 --> 00:22:45.121
It in?
00:22:45.121 --> 00:22:46.456
Like, what am i hoping for?
00:22:46.456 --> 00:22:47.824
Am i really, is it okay for me to hope for peace in this
00:22:47.824 --> 00:22:54.163
Lifetime, knowing that we live in a broken world and that i'm
00:22:54.163 --> 00:22:59.168
Not promised actually perfection?
00:22:59.168 --> 00:23:01.871
I really am just only promised presence with god and that he
00:23:01.871 --> 00:23:05.741
Would be in with me in the imperfection.
00:23:05.741 --> 00:23:08.945
And so then i go down this, like, spiral of, like, yeah, but
00:23:08.945 --> 00:23:13.149
Where does the hope come in?
00:23:13.149 --> 00:23:15.351
And psalm 62 makes it clear to all of us, and maybe even more
00:23:15.351 --> 00:23:19.388
Clear to me right now as i've been processing hope, that,
00:23:19.388 --> 00:23:22.458
Like, our hope just has to only be in the lord, like, in his
00:23:22.458 --> 00:23:27.864
Goodness in the in between, in his goodness in the waiting, in
00:23:27.864 --> 00:23:31.667
His goodness in the disease in my body.
00:23:31.667 --> 00:23:34.670
And i don't wanna sound apathetic or like a debbie
00:23:34.670 --> 00:23:38.908
Downer that, like, we can't hope in the things of this world, but
00:23:38.908 --> 00:23:42.111
I actually think that's what we're saying.
00:23:42.111 --> 00:23:44.313
There, it, there's just so much disappointment here.
00:23:44.313 --> 00:23:47.450
There's so much fault and imperfection and anger, and
00:23:47.450 --> 00:23:51.888
Just--i mean, we could just list all the things going on in this
00:23:51.888 --> 00:23:54.423
World that i think i may be weary about putting my hope in
00:23:54.423 --> 00:24:00.563
The things of this world.
00:24:00.563 --> 00:24:02.365
And i think it has tainted my hope in jesus, because the same
00:24:02.365 --> 00:24:08.304
Brain and emotions and heart that i use to hope in humanity
00:24:08.304 --> 00:24:13.509
Is quite--i don't change, but i've, i think i've misaligned
00:24:13.509 --> 00:24:20.049
The hope.
00:24:20.049 --> 00:24:21.384
And it's tainted it.
00:24:21.384 --> 00:24:22.752
And i think it's easy for us to do that.
00:24:22.752 --> 00:24:25.054
Where we're like, "well, i hoped that my dad would come back into
00:24:25.054 --> 00:24:28.658
The picture, so now i can't hope that god's gonna actually show
00:24:28.658 --> 00:24:31.794
Up for me as my heavenly father."
00:24:31.794 --> 00:24:33.729
Like, i hoped that my husband would've been faithful and
00:24:33.729 --> 00:24:36.098
Committed to me.
00:24:36.098 --> 00:24:37.466
So now i can't really hope that god's gonna be committed to me.
00:24:37.466 --> 00:24:41.037
And i think what i'm not saying is that we shouldn't hope or we
00:24:41.037 --> 00:24:46.776
Shouldn't lose hope that god's going to give us freedom and
00:24:46.776 --> 00:24:50.613
Peace in this lifetime.
00:24:50.613 --> 00:24:52.081
But that if we're not careful, if we put too much stock in
00:24:52.081 --> 00:24:55.084
That, we will actually start to lose hope in the god that
00:24:55.084 --> 00:24:59.755
Created it all.
00:24:59.755 --> 00:25:01.424
And i'm just kinda wrestling through that with myself.
00:25:01.424 --> 00:25:05.027
Sheila: hope's an interesting thing.
00:25:05.027 --> 00:25:06.963
You know, it depends, it really--its weight is only in
00:25:06.963 --> 00:25:09.465
What it's placed in.
00:25:09.465 --> 00:25:11.133
You know, i could say, "well, i hope it won't rain next
00:25:11.133 --> 00:25:14.236
Saturday," but i've got no control over that.
00:25:14.236 --> 00:25:16.205
Or i remember my son saying, "i'm gonna get this fishing
00:25:16.205 --> 00:25:18.908
Pole, and i guarantee you, mom, i'm gonna catch a fish in
00:25:18.908 --> 00:25:21.310
Ten minutes."
00:25:21.310 --> 00:25:22.678
I'm saying, "well, honey, you could hope for that, but you
00:25:22.678 --> 00:25:24.614
Won't necessarily.
00:25:24.614 --> 00:25:25.982
It might take a little bit longer."
00:25:25.982 --> 00:25:27.416
Christian hope is different.
00:25:27.416 --> 00:25:29.352
When paul says that this hope, and the hope he's talking about
00:25:29.352 --> 00:25:32.722
Is jesus, our hope, is that this hope will not disappoint.
00:25:32.722 --> 00:25:38.327
And that's the thing that i think is no matter what is going
00:25:38.327 --> 00:25:40.663
On in your life, you could be in the best days of your life at
00:25:40.663 --> 00:25:43.032
The moment or you could be in the most challenging days of
00:25:43.032 --> 00:25:45.735
Your life, but i want you to know hope has a name, and his
00:25:45.735 --> 00:25:50.172
Name is jesus.
00:25:50.172 --> 00:25:52.408
Jackie: i think there's this, like, wrestle with hoping, but
00:25:52.408 --> 00:25:57.847
Not hoping in things that aren't actually promised, right?
00:25:57.847 --> 00:26:02.652
And so it's like even with abraham, he hoped against hope
00:26:02.652 --> 00:26:07.056
In what god said.
00:26:07.056 --> 00:26:09.158
And so i think people having a hold on the promises of god in
00:26:09.158 --> 00:26:14.230
The scriptures is something that you can always bank on.
00:26:14.230 --> 00:26:18.334
So if you hope that the marriage will work, you should hope.
00:26:18.334 --> 00:26:22.004
Like, god is able to raise the dead.
00:26:22.004 --> 00:26:24.774
He is able to, you know, speak to these dry bones.
00:26:24.774 --> 00:26:27.610
But even if it doesn't happen, goodness and mercy will follow
00:26:27.610 --> 00:26:31.347
Me, right?
00:26:31.347 --> 00:26:32.715
That's a hope i can have.
00:26:32.715 --> 00:26:34.050
I even started processing this subject a couple years ago
00:26:34.050 --> 00:26:37.687
'cause i just realized how hopeless i can be.
00:26:37.687 --> 00:26:40.489
I think when you deal with depression you realize that at
00:26:40.489 --> 00:26:44.093
Its core is a hopelessness, it's a despair.
00:26:44.093 --> 00:26:46.295
It's things won't change, so why am i happy?
00:26:46.295 --> 00:26:49.732
You know, or why am i joyful?
00:26:49.732 --> 00:26:51.534
And i was thinking about the verse in hebrews where it says,
00:26:51.534 --> 00:26:54.503
"encourage one another every day while today is still today, so
00:26:54.503 --> 00:26:57.740
You will not be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin."
00:26:57.740 --> 00:27:00.476
And i was seeing that discouragement was actually
00:27:00.476 --> 00:27:02.545
Costing me holiness.
00:27:02.545 --> 00:27:04.213
That it was actually a threat to my life with god.
00:27:04.213 --> 00:27:08.484
So i did this study about hope, and i preached a message on it,
00:27:08.484 --> 00:27:12.221
And it was fascinating to see the connection between hope
00:27:12.221 --> 00:27:15.091
And imagination.
00:27:15.091 --> 00:27:16.726
And that kinda developed when i was watching this netflix
00:27:16.726 --> 00:27:20.162
Documentary, and it was about this guy named henry molaison,
00:27:20.162 --> 00:27:24.734
Who, like, in the '30s or something, he did this, like,
00:27:24.734 --> 00:27:27.536
Surgery to fix his epilepsy.
00:27:27.536 --> 00:27:30.406
And the surgery basically didn't go well, and they affected a
00:27:30.406 --> 00:27:34.944
Part of his brain that dealt with--was it short-term memory
00:27:34.944 --> 00:27:38.314
Or long-term?
00:27:38.314 --> 00:27:39.648
Memory, whatever it was.
00:27:39.648 --> 00:27:40.983
And so they were running all these tests, and they was like,
00:27:40.983 --> 00:27:42.785
"henry, hey, like, what'd you do yesterday?"
00:27:42.785 --> 00:27:45.888
And he was like, "i don't know."
00:27:45.888 --> 00:27:47.723
And then they were like, "what are you gonna do tomorrow?"
00:27:47.723 --> 00:27:49.759
And he was like, "i don't know."
00:27:49.759 --> 00:27:51.927
And the reason he didn't have a conception of what he would do
00:27:51.927 --> 00:27:55.397
Tomorrow is because he could not remember what he did yesterday.
00:27:55.397 --> 00:27:58.934
And it was the concept of memory that would actually give him
00:27:58.934 --> 00:28:02.505
Imagination for what his calendar could become.
00:28:02.505 --> 00:28:05.775
And so i've just started to reflect on how much hope has to
00:28:05.775 --> 00:28:09.445
Involve not just my orientation towards the future, but me
00:28:09.445 --> 00:28:13.549
Actually considering god in the past.
00:28:13.549 --> 00:28:15.384
Not in my--not just in my life, but with david's life, with
00:28:15.384 --> 00:28:18.254
Christ's life, with paul's life, and my mama's life.
00:28:18.254 --> 00:28:21.524
And i think it's that consideration that then stirs up
00:28:21.524 --> 00:28:24.093
Hope in the lord.
00:28:24.093 --> 00:28:25.961
Lisa: that's deep, and also that makes me--that is.
00:28:25.961 --> 00:28:29.165
That also makes me think about, like, how you have to have hope
00:28:29.165 --> 00:28:33.269
In order to dream for your future.
00:28:33.269 --> 00:28:37.106
You know, i watched my father whenever, like, he was at a low
00:28:37.106 --> 00:28:40.476
Point in his life, he stopped dreaming.
00:28:40.476 --> 00:28:42.978
But it's really you stop hoping for what you can be.
00:28:42.978 --> 00:28:46.749
And then it also led me to think how much skepticism, too, leads
00:28:46.749 --> 00:28:52.655
Into hope.
00:28:52.655 --> 00:28:53.989
Like, if you carry this sort of, like, deeply skeptical nature--
00:28:53.989 --> 00:29:00.029
Jackie: 'cause it feels protective.
00:29:00.029 --> 00:29:01.363
Lisa: yeah, does that--how are you addressing maybe, you know,
00:29:01.363 --> 00:29:04.934
What, where you are with hope in your life?
00:29:04.934 --> 00:29:07.236
And i think all of that can be very tied in.
00:29:07.236 --> 00:29:09.572
I was thinking, too, that i recently spoke with a college
00:29:09.572 --> 00:29:13.075
Professor, and she was telling me that this is like the first
00:29:13.075 --> 00:29:19.615
Generation that is growing up feeling like nothing in their
00:29:19.615 --> 00:29:24.286
Life is certain.
00:29:24.286 --> 00:29:26.388
And at first, you know, it just really, it--something really hit
00:29:26.388 --> 00:29:31.026
Me, and i thought, "wow, that is just, that's deep, that's hard."
00:29:31.026 --> 00:29:36.765
And the lord really spoke to me and said, "yeah, but what an
00:29:36.765 --> 00:29:38.968
Opportunity to show this generation that there is nothing
00:29:38.968 --> 00:29:44.773
In life certain but me."
00:29:44.773 --> 00:29:46.709
And i mean, that's really what we're talking about here.
00:29:46.709 --> 00:29:49.411
That there isn't hope in all of those things, but there is hope
00:29:49.411 --> 00:29:54.049
In a person, and it is the opportunity to really speak
00:29:54.049 --> 00:29:57.586
Into that.
00:29:57.586 --> 00:29:58.954
Jackie: and that's the whole point of ecclesiastes.
00:29:58.954 --> 00:30:00.289
It's like, there's a lot of seasons, it's all gonna change.
00:30:00.289 --> 00:30:03.225
It's probably gonna feel terrible, it's gonna be really
00:30:03.225 --> 00:30:04.927
Horrific, but fear the lord.
00:30:04.927 --> 00:30:07.363
It's like, "oh, okay, man."
00:30:07.363 --> 00:30:08.864
Sheila: but that's where hebrews 12 comes in, 'cause i love--and,
00:30:08.864 --> 00:30:12.134
I mean, i'm not a big advocate of the message, but i love the
00:30:12.134 --> 00:30:15.004
Way it's paraphrased in this.
00:30:15.004 --> 00:30:16.372
It says, "keep your eyes on jesus, who both began and
00:30:16.372 --> 00:30:18.974
Finished this race we're in.
00:30:18.974 --> 00:30:20.476
Study how he did it, because he never lost sight of where he was
00:30:20.476 --> 00:30:24.146
Headed, that glorious finish in and with god.
00:30:24.146 --> 00:30:26.782
He could put up with anything along the way: cross, shame, and
00:30:26.782 --> 00:30:30.686
Now is seated there."
00:30:30.686 --> 00:30:32.388
And when you look at the original words there, you know,
00:30:32.388 --> 00:30:34.490
Where he put up with shame, the original meaning is he, he
00:30:34.490 --> 00:30:38.027
Didn't pay much attention to it.
00:30:38.027 --> 00:30:39.695
It's like, "yeah, this is hard, yeah, yeah."
00:30:39.695 --> 00:30:41.530
He didn't pay much attention.
00:30:41.530 --> 00:30:43.499
And when it comes to the cross, it was staying in a place longer
00:30:43.499 --> 00:30:47.069
Than expected.
00:30:47.069 --> 00:30:48.537
And i think how many people find themself there.
00:30:48.537 --> 00:30:51.006
"i thought this would be done by now."
00:30:51.006 --> 00:30:52.942
"i thought we'd be, we would be over by now."
00:30:52.942 --> 00:30:55.177
Jackie: that got me.
00:30:55.177 --> 00:30:56.545
Sheila: "i thought we would be--" no, but you know what
00:30:56.545 --> 00:30:58.013
I mean.
00:30:58.013 --> 00:30:59.348
It's like, it's too long.
00:30:59.348 --> 00:31:00.683
Jackie: that really got me.
00:31:00.683 --> 00:31:02.017
Sheila: it's too long a season.
00:31:02.017 --> 00:31:03.352
But jesus never lost sight of where he was headed.
00:31:03.352 --> 00:31:04.687
Elyse: do you know why?
00:31:04.687 --> 00:31:06.021
Is because that is probably the root of what so many people lose
00:31:06.021 --> 00:31:08.624
Hope for.
00:31:08.624 --> 00:31:09.959
They're in that place longer than they thought.
00:31:09.959 --> 00:31:12.328
Jackie: 'cause people even judge, they judge sarah for her
00:31:12.328 --> 00:31:18.167
Giving hagar to abram, but it's because she's been waiting
00:31:18.167 --> 00:31:22.304
So long.
00:31:22.304 --> 00:31:23.639
So she starts to come up with strategies for how to do what
00:31:23.639 --> 00:31:26.442
God had promised he would do through her own body.
00:31:26.442 --> 00:31:29.945
And i'm like, "oh, we all do that."
00:31:29.945 --> 00:31:31.947
Like, we might not find a hagar, but we find something.
00:31:31.947 --> 00:31:34.783
We start talking to men that the lord hasn't told us to talk to.
00:31:34.783 --> 00:31:37.619
We start, you know, going to jobs that the lord--but all
00:31:37.619 --> 00:31:40.389
Because we're trying to expedite the process, to deal with the
00:31:40.389 --> 00:31:44.093
Pain of waiting on the lord.
00:31:44.093 --> 00:31:46.128
And so when i look at sarah, i don't look at her judgy.
00:31:46.128 --> 00:31:48.530
I'm like, "girl, i get it."
00:31:48.530 --> 00:31:50.132
Toni: i see you, girl.
00:31:50.132 --> 00:31:51.500
Jackie: i understand.
00:31:51.500 --> 00:31:52.835
Toni: okay, listen.
00:31:52.835 --> 00:31:54.203
I think one layer of hopelessness that i've
00:31:54.203 --> 00:31:56.638
Experienced, or the lack of hope actually wasn't hopelessness, i
00:31:56.638 --> 00:32:01.110
Think it was bitterness.
00:32:01.110 --> 00:32:04.813
Jackie: okay, go ahead, go ahead.
00:32:04.813 --> 00:32:06.148
Toni: i am--baby, i'm processing this topic today, in the depths
00:32:06.148 --> 00:32:09.251
Of my soul right now.
00:32:09.251 --> 00:32:10.819
Lisa: she's having a revelation after revelation.
00:32:10.819 --> 00:32:13.822
Toni: so yeah, i think--
00:32:13.822 --> 00:32:16.191
So i'm like, "okay, i want to have hope, deep--" i think we
00:32:16.191 --> 00:32:20.295
All want to have hope.
00:32:20.295 --> 00:32:21.630
We want to actually believe that things can get better.
00:32:21.630 --> 00:32:24.199
And for us as believers, our hope is deeply rooted in christ
00:32:24.199 --> 00:32:27.236
Because we know he has, is redemption in his dna, right?
00:32:27.236 --> 00:32:30.873
And then i think what we do is we process it on a
00:32:30.873 --> 00:32:34.043
Surface level.
00:32:34.043 --> 00:32:35.377
It's like, well, what's the opposite of that?
00:32:35.377 --> 00:32:36.745
Okay, hopelessness.
00:32:36.745 --> 00:32:38.080
It's that i don't believe anymore.
00:32:38.080 --> 00:32:39.448
But i think i've experienced something else, and i think it
00:32:39.448 --> 00:32:41.550
Is bitterness.
00:32:41.550 --> 00:32:42.951
I think it is i don't like where i am at.
00:32:42.951 --> 00:32:48.991
And so i'm not actually, like, giving up on hope; i'm mad.
00:32:48.991 --> 00:32:53.796
I'm actually just mad--
00:32:53.796 --> 00:32:55.397
Jackie: sound like ruth.
00:32:55.397 --> 00:32:56.899
Sheila: i know, change your name to mara.
00:32:56.899 --> 00:32:58.767
Toni: that's--that you didn't give me what i wanted.
00:32:58.767 --> 00:33:02.171
Or you didn't do it in the way that i wanted or the timing that
00:33:02.171 --> 00:33:04.706
I wanted it.
00:33:04.706 --> 00:33:06.375
Sheila: one of the hardest things in life to deal with
00:33:06.375 --> 00:33:08.377
Is bitterness.
00:33:08.377 --> 00:33:09.945
I was walking through an airport the other night and--our flight
00:33:09.945 --> 00:33:13.315
Was delayed for the third time.
00:33:13.315 --> 00:33:15.117
And a lady came up and said, "do you mind if i talk to you?"
00:33:15.117 --> 00:33:17.553
I guess she watches "better together," and i'm like,
00:33:17.553 --> 00:33:19.688
"oh, sure."
00:33:19.688 --> 00:33:21.056
And we talked for a while.
00:33:21.056 --> 00:33:22.424
She told me that her husband had left her, that she had worked
00:33:22.424 --> 00:33:25.794
Hard to put him through medical school, and then he'd gone off
00:33:25.794 --> 00:33:28.363
With a younger woman.
00:33:28.363 --> 00:33:29.798
And i could tell it was so fresh for her.
00:33:29.798 --> 00:33:33.402
And i asked her, "when did that happen?"
00:33:33.402 --> 00:33:35.971
And i discovered it happened over 20 years ago, but she was
00:33:35.971 --> 00:33:40.142
Stuck in this place of feeling bitterness.
00:33:40.142 --> 00:33:43.946
Bitterness is, it's like a root that takes kind of, that plants
00:33:43.946 --> 00:33:47.683
Itself deep down into your heart.
00:33:47.683 --> 00:33:50.018
And it brings sorrow.
00:33:50.018 --> 00:33:52.421
It doesn't bring joy.
00:33:52.421 --> 00:33:53.922
But the amazing thing is do you know you get to tell god the
00:33:53.922 --> 00:33:56.758
Whole truth?
00:33:56.758 --> 00:33:58.093
You get to tell him when you're angry.
00:33:58.093 --> 00:33:59.461
You get to tell him when you're sad.
00:33:59.461 --> 00:34:00.863
If you're feeling bitter, bring it into the presence of
00:34:00.863 --> 00:34:03.365
The lord.
00:34:03.365 --> 00:34:04.733
Let his light shine on it, and let god set you free.
00:34:04.733 --> 00:34:08.370
Toni: i think what we have to maybe be careful with is that
00:34:08.370 --> 00:34:10.606
The enemy will use our lack of gratitude for where we are.
00:34:10.606 --> 00:34:15.611
Like, unfolds into bitterness, and that's what wars
00:34:15.611 --> 00:34:19.581
Against hope.
00:34:19.581 --> 00:34:20.916
Jackie: yes.
00:34:20.916 --> 00:34:22.284
Toni: wait a minute, wait a minute.
00:34:22.284 --> 00:34:23.619
Jackie: you having an epiphany?
00:34:23.619 --> 00:34:24.987
Lisa: i did have an epiphany. we're not grateful.
00:34:24.987 --> 00:34:27.189
Elyse: yeah, yeah.
00:34:27.189 --> 00:34:29.925
We, let's sit here for a second.
00:34:29.925 --> 00:34:31.960
Toni needs a moment.
00:34:31.960 --> 00:34:33.295
Toni: because that's what it is.
00:34:33.295 --> 00:34:35.030
You're not happy.
00:34:35.030 --> 00:34:38.333
Elyse: i got you.
00:34:38.333 --> 00:34:39.668
Toni: with the way god decided to do it.
00:34:39.668 --> 00:34:41.870
And so you've given--you--and what's sad is that it's not that
00:34:41.870 --> 00:34:46.608
You gave up hope in your circumstance.
00:34:46.608 --> 00:34:48.644
You gave up hope in god because he didn't do it the way you
00:34:48.644 --> 00:34:51.847
Wanted him to.
00:34:51.847 --> 00:34:53.282
Elyse: and that lack of gratitude for where you are, or
00:34:53.282 --> 00:34:55.951
Even lack of gratitude for a reason you maybe don't even have
00:34:55.951 --> 00:34:58.020
Words for right now, but the gratitude that god is doing
00:34:58.020 --> 00:35:01.190
Something that he deems sufficient for you or he allows,
00:35:01.190 --> 00:35:06.128
The gratitude for that.
00:35:06.128 --> 00:35:07.729
'cause someone's like, "well, like i have nothing to be
00:35:07.729 --> 00:35:09.698
Grateful for."
00:35:09.698 --> 00:35:11.066
Be grateful that god is, god has allowed this, and so therefore
00:35:11.066 --> 00:35:14.303
Is working in this, which maybe guards us against the criticism,
00:35:14.303 --> 00:35:18.173
The cynicism, because that cynicism that isn't dealt
00:35:18.173 --> 00:35:21.176
With--'cause that's what it was for me.
00:35:21.176 --> 00:35:22.544
It turned to bitterness, which stopped me hoping completely.
00:35:22.544 --> 00:35:26.582
Jackie: there's many answers to this question of how to be
00:35:26.582 --> 00:35:29.751
Thankful in a difficult season, because it's also commanded.
00:35:29.751 --> 00:35:34.156
And i think a part of the answer is what peter says when he says,
00:35:34.156 --> 00:35:38.827
"rejoice when you face various trials, if necessary, for it is
00:35:38.827 --> 00:35:45.667
Proving your faith."
00:35:45.667 --> 00:35:47.169
It is turning your faith into gold.
00:35:47.169 --> 00:35:49.504
And i think that "if necessary" has been making me more thankful
00:35:49.504 --> 00:35:53.342
Because it's made me realize that even the ways i'm being
00:35:53.342 --> 00:35:56.979
Pruned is underneath providence.
00:35:56.979 --> 00:35:59.548
And so if it's necessary and it's happening, it must be for
00:35:59.548 --> 00:36:03.252
My good.
00:36:03.252 --> 00:36:04.620
It has to be for my good.
00:36:04.620 --> 00:36:05.954
And that's a process.
00:36:05.954 --> 00:36:07.322
You gotta feel your feelings and grieve how you grieve, but i
00:36:07.322 --> 00:36:08.924
Think knowing that the lord never sends me pointless trials
00:36:08.924 --> 00:36:13.195
Is something worth being thankful for.
00:36:13.195 --> 00:36:16.031
Toni: it's not even that you didn't have the imagination for
00:36:16.031 --> 00:36:18.367
What you wanted, because you did.
00:36:18.367 --> 00:36:20.902
You suppressed it because he didn't give it to you in the
00:36:20.902 --> 00:36:23.805
Timing that he did, or that he--
00:36:23.805 --> 00:36:26.041
Elyse: because the imagination for it is scary, 'cause what if
00:36:26.041 --> 00:36:28.010
It doesn't happen again?
00:36:28.010 --> 00:36:29.344
Toni: i don't wanna--it's not that i don't have imagination,
00:36:29.344 --> 00:36:31.346
It's that i've turned it off so that i don't get disappointed.
00:36:31.346 --> 00:36:35.651
Jackie: i think it might also be helpful--
00:36:35.651 --> 00:36:38.053
Elyse: jackie, help us.
00:36:38.053 --> 00:36:39.421
Jackie: to define hope.
00:36:39.421 --> 00:36:41.256
Toni: let's maybe.
00:36:41.256 --> 00:36:42.591
Jackie: you know what i'm saying?
00:36:42.591 --> 00:36:43.925
'cause it's, like, it's a word we use, but don't have
00:36:43.925 --> 00:36:45.894
Definition for.
00:36:45.894 --> 00:36:47.229
And hope is basically faith with a future orientation.
00:36:47.229 --> 00:36:52.200
And so it is not faith but hope.
00:36:52.200 --> 00:36:55.170
Hope and faith are not the same, but hope always involves faith.
00:36:55.170 --> 00:36:58.707
And so it's me trusting the lord with my future.
00:36:58.707 --> 00:37:05.514
And that's why i really think we have to get very particular on
00:37:05.514 --> 00:37:09.251
What we are trusting him for.
00:37:09.251 --> 00:37:12.587
Jackie: i suspect that the world's definition of hope is
00:37:12.587 --> 00:37:15.123
Pretty worldly.
00:37:15.123 --> 00:37:16.792
Like, they're probably hoping in a new car, a new boyfriend, a
00:37:16.792 --> 00:37:21.029
Different husband, more money.
00:37:21.029 --> 00:37:23.932
Like, they're hoping in things that aren't eternal, things that
00:37:23.932 --> 00:37:27.135
Won't last.
00:37:27.135 --> 00:37:28.603
I think the christian's hope is rooted in god's glory.
00:37:28.603 --> 00:37:32.274
The christian's hope is rooted in him being glorified.
00:37:32.274 --> 00:37:36.011
The, like, the christian's hope is just altogether different
00:37:36.011 --> 00:37:39.548
Because a christian is altogether different.
00:37:39.548 --> 00:37:42.184
And we are often called to hope in god in seasons that
00:37:42.184 --> 00:37:45.153
Feel hopeless.
00:37:45.153 --> 00:37:46.488
And you know, for abram to have to hope against hope as he
00:37:46.488 --> 00:37:48.990
Considers the deadness of his, like, body and the deadness of
00:37:48.990 --> 00:37:52.894
His wife's womb, like that's not, it doesn't seem to benefit
00:37:52.894 --> 00:37:56.264
Him, so he has to have a hope outside of himself for him to
00:37:56.264 --> 00:37:59.634
Obey and hold onto the promises of god.
00:37:59.634 --> 00:38:01.536
And so our hope is usually located in something very
00:38:01.536 --> 00:38:04.873
Uncomfortable that ends up turning into something
00:38:04.873 --> 00:38:07.609
Very beautiful.
00:38:07.609 --> 00:38:10.112
Laurie: join the conversation on our "better together"
00:38:10.112 --> 00:38:12.347
Youtube channel.
00:38:12.347 --> 00:38:13.715
Subscribe today and never miss a new upload.
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♪♪♪
00:38:18.321 --> 00:38:25.628
Sheila: hope's an interesting thing.
00:38:25.628 --> 00:38:27.130
Hope can kind of come and go away.
00:38:27.130 --> 00:38:28.865
I remember back when i used to go on diets--ha--when i was
00:38:28.865 --> 00:38:32.635
Younger and cared about things like that, and i would think,
00:38:32.635 --> 00:38:35.638
"oh, this one is gonna do it.
00:38:35.638 --> 00:38:36.973
This is gonna be amazing."
00:38:36.973 --> 00:38:38.341
I would join this and i'd eat cabbage soup until i wanted to
00:38:38.341 --> 00:38:40.510
Go and see jesus.
00:38:40.510 --> 00:38:41.844
There'd be lots of things that i'd put temporary hope in and
00:38:41.844 --> 00:38:44.046
They're disappointing.
00:38:44.046 --> 00:38:45.381
What i've discovered, though, is the kind of hope the bible talks
00:38:45.381 --> 00:38:48.084
About is not a thing.
00:38:48.084 --> 00:38:50.820
It's a person, and his name is jesus.
00:38:50.820 --> 00:38:53.489
When you place your hope in jesus, then paul the apostle
00:38:53.489 --> 00:38:57.160
Tells us clearly that hope will not disappoint.
00:38:57.160 --> 00:39:04.167
Jackie: i've been really trying to do due diligence in the last
00:39:05.368 --> 00:39:08.504
Year, and it's the holy spirit, it ain't me, to hope the best in
00:39:08.504 --> 00:39:11.541
God's nature.
00:39:11.541 --> 00:39:14.076
Because i think i have a tendency to be, like, looking at
00:39:14.076 --> 00:39:18.014
The lord like, "you don't really like me like that."
00:39:18.014 --> 00:39:21.083
Or, "i don't think you, like, care.
00:39:21.083 --> 00:39:22.585
Like, you died for me, but i don't think you like me."
00:39:22.585 --> 00:39:25.188
Or, like, you want me to be sanctified, but you don't really
00:39:25.188 --> 00:39:27.824
Want me to have joy.
00:39:27.824 --> 00:39:29.325
And, like, i'm like, oh, no, i think this is demonic.
00:39:29.325 --> 00:39:31.794
This is a part of the original lie, is that satan wants me to
00:39:31.794 --> 00:39:35.665
Think that god's dealings with me are him withholding something
00:39:35.665 --> 00:39:38.634
Good from me.
00:39:38.634 --> 00:39:40.002
But romans 8 is giving, like, no, like, you are for me, so i
00:39:40.002 --> 00:39:43.706
Can always hope in that.
00:39:43.706 --> 00:39:45.808
Toni: yeah, because nature precedes circumstance.
00:39:45.808 --> 00:39:48.211
Jackie: what does that mean?
00:39:48.211 --> 00:39:49.545
Toni: it's like if i have hope in the nature of who you are, no
00:39:49.545 --> 00:39:53.816
Matter what circumstance you create, it--
00:39:53.816 --> 00:39:56.953
Jackie: i have hope.
00:39:56.953 --> 00:39:58.321
Toni: i have hope.
00:39:58.321 --> 00:39:59.655
It's in your nature.
00:39:59.655 --> 00:40:01.023
It's not in the action, the output, the circumstance.
00:40:01.023 --> 00:40:04.327
It's literally in you.
00:40:04.327 --> 00:40:05.795
Jackie: it's rooted in him.
00:40:05.795 --> 00:40:07.363
So if he says, "i will never leave you nor forsake you," that
00:40:07.363 --> 00:40:11.367
Means when everybody leaves, i still have hope.
00:40:11.367 --> 00:40:13.603
Toni: and because i know that i'm actually not alone, even
00:40:13.603 --> 00:40:16.506
Though i physically can't see nobody, i can't touch nobody.
00:40:16.506 --> 00:40:21.511
But his nature says presence is the currency.
00:40:21.511 --> 00:40:25.615
Lisa: in order to have this kind of hope that we're talking
00:40:25.615 --> 00:40:27.750
About, you have to be a believer in jesus christ.
00:40:27.750 --> 00:40:30.486
It's the anchor of this hope.
00:40:30.486 --> 00:40:32.655
Otherwise, we do just have sort of this other--other type of
00:40:32.655 --> 00:40:36.626
Hope, right, where we're floating around going, "i hope
00:40:36.626 --> 00:40:39.328
This happens," which really is, it's kind of just out there
00:40:39.328 --> 00:40:43.599
Floating, you know.
00:40:43.599 --> 00:40:46.202
And there is no anchor.
00:40:46.202 --> 00:40:48.504
But also, it's, you're taking so many chances and you are
00:40:48.504 --> 00:40:53.276
Generally losing in life, really.
00:40:53.276 --> 00:40:55.611
Toni: can i also just challenge this too?
00:40:55.611 --> 00:40:57.613
Like, yeah, you may have said yes to jesus, which is awesome,
00:40:57.613 --> 00:41:01.050
But you have to have relationship too.
00:41:01.050 --> 00:41:04.020
Because the only way to know his nature is to spend time
00:41:04.020 --> 00:41:08.324
With him.
00:41:08.324 --> 00:41:09.692
It's enough to do one thing, but it's not enough when your father
00:41:09.692 --> 00:41:13.729
Dies, when your husband doesn't come.
00:41:13.729 --> 00:41:16.966
When you actually need hope, it's not enough just to say,
00:41:16.966 --> 00:41:21.037
"well, i say yes and i be going to church and stuff."
00:41:21.037 --> 00:41:23.306
No, you better know him.
00:41:23.306 --> 00:41:24.840
You actually better spend time with the savior of the universe
00:41:24.840 --> 00:41:28.177
Because when stuff hits the fan, you need to know his character
00:41:28.177 --> 00:41:31.314
And his nature so well that it does not matter the
00:41:31.314 --> 00:41:34.383
Circumstance, and that does not come in you pretending on sunday
00:41:34.383 --> 00:41:38.421
That you actually spend time with the lord on wednesday.
00:41:38.421 --> 00:41:40.623
It doesn't come that way.
00:41:40.623 --> 00:41:42.224
And so you actually have to sit with him, know him, worship him,
00:41:42.224 --> 00:41:46.028
Desire him, pray with him so that when the circumstance comes
00:41:46.028 --> 00:41:52.201
That challenges your mind towards his nature, you can say,
00:41:52.201 --> 00:41:56.639
"oh, i know him."
00:41:56.639 --> 00:41:58.007
I know him.
00:41:58.007 --> 00:41:59.342
You can't convince me otherwise.
00:41:59.342 --> 00:42:00.710
Enemy flee, james 4:7.
00:42:00.710 --> 00:42:02.745
Yell aloud no to the enemy, watch him flee.
00:42:02.745 --> 00:42:04.847
Whisper a quiet yes to jesus, he'll be there in no time.
00:42:04.847 --> 00:42:07.083
The reason why you can whisper is because you don't need to be
00:42:07.083 --> 00:42:09.385
Loud when you know his nature.
00:42:09.385 --> 00:42:12.755
Elyse: for so long, i felt like hope was attached to a certain
00:42:12.755 --> 00:42:16.459
Outcome and situation, but i've just realized hope being a
00:42:16.459 --> 00:42:20.796
Person means that hope can meet me in the middle of it.
00:42:20.796 --> 00:42:23.699
You see, it's not always give me the happy feelings that it's all
00:42:23.699 --> 00:42:27.403
Gonna turn out, but hope often looks like peace.
00:42:27.403 --> 00:42:31.707
Elyse: i think that that is the journey that we all have to
00:42:31.707 --> 00:42:35.077
Go on.
00:42:35.077 --> 00:42:36.412
I think you said it just then.
00:42:36.412 --> 00:42:37.780
You can be a christian and still not have hope.
00:42:37.780 --> 00:42:39.115
You can go to heaven and still not have hope, because hope
00:42:39.115 --> 00:42:42.818
Comes from knowing the one who is hope.
00:42:42.818 --> 00:42:46.889
And if we have a secondhand faith, if we have a definition
00:42:46.889 --> 00:42:53.329
Of hope or an experience of hope that comes from anything other
00:42:53.329 --> 00:42:57.066
Than a firsthand experience, then it is very easy that that
00:42:57.066 --> 00:43:00.469
Thing is not gonna anchor you as soon as the storm hits because
00:43:00.469 --> 00:43:03.439
It's a friend of a friend;
00:43:03.439 --> 00:43:06.142
Whereas when you start to know who jesus is, you can start to
00:43:06.142 --> 00:43:10.112
Trust his nature over circumstance.
00:43:10.112 --> 00:43:12.281
And i think, i mean, listen, i think we've talked about a lot,
00:43:12.281 --> 00:43:14.917
To be honest.
00:43:14.917 --> 00:43:16.252
But i think what we're really saying is guard against cynicism
00:43:16.252 --> 00:43:20.156
That turns to criticism that becomes bitterness, because
00:43:20.156 --> 00:43:22.358
Really all it is doing is snuffing out the very thing that
00:43:22.358 --> 00:43:25.461
We need, which is hope.
00:43:25.461 --> 00:43:28.064
And the way that we can create hope in our life, if you want a
00:43:28.064 --> 00:43:31.067
Really practical thing, is go for a walk today and thank god
00:43:31.067 --> 00:43:35.905
For five things.
00:43:35.905 --> 00:43:37.773
Start to have a daily practice.
00:43:37.773 --> 00:43:39.575
Gratitude is not some empty thing.
00:43:39.575 --> 00:43:41.744
It is a true thing.
00:43:41.744 --> 00:43:43.345
There have been practical studies shown that it is
00:43:43.345 --> 00:43:46.082
Actually helpful.
00:43:46.082 --> 00:43:47.416
But when we're talking about hope, we have to find things
00:43:47.416 --> 00:43:51.020
That god is already moving in, or that he has already
00:43:51.020 --> 00:43:53.489
Worked around.
00:43:53.489 --> 00:43:54.824
Because as you're getting to know someone's nature, you get
00:43:54.824 --> 00:43:56.792
To know someone's nature by their actions.
00:43:56.792 --> 00:43:59.261
And so i think sometimes where we get stuck is saying, "yeah,
00:43:59.261 --> 00:44:01.831
But i haven't seen god do a good thing.
00:44:01.831 --> 00:44:03.632
I haven't seen god come through."
00:44:03.632 --> 00:44:05.034
Yes, you have. you just blocked it out.
00:44:05.034 --> 00:44:07.570
You just didn't see it in the way that you thought that you
00:44:07.570 --> 00:44:10.940
Would see it.
00:44:10.940 --> 00:44:12.308
And if we actually want hope, we need to start becoming aware
00:44:12.308 --> 00:44:16.345
Again of where he's already moving.
00:44:16.345 --> 00:44:18.681
There's that thing called the reticular activating system in
00:44:18.681 --> 00:44:21.484
Our brain, which is a fancy way of saying, like, when you're
00:44:21.484 --> 00:44:24.587
Buying a car, you wanna buy a mazda, i don't know, then
00:44:24.587 --> 00:44:28.290
Suddenly you see mazdas all over on the road.
00:44:28.290 --> 00:44:30.359
Are there more of those types of car?
00:44:30.359 --> 00:44:31.827
No, there's just something in your brain now that is gonna
00:44:31.827 --> 00:44:33.863
Catch it at every different point.
00:44:33.863 --> 00:44:35.765
Maybe the people that are so full of hope that other people
00:44:35.765 --> 00:44:38.334
Have decided are empty positive-thinking people are
00:44:38.334 --> 00:44:41.403
Just people that have decided to see where god is moving rather
00:44:41.403 --> 00:44:45.107
Than where god hasn't moved.
00:44:45.107 --> 00:44:48.010
Elyse: every day, finding ways that god has come through
00:44:48.010 --> 00:44:51.213
For you.
00:44:51.213 --> 00:44:52.581
And for me, honestly, it's about what i choose to let into
00:44:52.581 --> 00:44:56.085
My heart.
00:44:56.085 --> 00:44:57.453
Can't always determine and control the first things we see
00:44:57.453 --> 00:45:00.489
Or hear in our life, but we can control what we stay in front of
00:45:00.489 --> 00:45:04.093
Our eyes, what we stay in our ears.
00:45:04.093 --> 00:45:06.562
And so there are seasons of my life where i've really been
00:45:06.562 --> 00:45:08.864
Struggling to hold on to hope, and yet if i look at the tv
00:45:08.864 --> 00:45:11.967
Shows that i'm watching, honestly, if i'm looking at the
00:45:11.967 --> 00:45:14.270
Amount of things i'm scrolling online and honestly the types of
00:45:14.270 --> 00:45:18.140
Profiles that i'm scrolling, if i look at the podcasts that i'm
00:45:18.140 --> 00:45:22.178
Listening to, the things going in, they're not helping me stay
00:45:22.178 --> 00:45:27.049
Grounded in hope.
00:45:27.049 --> 00:45:28.384
It is so important, especially in seasons where you are
00:45:28.384 --> 00:45:30.586
Fighting for your hope, stay grateful and stay grounded in
00:45:30.586 --> 00:45:35.925
Resources that will help you and remind you that he is our hope.
00:45:35.925 --> 00:45:41.263
Jackie: i said this earlier, but i wanna reiterate it.
00:45:41.263 --> 00:45:44.633
What has encouraged me, what kinda always encourages me, is
00:45:44.633 --> 00:45:47.703
When i see a text that affirms why i can't produce
00:45:47.703 --> 00:45:53.475
Something myself.
00:45:53.475 --> 00:45:55.678
And so in struggling with hope, you could always feel like,
00:45:55.678 --> 00:45:59.415
"okay, i'm reading the word, i got all the scripture, i'm doing
00:45:59.415 --> 00:46:02.251
All the stuff, i'm still hopeless."
00:46:02.251 --> 00:46:04.854
And i came across this text in romans 15:13 that says, "may the
00:46:04.854 --> 00:46:08.891
God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so
00:46:08.891 --> 00:46:13.596
That by the power of the holy spirit you may abound in hope."
00:46:13.596 --> 00:46:19.101
And that's kinda reframed it for me, where i'm like, "oh, i need
00:46:19.101 --> 00:46:23.072
God to hope in god."
00:46:23.072 --> 00:46:25.040
And so it just increases, like, this dependence, where it's like
00:46:25.040 --> 00:46:28.244
I can, i have language for what i need now in prayer.
00:46:28.244 --> 00:46:31.280
Where it's like, "okay, holy spirit, you are the god of hope
00:46:31.280 --> 00:46:35.985
And you can help me abound in hope.
00:46:35.985 --> 00:46:37.486
I don't know how you gonna do it, i don't know how you gonna
00:46:37.486 --> 00:46:39.688
Produce it, i don't know when it's gonna come, i don't know
00:46:39.688 --> 00:46:42.024
How big it will be, but i know you can--i can hope in that
00:46:42.024 --> 00:46:45.728
'cause you said it," you know?
00:46:45.728 --> 00:46:47.329
So i just, i think that text right there is powerful.
00:46:47.329 --> 00:46:51.867
Lisa: outward expressions of faith can be really powerful
00:46:51.867 --> 00:46:54.570
Before even that prayer that we've been praying is answered
00:46:54.570 --> 00:46:58.841
Because it, first of all, shows god that we believe him.
00:46:58.841 --> 00:47:04.680
I think there's that thing that god wants from us is that we are
00:47:04.680 --> 00:47:10.085
Trusting him, that we are giving him our heart, that we are
00:47:10.085 --> 00:47:14.189
Saying, "god, i believe you even though i don't have tangible
00:47:14.189 --> 00:47:17.426
Proof that what i'm praying is gonna be answered or answered on
00:47:17.426 --> 00:47:21.664
My table, my timetable.
00:47:21.664 --> 00:47:23.832
I believe you, i trust you, i have faith in you."
00:47:23.832 --> 00:47:26.969
Without faith, it's impossible to please god, and we know that
00:47:26.969 --> 00:47:30.973
He wants our faith.
00:47:30.973 --> 00:47:32.574
But the other thing that it does, it's powerful for us.
00:47:32.574 --> 00:47:35.377
It changes us, it inspires us, and it says, "i am putting my
00:47:35.377 --> 00:47:40.883
Faith forward and i'm saying i believe god and i'm gonna walk
00:47:40.883 --> 00:47:45.054
This out even if and even when i can't see tangible proof that
00:47:45.054 --> 00:47:50.025
What i'm praying for is happening."
00:47:50.025 --> 00:47:51.460
And there's something that just shifts in our soul.
00:47:51.460 --> 00:47:54.096
I've watched it happen in my own life, i've watched it happen in
00:47:54.096 --> 00:47:56.565
Other people's lives, and it is a really powerful faith practice
00:47:56.565 --> 00:48:02.271
To walk it out even when we can't see the end result.
00:48:02.271 --> 00:48:06.475
Toni: i have one last thing that just came into my little brain.
00:48:06.475 --> 00:48:09.411
Okay, so he is the god of hope, faith, and love.
00:48:09.411 --> 00:48:13.515
But when we get to heaven, we actually don't need faith and we
00:48:13.515 --> 00:48:18.487
Don't need hope.
00:48:18.487 --> 00:48:20.622
Because faith says, like, jesus is real, but, like, he gonna be
00:48:20.622 --> 00:48:23.092
Right there at the seat at the right hand of the father.
00:48:23.092 --> 00:48:26.462
And then, like, we won't need a lot of hope because we won't
00:48:26.462 --> 00:48:29.231
Have to be, we don't have to suffer.
00:48:29.231 --> 00:48:31.800
And all we will need is the god of love, everlasting,
00:48:31.800 --> 00:48:36.071
Eternal love.
00:48:36.071 --> 00:48:37.406
And i just, i wanted to present that and offer that up to us
00:48:37.406 --> 00:48:39.975
Because, for me, that makes me more hopeful now, to know that i
00:48:39.975 --> 00:48:44.847
Won't need it with him then.
00:48:44.847 --> 00:48:47.383
Jackie: and it's only on this side.
00:48:47.383 --> 00:48:49.485
Elyse: that's beautiful. that is really beautiful.
00:48:49.485 --> 00:48:52.554
I actually love that.
00:48:52.554 --> 00:48:53.922
I think we can end on that, honestly.
00:48:53.922 --> 00:48:55.257
Let's pray.
00:48:55.257 --> 00:48:56.892
Jesus, thank you that you are hope.
00:48:56.892 --> 00:49:01.530
Thank you that you gave us what you knew we would need in this
00:49:01.530 --> 00:49:04.400
Broken world that would disappoint us, but that you
00:49:04.400 --> 00:49:08.203
Don't disappoint us.
00:49:08.203 --> 00:49:09.671
I pray people that are listening to this conversation today,
00:49:09.671 --> 00:49:13.409
Whether on tv or a screen or audibly, god, that have confused
00:49:13.409 --> 00:49:19.048
Circumstance with your nature, god, would you show them who
00:49:19.048 --> 00:49:22.217
You are?
00:49:22.217 --> 00:49:23.585
God, i pray for those of us who have tied hope to a circumstance
00:49:23.585 --> 00:49:27.589
Only to be disappointed, god, would you guard us against
00:49:27.589 --> 00:49:31.193
Bitterness, cynicism, disappointment?
00:49:31.193 --> 00:49:33.896
God, would you heal the disappointment before it starts
00:49:33.896 --> 00:49:36.231
To become any of those things?
00:49:36.231 --> 00:49:38.267
And jesus, i just thank you.
00:49:38.267 --> 00:49:41.603
Thank you that one day we are no longer gonna need this, that we
00:49:41.603 --> 00:49:45.074
Can put this tool away 'cause we will be standing in the very
00:49:45.074 --> 00:49:49.478
Presence of hope.
00:49:49.478 --> 00:49:51.580
God, i speak hope into people's homes today.
00:49:51.580 --> 00:49:56.985
God, the person that is fighting for their marriage, the mom that
00:49:56.985 --> 00:50:03.358
Is waning in hope for her child, the person whose diagnosis has
00:50:03.358 --> 00:50:07.763
Come back, the person just struggling to feel anything,
00:50:07.763 --> 00:50:14.570
Lord, would you bring them a tangible sense of hope today,
00:50:14.570 --> 00:50:19.575
And in doing so, also remind them and us that you are the
00:50:19.575 --> 00:50:24.246
Source of it, so maybe we can come to you and get that, lord,
00:50:24.246 --> 00:50:30.185
And be reminded that it won't be long before we'll see you face
00:50:30.185 --> 00:50:33.555
To face?
00:50:33.555 --> 00:50:34.890
We commit this to you in jesus's name, amen.
00:50:34.890 --> 00:50:39.194
Lisa: amen.
00:50:39.194 --> 00:50:41.530
Laurie: connect with us on social media and let us know how
00:50:41.530 --> 00:50:43.932
Our team can pray for you.
00:50:43.932 --> 00:50:47.536
Watch "better together" on the go.
00:50:47.536 --> 00:50:49.471
Download the free tbn+ app to stream all of your
00:50:49.471 --> 00:50:52.708
Favorite conversations.
00:50:52.708 --> 00:50:54.076
♪♪♪
00:50:54.076 --> 00:51:00.000

Become an Agent of Hope | Better Together Episode 1179

July 16, 2026 | S8 E1179 | 50:59

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