Mike Sognorelli - Carl Lentz On Spiritual Warfare, NYC, & The Fight For His Life

January 9, 2026 | 51:3

Pastor Mike Signorelli brings bold, Bible-based teaching to help believers walk faithfully in today’s often compromised world

#SpiritualWarfare #PersonalStory #Testimony #Failure #Sin #Struggle #Healing #Repentance #TrustGod #SeekGod #SpiritualGrowth #Regret #CarlLentz

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| Mike Sognorelli - Carl Lentz On Spiritual Warfare, NYC, & The Fight For His Life | January 9, 2026

How many people claim
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To get saved, but their cravings never change.
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You can scroll on your phone
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For four hours, but you can't spend four minutes in prayer.
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Something's gotta change because you say.
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If it was about me, i would keep scrolling.
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But it's about this density, so let me destroy.
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Oh, come on, somebody.
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Oh, oh oh.
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Neither of us do like structured interview stuff.
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Yeah, and i'm regretting it now because i would have seen
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This question come and be like, mike, i'm not doing it.
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Not with a million. no. no frickin way.
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I knew all about deliverance and spiritual warfare
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And still cheated on my wife, still stepped out of ministry.
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Our stories are identical, just 15 years apart.
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We typically either overplay it or underplay it.
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Yeah.
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When it comes to spiritual darkness, it's cruelty.
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To tell somebody it's a demon
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When they need counseling, this kind of talk doesn't go viral.
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I feel like in so many ways, you were like a marked man spiritually.
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The the spiritual implications of it.
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I'm like, there's a lot of demons mad at this dude.
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I'm not getting ten reports before a service starts about some sort of drama.
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Are we even existing in the spiritual
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Weight of that era?
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I counted it as a reverend honor.
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You're under the weight of the glory of god.
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Dude, i was in the crowd.
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I've always wanted to ask you about this. you.
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Oh, good. for.
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I want to say it publicly to a million subscribers.
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One of the greatest revivalists of our generation.
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Name is carl lentz.
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Carl lentz, you're here.
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My brother and me.
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Cast him in your house here in new york is incredible.
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Yeah. i really appreciate you, brother.
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I think i, i, we talked a little bit beforehand.
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When you meet people in new york that are about the the right kind of grind.
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It just resonates with me. and you always been that.
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You've always been somebody about people and about letting people know
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There's there's a living god.
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You can you can know him or not, but you can love people either way.
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And i think it's it's really special.
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My, my my heart when i come back to new york, it just
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You know, just fills up with now gratitude, love.
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There's like a little period
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There was tough to tough to function even coming back here.
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But seeing men like, you know, it's just cool.
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I'm really proud of who you are and what you represent.
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And it's cool to be in your house, brother.
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Man, i didn't know we were going to start with me crying. yeah, well,
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It means a lot here.
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And you say that because you.
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You been here in the mean streets, you know, this life, and it's it's
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Incredibly vindicating.
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You know, there's been
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I tell people in new york city is like the vietnam of church planting.
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So because you see so many of your fallen brothers and yes,
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I was that guy from forrest gump, captain dan.
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Yeah. and and lieutenant dan. yeah.
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I tell because people i'm like, i'm not that good.
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I'm lieutenant dan like, i'm the dude that's like, i'm missing and i my limbs.
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And i just wheeled myself out for this interview,
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Because i just, i but what i do say is i got that cockroach anointing.
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Yeah. you know, it's like dropping a nuke.
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You kind of got that on you.
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Yeah, for zombie mode, i call it where it's like,
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You can't kill me a second time. already dead. yeah.
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You know what i mean? yeah.
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So, yeah, it's like he one of my friends.
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He's not a christian who i love.
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He was like, you know, you're like, kind of like a cockroach.
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And i'm like, do you want to fish for another metaphor, my brother?
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Like, you know what i mean? like a phoenix.
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I'm like, let's go with phoenix.
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Like, i know what you're about to say, but yeah, it's just a little hit.
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A nerve is so funny, i just own.
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I just want to kill, man. well, you know what it's like.
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This guy jonathan con.
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I was reading one of his books, and this is a mind blowing revelation.
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He was talking about how satan was referred to as, serpent in the genesis,
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And then a dragon in revelation, which is cold blooded, like reptilian.
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And then obviously christ being the lion or the lamb, which is warm blooded.
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Yeah.
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And the whole revelation was, cold blooded.
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You're fast, but you don't have endurance.
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And then warm blooded is for the long old, like you're an endurance creature.
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Love that.
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And so i feel like, you know, for us, the warm blooded individuals.
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Yeah. we just we're just still here.
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Yeah. you know, we're still rocking.
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And so for you to show up, for you to be here,
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As a matter of fact, is kind of serendipitous.
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I think i'll at least mention this. yeah.
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You know, i just hit a million subscribers.
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Someone on somebody do the whole thing was like,
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Man, when we hit a million, i'm going to have carl come.
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And it was.
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I love this idea of dancing on the graveyard.
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Yeah.
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And it was like you and i had in my mind this triumphant thing where i'm like
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New york city church planter with new york city church planter.
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Carl comes back to new york city and i hit a million subs.
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And dude, you can't make this up. go grab your thing.
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I'm. dude. yeah, yeah. here. maybe i'm in.
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We're going to flex it.
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This is a is this a song i don't i don't even, i don't even think we can color.
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Can we a flex i like to look at it is what a great thing.
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This is incredible.
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Talk about it.
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Well, can we pawn it.
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Yeah, that's what i, i don't know.
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Is this real gold?
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One thing i love about being out of a little bit of the church
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Mix is the fake humility
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That that people don't use in the rebuked me a fox, you know.
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No, you you you can.
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It's actually a pretty incredible thing to invade a space.
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That's filled with, with so much stuff that's not helping people.
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Yeah.
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And you went in there
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With the really simple message, brother, and and and god's really blessed it.
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So it's awesome to see.
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Yeah. apologize for nothing.
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And thank you for that.
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Thank you for that.
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Because, you can't fake your way to this. no.
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And the thing is, like, people know you. it's they know.
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So long story short, this is where this becomes, like a movie moment.
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This to me, right?
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I come out here, i start the church with 18 people.
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We launch seven campuses a decade later.
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And then the whole joke was, i'm going to hit a million subscribers,
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And then carl's going to come whatever.
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So then my assistant.
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So you're on the way, right? so you're coming.
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And then my assistant sends me a message saying you'll never believe this.
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Your gold play button tracking information just came in.
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And it's literally getting delivered today.
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So like, you and the buttons showed up at the same time.
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Let's go.
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I mean, it's just one of those weird things.
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It's it's a it's a, it's a staple of kind of what god's doing with you.
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I also say this to the millions of people that watch.
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So you are i think the young, the young people still say a real one
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When you've, make decisions that are hard and you and you fall.
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You know, some people don't stick around.
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And we've known each other for years from different angles.
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But you, you didn't you didn't abandon the field, you know,
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And i think that's really special.
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And i just want to the for the people that do follow you and trust you love you.
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For as a former minister, that broke people's trust.
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It's cool
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To be able to always point to people who say, if you're a man of integrity and,
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And i think it's really special, but that's that's who this guy is.
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He's not the he's not the guy who talks and then doesn't show.
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You've always been encouraging to me and my family, and,
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I appreciate i'll never forget it.
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I have a great long memory. the right way.
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Short memory on the on the wrong stuff.
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Great memory on the other stuff.
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Like people who are faithful and, chris jericho was another guy in the city.
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That is.
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There's just some there's some real people out there.
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So the guy that has ministered to you for a long time, and does
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So probably daily people who are a part of this movement and ministries.
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He's a he's a real deal. you're a real guy.
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Come on, man. that means a lot.
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Well, that's
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One of the things i love about new york city is they know real, knows real.
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And it's like, man, you can get away with some stuff outside
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Of new york city, but you come in here and they're they're not having it.
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Yeah.
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You know, there's a reason why i came from indiana, and, like, i'm still here.
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Yeah. you know what i mean? i don't know if you do that.
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Do you have guest speakers at your church? yeah, sometimes,
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There was a guy who came through the preacher
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One time at hillsong, and i had him slated to do a couple,
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And then after the first one, i was like, man, i just
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I can't we can't we can't run that thing back, brother.
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It's no offense.
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It's just it's not for our people. right.
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And because you find out real quick whatever you been do,
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Like new york has this
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Beautiful thing of it where people are, they're really genuine and open and
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And some of the shtick or whatever you think was working somewhere.
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It's like, yeah, but i just never forget that guy's face.
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Like, it just can't do a brother, like.
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Yeah, right. you know, like, glad you're here.
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I appreciate you, but we got to put, you know what, what we do here first.
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And so yeah, new york, new york will, it'll show you colors quick.
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It will? yeah, it's straight up.
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Yeah.
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We have to be very intentional about who because, you know, it's.
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And the other thing too, is like, there's not as much like celebrity
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Christian culture out here, you know what i mean?
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So you can have a large crowd at vh1 church
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And and you're i'm namedrop and they're like,
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We don't know who that is and we don't care.
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And by the way, can julie preach again?
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You know, so they just my wife is the celebrity of our church,
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Which i think is awesome. yeah.
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You know, but it's it's so true, you know, a lot of,
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A lot of that stuff is, is, is is made up culture stuff.
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You know, the whole celebrity vibe in general.
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You could even say it's, it's not real.
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You know, if someone throws these labels around.
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Yeah.
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Okay.
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But on the streets, real life
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Outside of whatever screen you're watching, it's a different world.
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Yeah. i've never really given a lot of stock to that stuff.
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And and we obviously got hit with some of that stuff, but
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We always just used to say whatever, you know, we, we don't have a lot of time.
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Yeah.
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To be fishing around some of these, these labels because it's, you know
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When you do a church in new york is different
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Will you are always the guy to and you still are.
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But i just so many stories of you ministering to people
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Who have no idea who you are and that, you know, i was telling you this earlier,
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But it's just like one of your primary giftings is an evangelist.
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You know, dramatic stories that you had here in the in the streets.
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And what i loved is, like, anybody can have the music playing behind them.
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Yeah, you know what i mean?
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And you set the atmosphere and it's like, it's funny because one of the ways
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That i've kept, i've sharpened myself out here
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Is like, try something that worked on a stage in the streets.
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Yeah.
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And how many times i've gotten laughed at cast out.
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They don't care who i am.
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And it's funny
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Because i walk away from those situations thinking this made me healthier.
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Because, you know,
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When you're in the echo chamber and you know, it's you drop the one line
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Like we at our manhattan campus, i drop a one liner and everyone goes, wow!
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And you know, so where did that church culture, the wow wow.
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And i'm like, from a sociological perspective,
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If somebody came in, you're like, this is weird, man.
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Yeah. and then you go in the street and you drop the one liner.
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No. and no one says, wow.
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Yeah. you know. so yeah.
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But and i love that about i think i glean that from your life when i got here
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Where it was like,
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I need to spend as much time on the streets as i do the stage or more.
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Yeah, you know what i mean. it's a beautiful way to put it.
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I think.
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I my, i talked to a lot of communicators now,
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And part of my primary thing i'm doing is helping people preach better.
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And there is a switch to be made where a lot of guys like,
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I want to see if what i'm saying on the stage works in the street.
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I said, and perhaps flip that thing.
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Yeah, that was that.
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If it's working on the street, go ahead and talk about it.
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Yeah, that.
00:11:22.745 --> 00:11:23.713
So i was never a sermon prep guy
00:11:23.713 --> 00:11:25.314
Where i'm going to prepare a sermon up in a closet,
00:11:25.314 --> 00:11:27.783
Come down and try to deliver something.
00:11:27.783 --> 00:11:29.318
I was more of, an overflow from what real life is happening
00:11:29.318 --> 00:11:33.055
And what real life is doing.
00:11:33.055 --> 00:11:34.590
And it will probably help these people as well.
00:11:34.590 --> 00:11:36.826
So do my my, my. yeah.
00:11:36.826 --> 00:11:38.761
Oh, and i, i met with the preacher one time.
00:11:38.761 --> 00:11:41.097
He was like, yeah, i got all my sermons prepared for the whole year.
00:11:41.097 --> 00:11:43.499
And i was like, sounds miserable. they're probably trash.
00:11:43.499 --> 00:11:46.068
How do you do that? like, yeah, how on earth could you know?
00:11:46.068 --> 00:11:48.838
Yeah. and, i, we both love prep.
00:11:48.838 --> 00:11:51.407
Like, i'm a huge, obvious, diligent believer in prep.
00:11:51.407 --> 00:11:55.211
But my point is, like, what are you prepping?
00:11:56.145 --> 00:11:57.646
Right.
00:11:57.646 --> 00:11:59.482
So it's more fun to see god do things in people's lives on the street and,
00:11:59.482 --> 00:12:03.252
And in your own family and in your everyday life.
00:12:04.253 --> 00:12:06.355
And then go talk about what god's doing, as opposed to trying to get some ethereal
00:12:06.355 --> 00:12:10.259
Thought that might get you a certain look or feel.
00:12:10.259 --> 00:12:13.696
But it doesn't have that, that impact
00:12:14.497 --> 00:12:16.398
That you and i love the the impact of watching god invade a space.
00:12:16.398 --> 00:12:20.503
Oh my gosh.
00:12:20.836 --> 00:12:22.738
It's so it's a it's a cool thing to see people make a shift from like, me,
00:12:22.738 --> 00:12:25.541
Maybe the pulpit to the streets.
00:12:26.175 --> 00:12:29.111
Yeah.
00:12:29.345 --> 00:12:31.147
Chasm doesn't have to be as glaring as it can seem like that to me.
00:12:31.147 --> 00:12:32.848
From where i sit
00:12:32.848 --> 00:12:34.784
Now or on on the sidelines to a degree, when it comes to preaching, i see guys
00:12:34.784 --> 00:12:38.287
Preaching a lot and i just say, i hope, i hope there's a new wave of guys.
00:12:38.287 --> 00:12:42.124
Yeah, they're going to come out of the street
00:12:43.058 --> 00:12:44.326
Into the pulpit, as opposed to guys trying to see
00:12:44.326 --> 00:12:45.961
If this is going to work out there.
00:12:45.961 --> 00:12:47.129
Here's my church.
00:12:47.129 --> 00:12:48.864
You know, i think, yeah, there's a beautiful mix in there somewhere.
00:12:48.864 --> 00:12:50.432
I feel it.
00:12:50.432 --> 00:12:52.334
It's almost like if it works on the stage it might not work on the streets,
00:12:52.334 --> 00:12:54.837
But if it works on the streets, it works three times better on the stage.
00:12:56.305 --> 00:12:59.008
Yeah.
00:12:59.241 --> 00:13:00.543
And that's how you don't lose your edge. yeah.
00:13:00.543 --> 00:13:02.278
And it also has humbled me because i'm like, wow, i'm not that good,
00:13:02.278 --> 00:13:04.947
You know, like this. yeah.
00:13:05.514 --> 00:13:06.348
You know what i mean?
00:13:06.348 --> 00:13:08.083
Because and i think new york city, i had this weird relationship
00:13:08.083 --> 00:13:10.252
With this city because it is like a love hate, you know,
00:13:10.252 --> 00:13:13.656
Because it's the it's that, dickens, you know, the best at times.
00:13:13.656 --> 00:13:17.493
Worst of times. yeah. the tale of two cities. yeah.
00:13:17.493 --> 00:13:20.095
You know, and i know, you know, that,
00:13:20.095 --> 00:13:22.765
But just kind of like going a little bit deeper.
00:13:22.765 --> 00:13:24.934
If i go rather.
00:13:24.934 --> 00:13:26.468
Yeah, go a little bit deeper, you know?
00:13:26.468 --> 00:13:28.904
You know, you you were out there, you're evangelizing.
00:13:28.904 --> 00:13:32.041
I feel like then
00:13:32.408 --> 00:13:34.210
I feel like in so many ways, you were like a marked man spiritually.
00:13:34.210 --> 00:13:36.846
Because it's like you have the nations come to new york city.
00:13:38.047 --> 00:13:41.050
You know, it's like, for example,
00:13:41.784 --> 00:13:43.285
I got the mayor's approval here to do a time square event.
00:13:43.285 --> 00:13:46.622
My expectations were low.
00:13:47.189 --> 00:13:48.424
You're out of the thing.
00:13:48.424 --> 00:13:49.658
Yeah, well, that's a whole other story.
00:13:49.658 --> 00:13:51.560
I can't wait for those watching. you may not know.
00:13:51.560 --> 00:13:53.395
So i did a live stream, from my phone outside of this house,
00:13:53.395 --> 00:13:57.366
And it went viral that night, which was
00:13:58.234 --> 00:14:00.202
It was me talking about the lone wolf situation here in the city.
00:14:00.202 --> 00:14:03.439
It was a political thing, but i gave, like, a spiritual message.
00:14:04.673 --> 00:14:06.075
I love it, i
00:14:06.075 --> 00:14:08.043
And i hesitate to say this on film, but i'm just going to, you know, whatever.
00:14:08.043 --> 00:14:10.646
We'll go there.
00:14:10.646 --> 00:14:11.280
You know,
00:14:11.280 --> 00:14:12.815
I get a whatsapp from the new york city mayor's office,
00:14:12.815 --> 00:14:15.484
Which that kind of freaked me out.
00:14:15.484 --> 00:14:17.086
It's like it.
00:14:17.086 --> 00:14:18.387
At first i thought it was spam, you know?
00:14:18.387 --> 00:14:20.789
And then it was like, hey,
00:14:20.789 --> 00:14:22.324
You know, we're requesting your presence at gracie mansion.
00:14:22.324 --> 00:14:24.760
That, so i'm thinking, like, this is either really good or really bad,
00:14:24.760 --> 00:14:28.430
You know?
00:14:28.430 --> 00:14:30.232
So i show up the next day and the guys were basically like, hey,
00:14:30.232 --> 00:14:32.701
We want to say this,
00:14:32.701 --> 00:14:34.403
But we can't thank you for saying this, which is kind of crazy.
00:14:34.403 --> 00:14:37.773
So then i try to use that open door to open another door and was like,
00:14:39.174 --> 00:14:42.511
Hey, i want to do like a time square event, blah, blah, blah.
00:14:42.511 --> 00:14:45.814
So they approve it.
00:14:46.282 --> 00:14:47.883
And, i'm, i mean, when you see the footage, the whole thing,
00:14:47.883 --> 00:14:50.452
It looks like a new york, a new year's eve service and check it out.
00:14:50.452 --> 00:14:54.823
Which which was.
00:14:54.823 --> 00:14:56.825
But my point, even bringing that up is like, you know, when, when to do that.
00:14:56.825 --> 00:15:00.462
It's like,
00:15:00.462 --> 00:15:02.464
If i did an event of that magnitude in terms of people in in idaho, shout out
00:15:02.464 --> 00:15:06.268
All my idaho folks watching right now, it's not going to have global impact.
00:15:07.770 --> 00:15:10.606
Yeah, but you put that amount of people in times square and it's like, i mean,
00:15:10.606 --> 00:15:14.843
I was internationally syndicated news that next week
00:15:14.843 --> 00:15:19.248
Because there's something about this being the crossroads of the world.
00:15:20.683 --> 00:15:22.451
And you i know, you know.
00:15:23.018 --> 00:15:24.320
And so that was like a huge moment for me.
00:15:24.320 --> 00:15:26.388
Like kind of like a milestone moment.
00:15:26.388 --> 00:15:27.923
But it also made me aware of the spiritual significance.
00:15:27.923 --> 00:15:31.827
Yeah.
00:15:32.061 --> 00:15:32.895
You know what i mean.
00:15:32.895 --> 00:15:34.330
So so the thing i used to and i this is the first time
00:15:34.330 --> 00:15:35.864
I were ever saying this to you, but like, i would pray for you.
00:15:35.864 --> 00:15:39.501
Thank you deeply, man.
00:15:40.002 --> 00:15:41.337
I'm talking intercede because part of it was
00:15:41.337 --> 00:15:43.839
Like you're literally plundering i there's that phrase i always use
00:15:43.839 --> 00:15:48.410
If you're not in a head on collision with the devil, it's
00:15:48.410 --> 00:15:50.512
Because you're both run in the same direction. yikes.
00:15:50.512 --> 00:15:53.382
And so it was like, for you, you're just you're out here just plundering hell,
00:15:53.382 --> 00:15:57.419
Raising up people to do it.
00:15:58.020 --> 00:15:59.989
It was more like apostolic with with the evangelist, you know what i mean?
00:15:59.989 --> 00:16:03.492
Yeah.
00:16:03.726 --> 00:16:05.694
And the whole time, i think for me, i looked at the spiritual implications of
00:16:05.694 --> 00:16:07.229
And i'm like, there's a, there's a lot of demons mad at this.
00:16:07.229 --> 00:16:10.399
Dude.
00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:11.900
If you're near one of our campuses, i want to give you
00:16:11.900 --> 00:16:14.236
A personal invitation to check out v1 church.
00:16:14.236 --> 00:16:18.273
There's no way i can describe the atmosphere of revival in the experience.
00:16:19.742 --> 00:16:22.878
If you've never driven up or driven in, you know,
00:16:23.879 --> 00:16:26.415
Let me just tell you it's a powerful atmosphere
00:16:27.383 --> 00:16:29.218
And a bunch of people who really love the lord and want to get to know you.
00:16:29.218 --> 00:16:33.088
So let us know when you're coming and i'll see you at v1 church.
00:16:33.088 --> 00:16:40.629
So, i mean, i don't know if you feel comfortable, like,
00:16:41.764 --> 00:16:44.333
Yeah, if you could go back in your mind to that era of, like,
00:16:44.333 --> 00:16:47.236
What it was like to be public enemy number one in satan's kingdom?
00:16:47.236 --> 00:16:51.573
Yeah, i mean, i it was i
00:16:51.573 --> 00:16:55.944
There's a
00:16:56.245 --> 00:16:58.180
We typically either overplay it or underplay it.
00:16:58.180 --> 00:17:00.682
Yeah. when it comes to spiritual darkness.
00:17:00.682 --> 00:17:03.419
And i think i have a great mom and dad who taught me really well about about that.
00:17:03.419 --> 00:17:08.757
And, and even, you know, my pastor at the time, brian
00:17:09.858 --> 00:17:11.994
And hillsong in general are very, very tuned into,
00:17:11.994 --> 00:17:16.065
You know, the spiritual stuff that we can't put our finger on a lot.
00:17:17.399 --> 00:17:20.636
And i feel like i
00:17:21.070 --> 00:17:23.806
Probably could have done more to get more help
00:17:23.806 --> 00:17:28.110
When it came to the heaviness of what i would feel every day.
00:17:28.110 --> 00:17:32.014
And everybody, everybody watching has their own unique heaviness
00:17:33.282 --> 00:17:35.751
That's going to come with their life.
00:17:35.751 --> 00:17:37.086
And for me, in new york, i didn't. i just
00:17:37.086 --> 00:17:40.456
We just hit the ground running and then you wake up some days
00:17:41.657 --> 00:17:43.959
You're like me and i'm really sore, like spiritually like i do.
00:17:43.959 --> 00:17:47.830
And you just try to push through it.
00:17:48.597 --> 00:17:49.932
Whereas i know now it would have been a call.
00:17:49.932 --> 00:17:52.034
It would have been, hey, i, i don't know what this is, but just, just pray
00:17:52.034 --> 00:17:55.838
Because i'm not feeling good or i'm feeling this or i'm feeling
00:17:55.838 --> 00:17:58.240
That i just was so close to reaching out for my own life.
00:17:58.240 --> 00:18:02.978
I was really good at reaching out to other people,
00:18:02.978 --> 00:18:05.114
Really good at teaching other people to reach out.
00:18:05.114 --> 00:18:07.316
When it came to me, actually put my hand up.
00:18:07.316 --> 00:18:10.652
You know, i didn't, i didn't i would do that differently.
00:18:11.787 --> 00:18:12.955
And so i but the spiritual
00:18:12.955 --> 00:18:16.291
Weight of that era, was something special.
00:18:17.192 --> 00:18:20.929
I counted it as a reverent honor.
00:18:20.929 --> 00:18:23.866
So that head on collision.
00:18:23.866 --> 00:18:25.100
I'm sure you're crazy like me.
00:18:25.100 --> 00:18:26.702
Where it's like,
00:18:26.702 --> 00:18:28.470
If there's not something wild happening, i'm not doing my frickin job.
00:18:28.470 --> 00:18:31.773
You know, if i'm not getting ten reports before a service starts
00:18:33.008 --> 00:18:34.376
About some sort of drama, are we even existed?
00:18:34.376 --> 00:18:37.112
I get it, yeah.
00:18:37.112 --> 00:18:38.280
So sometimes it would be a challenge.
00:18:38.280 --> 00:18:39.948
I'd be like, thank god there's no power.
00:18:39.948 --> 00:18:42.317
Randomly.
00:18:42.317 --> 00:18:43.118
Yeah. the whole day.
00:18:43.118 --> 00:18:44.720
Thank god there's a parade again.
00:18:44.720 --> 00:18:46.722
How many effing parades can we have in new york?
00:18:46.722 --> 00:18:50.559
We have parades last hour and here we are again.
00:18:51.527 --> 00:18:54.029
Hey, just so you know, girl, all the streets are shut down.
00:18:54.029 --> 00:18:56.999
No one can get to the service because we've got parades.
00:18:56.999 --> 00:18:59.268
It's like cool, but i so i, i was always up for the fight.
00:18:59.268 --> 00:19:04.106
But i think there is a level of wisdom
00:19:04.907 --> 00:19:06.975
That comes with the humility to get help that,
00:19:06.975 --> 00:19:11.780
I didn't, i didn't access.
00:19:12.347 --> 00:19:14.082
Yeah.
00:19:14.082 --> 00:19:15.651
And so that's, that's that's how when i look back at that one,
00:19:15.651 --> 00:19:17.586
That one angle of it,
00:19:17.586 --> 00:19:20.422
Boy, it would have been, it would have been really helpful
00:19:20.422 --> 00:19:22.824
To let some people know what i was dealing with.
00:19:22.824 --> 00:19:24.693
Yeah, well, it's like we've all been so inspired by your counseling journey,
00:19:24.693 --> 00:19:28.664
You know, and as a church, like, we scholarship all kinds of counseling.
00:19:30.065 --> 00:19:32.701
I mean, we have a large national network of people that i mean, it's
00:19:32.701 --> 00:19:37.206
We believe in that.
00:19:37.673 --> 00:19:39.575
And we've been following your journey. that's why you're awesome, though, mike.
00:19:39.575 --> 00:19:40.742
There's not like there's not a lot.
00:19:40.742 --> 00:19:42.344
You know how i feel about your camp, and i say that lovingly.
00:19:42.344 --> 00:19:44.913
It's not it's not a camp.
00:19:44.913 --> 00:19:46.682
But why i think you stand out is because you use your whole brain.
00:19:46.682 --> 00:19:49.418
The entire thing god gave you, you use it all.
00:19:50.385 --> 00:19:52.854
Yeah, it's not either or.
00:19:52.854 --> 00:19:54.289
It's not like people who believe in therapy don't.
00:19:54.289 --> 00:19:56.825
Don't discount the supernatural. no, man.
00:19:56.825 --> 00:19:59.027
If you're really tuned in supernaturally, you'll be in the therapist office.
00:19:59.027 --> 00:20:02.297
Because you know what? you need.
00:20:02.297 --> 00:20:04.099
So i, i love the fact that you're able to just be smart with both.
00:20:04.099 --> 00:20:07.369
Man, i appreciate that, i appreciate that.
00:20:08.237 --> 00:20:09.805
Well, i mean, right now i'm doing hyperbaric oxygen therapy,
00:20:09.805 --> 00:20:13.275
Which is incredible for your brain.
00:20:14.076 --> 00:20:15.377
It is, and it's really helping me a lot.
00:20:15.377 --> 00:20:17.946
Yeah, but here's my thing.
00:20:17.946 --> 00:20:19.414
I knew all about deliverance and spiritual warfare
00:20:19.414 --> 00:20:21.917
And still cheated on my wife and still became an alcoholic.
00:20:21.917 --> 00:20:25.921
Still stepped out of ministry.
00:20:26.555 --> 00:20:27.889
Yeah, it's like our stories are identical.
00:20:27.889 --> 00:20:29.391
Just 15 years apart.
00:20:29.391 --> 00:20:30.959
Yeah, i just i had a smaller audience for it than you did.
00:20:30.959 --> 00:20:34.429
You know?
00:20:34.730 --> 00:20:36.498
And so it was crazy because i was like, wow, there has to be more.
00:20:36.498 --> 00:20:39.067
You can't counsel a demon, but you can't cast out a mental issue, right?
00:20:40.502 --> 00:20:44.373
So it's like i had that. that's where the wisdom came from.
00:20:45.540 --> 00:20:47.509
And so for me, it's like i'm really just prescribing people what works for me.
00:20:47.509 --> 00:20:52.014
I'm the crash test dummy of my ministry where i'm like, hey, here's
00:20:53.348 --> 00:20:56.285
Here's what worked, you know?
00:20:56.918 --> 00:20:57.486
Yeah.
00:20:57.486 --> 00:20:59.021
And unfortunately, i had to learn the hard way because i was
00:20:59.021 --> 00:21:00.789
The guy who over spiritualize until i realized this is not working.
00:21:00.789 --> 00:21:05.060
Yeah. you know what i mean. and experience taught me.
00:21:06.161 --> 00:21:07.496
And what's crazy, i end up finding this guy.
00:21:07.496 --> 00:21:09.298
Well, so,
00:21:09.298 --> 00:21:10.332
You know, a lot of my viewers
00:21:10.332 --> 00:21:11.900
Know this, but like i mentioned to you, my dad dies prematurely.
00:21:11.900 --> 00:21:15.337
I'm fatherless. i had multiple abusive stepdad.
00:21:16.271 --> 00:21:18.173
I was raised in extreme poverty, gang ridden neighborhoods, blah, blah, blah.
00:21:18.173 --> 00:21:21.977
So all of a sudden now here i am, pastor mike,
00:21:22.944 --> 00:21:25.447
And i'm like, i hadn't dealt with all this stuff.
00:21:26.448 --> 00:21:28.617
So that was but i had dealt with it on a demonic level.
00:21:29.751 --> 00:21:31.386
Or, you know, we say strongholds.
00:21:31.386 --> 00:21:33.355
But i was like, i need someone.
00:21:33.355 --> 00:21:34.823
So for me, basically what happened was it got so bad
00:21:34.823 --> 00:21:37.959
At the height of my alcoholism, i came home one day
00:21:38.994 --> 00:21:41.129
And my house is completely empty but drunk out of my mind.
00:21:41.129 --> 00:21:44.533
I think, it was clean.
00:21:44.533 --> 00:21:47.235
So in my mind i'm thinking, man, julie really cleans good today.
00:21:47.235 --> 00:21:51.206
And then when i sobered up, i was like, oh, she's gone, you know, like she
00:21:52.674 --> 00:21:55.043
My wife left me and and you know, of course that made things worse.
00:21:56.378 --> 00:21:59.648
I spiraled more,
00:22:00.015 --> 00:22:01.983
But eventually i reached a crossroads where i was like, i'm going to find help.
00:22:01.983 --> 00:22:05.487
So i went to this counselor who was, like, fully medical and fully christian
00:22:07.022 --> 00:22:09.257
Was just kind of an anomaly because, you know, it's hard to find those things.
00:22:09.257 --> 00:22:12.961
Yeah.
00:22:13.195 --> 00:22:15.163
And then i'm sitting in the counseling session, and then i start getting angry
00:22:15.163 --> 00:22:17.999
Because i'm like, i have to pay a man to care about me.
00:22:19.134 --> 00:22:21.336
This is so jacked up.
00:22:21.837 --> 00:22:23.972
Like, my pastor never cared about me, you know, and i you know, all those wounds.
00:22:23.972 --> 00:22:26.975
So i literally just talk about dropping f-bombs.
00:22:27.943 --> 00:22:29.945
I just cussed this dude out.
00:22:29.945 --> 00:22:31.313
Yeah, he waits till i'm done.
00:22:31.313 --> 00:22:33.014
He's like, are you done?
00:22:33.014 --> 00:22:35.150
I'm like, well, yeah, you know.
00:22:35.150 --> 00:22:36.685
And he was like, well, here's here's the deal.
00:22:36.685 --> 00:22:38.954
You don't have to pay me ever again.
00:22:38.954 --> 00:22:40.989
I want to see you every single week.
00:22:40.989 --> 00:22:42.924
And, i believe in you, and i want you to be here.
00:22:42.924 --> 00:22:46.328
And this dude just broke this orphan thing off me.
00:22:47.362 --> 00:22:49.631
So i went on this journey with him for a long time.
00:22:50.699 --> 00:22:52.501
And it was funny because i was struggling with alcoholism.
00:22:52.501 --> 00:22:55.470
Like i, when i say it was clinically diagnosed, you know,
00:22:55.470 --> 00:22:59.007
People say it and you're like, no, you just had a couple rager parties.
00:23:00.409 --> 00:23:02.177
Yeah. you were it was like i had a drunk.
00:23:02.177 --> 00:23:04.179
Yes. and so,
00:23:04.179 --> 00:23:06.381
I'm gone.
00:23:06.681 --> 00:23:08.216
And so what he did is he said, i want you to, i want you to start
00:23:08.216 --> 00:23:11.052
Visiting all the places over chicagoland where the abuse and the trauma happened.
00:23:11.052 --> 00:23:15.690
And i want you to ask god, where were you when it happened to me?
00:23:16.892 --> 00:23:19.961
So i'm like, oh, this is going to be fun.
00:23:20.862 --> 00:23:22.564
You know? this is going to be wow.
00:23:22.564 --> 00:23:24.132
So what happened, though?
00:23:24.132 --> 00:23:26.234
The very first location i show up to where some really bad stuff happened to me,
00:23:26.234 --> 00:23:30.372
I'm like, okay, god, i'm doing it.
00:23:31.139 --> 00:23:32.674
This counselor, once, i'm like, where were you when it happened?
00:23:32.674 --> 00:23:35.644
And this is this is the revelation i got is in that moment,
00:23:36.878 --> 00:23:39.181
I felt like the holy spirit said, i'm not bound by time.
00:23:39.181 --> 00:23:42.451
I'm. i'm actually still there.
00:23:43.084 --> 00:23:45.053
I'm in that moment like, you're bound by time, but not me.
00:23:45.053 --> 00:23:49.124
So where am i?
00:23:49.491 --> 00:23:50.525
I'm in 1983 and.
00:23:50.525 --> 00:23:52.861
And i can touch you right now, if you'll allow.
00:23:52.861 --> 00:23:56.131
And that's god's version of healing.
00:23:56.131 --> 00:23:58.834
So i'm going through these crazy experiences where i'm being triggered.
00:23:58.834 --> 00:24:02.471
It's getting worse. it's getting better.
00:24:03.338 --> 00:24:05.207
You know how, like, you know, that whole roller coaster you go on, i relate.
00:24:05.207 --> 00:24:07.442
Yeah.
00:24:07.676 --> 00:24:08.410
And so, what happened was one
00:24:09.044 --> 00:24:12.380
Week i just decided, like, i don't want to drink anymore.
00:24:12.380 --> 00:24:16.251
And so i come in and i tell the guy, he's like, yeah,
00:24:17.352 --> 00:24:19.221
I thought it would happen this week or next week.
00:24:19.221 --> 00:24:21.723
And he had, like, charted this thing out. he was that good.
00:24:21.723 --> 00:24:24.426
He was an older guy, had been doing it for like four decades,
00:24:24.426 --> 00:24:27.896
And he charted out my journey.
00:24:28.530 --> 00:24:29.898
So i think what happened is i became the test
00:24:29.898 --> 00:24:32.434
Tube experiment for this stuff where i was like, it's cruelty
00:24:32.434 --> 00:24:37.439
To tell somebody it's a demon when they need counseling.
00:24:38.573 --> 00:24:40.709
It's it's actually cruelty because i was subjected to that unbalanced bad theology.
00:24:40.709 --> 00:24:45.981
Well, you know what i mean?
00:24:46.581 --> 00:24:48.583
And, and so watching you kind of go on that journey as well, where it's holistic.
00:24:48.583 --> 00:24:53.054
Yeah, it's been inspiring.
00:24:53.622 --> 00:24:55.423
So i don't know if you want to kind of like piggyback off of that.
00:24:55.423 --> 00:24:56.791
I mean, i know holistic is a great word, i think.
00:24:56.791 --> 00:24:58.360
I mean, you just said it beautifully.
00:24:58.360 --> 00:25:00.195
I think there has to be
00:25:00.195 --> 00:25:01.997
I think if you have a christian,
00:25:02.631 --> 00:25:05.667
A follower of jesus that is really,
00:25:05.667 --> 00:25:08.904
Aware of their mental health,
00:25:09.538 --> 00:25:10.872
Aware of their neuro path
00:25:10.872 --> 00:25:14.209
And their brain chemicals and their tendencies,
00:25:15.210 --> 00:25:17.979
And they're really aware of the spiritual realm.
00:25:18.947 --> 00:25:23.018
They're hard to stop.
00:25:23.518 --> 00:25:25.587
Now either one alone easy to stop.
00:25:25.587 --> 00:25:29.491
You get that spiritual guy who's like therapy whatever you dead man walking.
00:25:31.026 --> 00:25:34.663
Wow. get the guy over here. he's all therapy.
00:25:35.564 --> 00:25:37.198
Oh, brain dead man walking.
00:25:37.198 --> 00:25:39.534
There's this beautiful place
00:25:39.534 --> 00:25:41.336
To get to where it's like, no, i'm a child of god, i love jesus.
00:25:41.336 --> 00:25:44.973
I know god has a plan for my life.
00:25:45.740 --> 00:25:47.709
And because of that, i can then go pursue the things that god has opened up
00:25:47.709 --> 00:25:52.013
For me to get help.
00:25:52.013 --> 00:25:53.048
That combo to me is everything.
00:25:53.048 --> 00:25:55.216
And i think there is a there's a wave and you represent a lot of what
00:25:55.216 --> 00:25:59.988
That can be of people who can really talk about both and
00:25:59.988 --> 00:26:03.091
And that's where that's the to me, the recipe that's going to bring
00:26:03.091 --> 00:26:07.462
Continual revival is it's
00:26:08.029 --> 00:26:10.332
I mean, right now it's really cool to talk about mental health.
00:26:10.332 --> 00:26:13.702
It's like therapy has become like church, almost as like
00:26:14.836 --> 00:26:16.237
I go to church, i go to therapy, okay, i got you,
00:26:16.237 --> 00:26:18.907
But that's going to swing back because that's empty.
00:26:18.907 --> 00:26:22.177
And just like it's been empty.
00:26:22.811 --> 00:26:24.813
Hollow church, where you going to rant and rave about stuff, but there's no power.
00:26:24.813 --> 00:26:28.016
Yeah.
00:26:28.249 --> 00:26:29.751
That middle ground for me is is the therapy side of things
00:26:29.751 --> 00:26:32.253
Really, really helped me and really helped me.
00:26:32.253 --> 00:26:34.289
I went to a rehab and,
00:26:34.289 --> 00:26:36.191
I thought that i was going there for one reason.
00:26:37.192 --> 00:26:39.094
And i remember the guy said, you know, i kept asking for my medication.
00:26:39.094 --> 00:26:41.963
They're like, hey, you know, we're not going to be giving you that here.
00:26:41.963 --> 00:26:45.600
And i'm like, well,
00:26:45.600 --> 00:26:47.636
You got another thing coming, my brother, because i didn't come here for that.
00:26:47.636 --> 00:26:50.005
I came here for this.
00:26:50.005 --> 00:26:51.973
And they're like, yeah, well, we're going to tell you what you're here for it.
00:26:51.973 --> 00:26:54.509
I'm like, see it? that doesn't work for me, you know?
00:26:54.509 --> 00:26:56.778
And i literally got into a pretty close to a physical altercation
00:26:56.778 --> 00:27:00.849
With this sweet therapist.
00:27:00.849 --> 00:27:02.784
And in the middle, arizona flipped a table, packed all my stuff up.
00:27:02.784 --> 00:27:06.688
Yeah.
00:27:06.921 --> 00:27:08.289
And and i was like, oh, i might be an addict.
00:27:08.289 --> 00:27:10.258
Anytime someone tries to take something from you and your
00:27:11.426 --> 00:27:13.028
Your response is visceral, one might want to look into that.
00:27:13.028 --> 00:27:16.665
But it was moments like that where god is kind.
00:27:16.665 --> 00:27:20.769
Yeah. the way that he will unwind.
00:27:21.536 --> 00:27:23.338
Truth.
00:27:23.338 --> 00:27:25.106
You need to see that you can sit there long enough to let him do it.
00:27:25.106 --> 00:27:27.042
And in our world, where we can't sit down long enough to watch a whole video,
00:27:27.042 --> 00:27:30.578
People don't have a lot of time, right, for god to unwind anything.
00:27:31.913 --> 00:27:33.882
Yeah. and
00:27:33.882 --> 00:27:34.916
I don't look at my situation as a crash and burn, you know,
00:27:36.084 --> 00:27:38.987
Look at my situation as a graceful god who helped me see things brighter.
00:27:38.987 --> 00:27:43.258
Yeah, that's my situation. yeah.
00:27:43.892 --> 00:27:45.760
I'm glad it's mine, because i get to talk about what it does to me.
00:27:45.760 --> 00:27:47.595
And so to me, i look at what happened to me as that guy
00:27:47.595 --> 00:27:50.632
Was so kind to allow my vision to expand, to see me.
00:27:50.632 --> 00:27:54.135
And this is as important as all this stuff is that that is now severely
00:27:54.135 --> 00:27:58.106
Damaged, in which god can always redeem and always bless and always help.
00:27:58.106 --> 00:28:02.277
But you, there's some stuff in you that has to change.
00:28:03.378 --> 00:28:06.147
And so finding that balance,
00:28:06.748 --> 00:28:09.350
Was a beautiful thing, but you have to sit still long enough to let god do it.
00:28:10.852 --> 00:28:13.221
Yeah.
00:28:13.455 --> 00:28:15.523
You know, often when i talk to people, it's like how i want to get free of this.
00:28:15.523 --> 00:28:17.225
Okay, cool. i get that.
00:28:17.225 --> 00:28:19.294
How much work do you want to do? yeah.
00:28:19.294 --> 00:28:20.929
That's the that the question is not do you want to be free?
00:28:20.929 --> 00:28:23.531
Question is how much work you want to do. yeah.
00:28:23.531 --> 00:28:25.266
But if it's freedom, shouldn't it be in here.
00:28:25.266 --> 00:28:27.135
Depends on what idiot you're listening to.
00:28:27.135 --> 00:28:29.771
Preach every week.
00:28:29.771 --> 00:28:31.172
Because i don't see instant freedom in the gospels.
00:28:31.172 --> 00:28:34.242
I don't see peter.
00:28:34.242 --> 00:28:36.344
Not not denying jesus after he walk with his brother, you know what i'm saying?
00:28:36.344 --> 00:28:39.781
Like, there's there's examples that give us a real, real clear
00:28:39.781 --> 00:28:43.852
View of humanity in the people that we love so much.
00:28:43.852 --> 00:28:46.154
So we forget that.
00:28:46.154 --> 00:28:47.088
Yeah.
00:28:47.088 --> 00:28:49.057
Like if the, the guys that walk with jesus needed time to process who he was
00:28:49.057 --> 00:28:52.594
And who they were,
00:28:53.027 --> 00:28:55.029
Who are we to think, yeah, there might be some counseling sessions in your future.
00:28:55.029 --> 00:28:57.799
Doesn't mean you're less spiritual than you don't have any faith.
00:28:59.134 --> 00:29:00.068
It just means you're smart.
00:29:00.068 --> 00:29:01.269
Yeah. yeah. absolutely. yes.
00:29:01.269 --> 00:29:03.304
I did very little therapy before all this huge proponent of like,
00:29:03.304 --> 00:29:07.542
I remember i wasn't the first guy, but i was in that first wave of people
00:29:07.542 --> 00:29:10.945
Standing up saying, it's okay to not be okay. and,
00:29:10.945 --> 00:29:14.182
But for me, it was like i,
00:29:14.749 --> 00:29:16.618
I don't know, i mean, i can go to a, a level.
00:29:16.618 --> 00:29:19.921
But there was a wall in me where i was even lying to myself.
00:29:21.089 --> 00:29:24.259
Forget about being honest with my wife laura or a counselor.
00:29:24.259 --> 00:29:27.295
It's like i'm too busy lying to myself to be able to even get the kind of help
00:29:27.295 --> 00:29:31.166
I needed.
00:29:31.166 --> 00:29:31.833
So there's a
00:29:31.833 --> 00:29:33.735
There's a couple moments in there for people to even dissect their own life
00:29:33.735 --> 00:29:35.336
And forget about. are you honest with people?
00:29:35.336 --> 00:29:37.505
Yeah, i like the question. are you honest with yourself?
00:29:37.505 --> 00:29:39.808
Yeah. that's it. there's power there.
00:29:39.808 --> 00:29:41.509
Yeah. well, so many young guys.
00:29:41.509 --> 00:29:43.278
I mean, i get hundreds of messages a month from the.
00:29:43.278 --> 00:29:45.513
Hey, can you cast out the demon of lust?
00:29:45.513 --> 00:29:48.783
And it's like, what drives me?
00:29:49.417 --> 00:29:50.518
Yeah, exactly.
00:29:50.518 --> 00:29:51.653
Let me ask you a better question.
00:29:51.653 --> 00:29:53.188
You know, when were you molested and how?
00:29:53.188 --> 00:29:56.057
And have you dealt with that?
00:29:56.057 --> 00:29:57.759
And what's the root of it or what's your anxiety level?
00:29:57.759 --> 00:30:02.030
And how are you medicating anxiety with love.
00:30:02.964 --> 00:30:05.433
So you talk about the root system and it's like you start talking on that level.
00:30:06.968 --> 00:30:09.737
It's like, man, they don't even but because they're looking for a quick fix,
00:30:09.737 --> 00:30:12.740
Which i think contributes to a culture of condemnation because they're like,
00:30:12.740 --> 00:30:16.678
I did all the things the guy told me to do, the demons came out.
00:30:16.678 --> 00:30:20.782
But then now here i am falling back into it's like, well,
00:30:21.916 --> 00:30:24.118
Maybe you did need deliverance, but yeah, the discipline is what you're
00:30:25.520 --> 00:30:29.190
Talking about, where it's like, we got to go to the roots.
00:30:29.190 --> 00:30:31.159
Like, for me, i was a self-sabotage.
00:30:31.159 --> 00:30:33.661
Yeah, yeah.
00:30:33.661 --> 00:30:35.263
So i was the kind of guy that was like, oh, life's not fair.
00:30:35.263 --> 00:30:37.832
I won't destroy you. i'll destroy myself.
00:30:38.700 --> 00:30:40.835
And so i was trapped in these cycles of trying,
00:30:40.835 --> 00:30:44.105
Realizing things aren't working out and then destroying myself.
00:30:45.306 --> 00:30:46.908
Yeah.
00:30:46.908 --> 00:30:48.309
And then everybody around me was a casualty of my own
00:30:48.309 --> 00:30:50.478
Self-destruction, you know? and so,
00:30:50.478 --> 00:30:53.982
I was trapped in that, and it was.
00:30:54.749 --> 00:30:56.751
It was so much.
00:30:56.751 --> 00:30:57.986
And i feel like it's almost like this.
00:30:57.986 --> 00:30:59.554
Like, this is how i've explained it before here in new york city.
00:30:59.554 --> 00:31:02.657
We got we got rats the size of cats. we do.
00:31:02.657 --> 00:31:05.393
But wherever you find garbage, you find rats.
00:31:05.393 --> 00:31:08.796
So this is a complex problem because it's like we have to deal
00:31:10.064 --> 00:31:12.166
With the garbage problem to deal with the rat problem.
00:31:12.166 --> 00:31:15.203
You know, it's and so for me, it's like, oh yeah, there might be some demonic stuff
00:31:15.203 --> 00:31:20.475
Influencing your situation, but you got a garbage problem, bro.
00:31:21.676 --> 00:31:24.112
Like you're feeding this, you're,
00:31:24.112 --> 00:31:25.880
You know, and so i kind of i think there's a level of complexity.
00:31:25.880 --> 00:31:28.950
But here's the problem, carl.
00:31:28.950 --> 00:31:30.785
And i know, you know, this is, this kind of talk doesn't go viral.
00:31:30.785 --> 00:31:34.622
Right?
00:31:34.856 --> 00:31:36.724
But then when i say something that has to when i do speak, you know,
00:31:36.724 --> 00:31:38.993
That's that's like a home, you know,
00:31:39.761 --> 00:31:41.930
And i think for me, i've kind of even in my own personal ministry,
00:31:41.930 --> 00:31:44.966
I've been dealing with that avatar of who mike really is.
00:31:44.966 --> 00:31:48.870
And then people come into v1 church and like, oh, everything's not a demon here.
00:31:48.870 --> 00:31:53.207
And, you know, whatever.
00:31:53.207 --> 00:31:54.575
And i was like, yes, we're a real church, you know?
00:31:54.575 --> 00:31:56.644
And then we're giving them scholarships to counseling sessions, and they're like,
00:31:56.644 --> 00:32:00.481
I said, this guy, i wanted to come see.
00:32:01.349 --> 00:32:02.150
Yeah, this is confusing.
00:32:02.150 --> 00:32:03.751
And actually, some of them who are like spiritual vagabonds,
00:32:03.751 --> 00:32:06.287
They leave angry and they find, yeah, a person
00:32:07.255 --> 00:32:09.958
That will tell them what they want to hear. yeah, man.
00:32:09.958 --> 00:32:12.627
And so it's like, what, what what i love about what you what i see you doing
00:32:12.627 --> 00:32:16.798
Is not trying to deny the reality of the supernatural, the influence of dark,
00:32:18.299 --> 00:32:21.135
You know, the darkness, but also the complexities of it.
00:32:22.236 --> 00:32:24.272
Yeah.
00:32:24.272 --> 00:32:25.573
Something i've been dying to ask you about,
00:32:25.573 --> 00:32:27.475
You know, because we're kind of in the grand finale territory right now.
00:32:27.475 --> 00:32:30.078
And i've always wanted to ask you about this.
00:32:31.012 --> 00:32:32.613
You know, people throw this term revivalist around, and what.
00:32:32.613 --> 00:32:37.018
When i look at your life, i see an overarching theme.
00:32:38.119 --> 00:32:39.887
Because even even with you, like the.
00:32:39.887 --> 00:32:41.389
Hey, why doesn't revival affect your mind?
00:32:41.389 --> 00:32:43.791
Yeah.
00:32:43.791 --> 00:32:45.560
Why, why, why did your spirit come back to life but not your brain?
00:32:45.560 --> 00:32:47.395
Yeah, because my brain is the problem.
00:32:47.395 --> 00:32:49.297
Or why? you know, physical. yeah.
00:32:49.297 --> 00:32:51.499
And i remember this one time i was at hillsong nyc service
00:32:51.499 --> 00:32:55.103
Because we'd hang out in the evenings with all those dudes and whatever.
00:32:55.103 --> 00:32:58.106
Yeah.
00:32:58.106 --> 00:32:59.707
And you just had one of those, like, last service of the day.
00:32:59.707 --> 00:33:02.210
You preached all day, and then you dropped this atomic bomb
00:33:02.210 --> 00:33:05.680
And something happened where it's just everybody just got sucked to the stage.
00:33:05.680 --> 00:33:10.018
And i remember seeing you on stage like you could barely stand up.
00:33:11.386 --> 00:33:13.021
Yeah, you were, and you were just.
00:33:13.021 --> 00:33:14.489
It was madness.
00:33:14.489 --> 00:33:15.590
I remember, evan and i.
00:33:15.590 --> 00:33:17.492
Who's off camera just bawling our eyes out because we moved our whole life
00:33:17.492 --> 00:33:20.595
Here to see those moments of response.
00:33:20.595 --> 00:33:23.965
And we were like the guys with the 40 person church.
00:33:24.999 --> 00:33:26.367
This is before the seven campuses.
00:33:26.367 --> 00:33:28.569
This is before this stuff i'm doing now, before the time square moment.
00:33:28.569 --> 00:33:32.874
And you represented like it was like
00:33:33.641 --> 00:33:35.610
It is possible because when i got here,
00:33:35.610 --> 00:33:38.613
I would say, i would tell people the vision i had for new york city.
00:33:38.613 --> 00:33:41.849
Yeah.
00:33:41.849 --> 00:33:43.718
And 100% of pastors would say, mike, we want to adjust your expectations
00:33:43.718 --> 00:33:47.488
And they thought they were helping me, but it was saul's armor.
00:33:48.790 --> 00:33:51.125
And they were just saying, listen, bro, people come out here,
00:33:52.393 --> 00:33:54.262
You know, with way more, you know, you're just they're trying to help me.
00:33:54.262 --> 00:33:56.297
Yeah.
00:33:56.297 --> 00:33:58.066
But i remember seeing that service and i remember it was like,
00:33:58.066 --> 00:34:00.268
You're under the weight of the glory of god and people are surging.
00:34:00.268 --> 00:34:03.504
And, dude, i was in the crowd.
00:34:03.504 --> 00:34:05.073
Yeah.
00:34:05.073 --> 00:34:06.607
So we're meeting people who are hindus, atheists, agnostics.
00:34:06.607 --> 00:34:09.677
I mean, you people don't understand, bro.
00:34:09.677 --> 00:34:12.080
What you were doing here. it wasn't the bible belt.
00:34:12.080 --> 00:34:14.715
It wasn't.
00:34:14.715 --> 00:34:15.550
This was the jungle.
00:34:15.550 --> 00:34:17.351
It is, you know. you know what i'm saying?
00:34:17.351 --> 00:34:19.387
And so, yeah, i remember watching that moment and being like, this is i.
00:34:19.387 --> 00:34:23.357
And i forgive me if i'm stepping over the line.
00:34:23.357 --> 00:34:25.827
But it felt like a historically significant.
00:34:25.827 --> 00:34:28.729
And and i think your story will have to be told
00:34:28.729 --> 00:34:32.366
In retrospect because because you're on this other
00:34:33.401 --> 00:34:36.637
And so i think the overarching title for your life is revivalist,
00:34:36.637 --> 00:34:41.042
Because wherever you whatever you step into,
00:34:41.943 --> 00:34:43.945
You bring things back to life and you've been doing it in phases.
00:34:43.945 --> 00:34:47.548
And that's, i think this journey, if i can speak prophetically for you right
00:34:49.050 --> 00:34:51.619
Now, is like a revival of the biological mind,
00:34:51.619 --> 00:34:55.590
A revival of we're working on the second movie right now.
00:34:56.757 --> 00:34:58.659
And the title, the theme of the movie is family is revival.
00:34:58.659 --> 00:35:03.464
Yeah.
00:35:03.698 --> 00:35:05.600
So you're bringing your kids, you know, you're putting on the podcast, but
00:35:05.600 --> 00:35:08.069
What goes through your mind when you think about what it means to be here?
00:35:09.537 --> 00:35:13.141
Because i know there was a visceral, emotional response to that.
00:35:14.408 --> 00:35:16.310
And i, you know, but i want to say it publicly to a million subscribers.
00:35:17.712 --> 00:35:20.815
One of the greatest revivalists of our generations name is carl lentz.
00:35:22.250 --> 00:35:25.620
And, i believe that i saw it.
00:35:26.254 --> 00:35:29.157
But the crazy thing is, i'm still seeing it. yeah.
00:35:30.191 --> 00:35:31.459
And i saw people surge to the stage
00:35:31.459 --> 00:35:34.795
When we were in that venue in manhattan.
00:35:35.663 --> 00:35:37.398
But people are surging to youtube, and it's actually a bigger.
00:35:37.398 --> 00:35:40.902
And i felt like the lord was showing me like, what?
00:35:40.902 --> 00:35:42.970
What carl's doing now is literally greater than what he did before.
00:35:42.970 --> 00:35:47.308
It's just that it's digital now.
00:35:47.942 --> 00:35:49.010
Physical in many ways.
00:35:49.010 --> 00:35:50.611
Yeah.
00:35:50.611 --> 00:35:51.913
So you want to kind of like speak to that?
00:35:51.913 --> 00:35:53.514
No, i think it definitely i remember, you know.
00:35:53.514 --> 00:36:16.604
Hey mike cigna rally here in the studio.
00:36:17.471 --> 00:36:19.907
We're getting ready to jump back into the sermon.
00:36:19.907 --> 00:36:22.343
But just very briefly, i wanted to let you know
00:36:22.343 --> 00:36:25.346
That i have a resource called the breakers mobile app.
00:36:25.346 --> 00:36:29.350
And i have so many courses there that teach you supernatural ministry
00:36:30.751 --> 00:36:34.355
And how you can unlock the gifts that god has given you.
00:36:35.456 --> 00:36:37.425
I want you to download the mobile app and join a global community of people
00:36:37.425 --> 00:36:41.896
Learning the narrow way, people learning how to operate
00:36:41.896 --> 00:36:45.666
In the fullness of what god has for them, and the gifts of the spirit.
00:36:45.666 --> 00:36:50.137
It's called the breakers of mobile app.
00:36:50.938 --> 00:36:52.840
It's actually entirely free and you can download it now on your device.
00:36:52.840 --> 00:36:56.777
I will see you there.
00:36:56.777 --> 00:37:02.316
Do you ever had
00:37:02.683 --> 00:37:04.185
Those moments where you're like, if i don't stop this cry?
00:37:04.185 --> 00:37:06.654
Yeah. now let it go.
00:37:07.121 --> 00:37:08.222
No. it's like, no, like let it out.
00:37:08.222 --> 00:37:09.624
There are cries and they're like, there is.
00:37:09.624 --> 00:37:11.959
I've learned to recognize what kind of tears are flowing,
00:37:11.959 --> 00:37:15.263
Which comes through some work as well.
00:37:15.263 --> 00:37:16.864
Let me tell you different types of tears. who knew?
00:37:16.864 --> 00:37:20.134
I remember, you know,
00:37:20.635 --> 00:37:23.404
Moments like that or in the and things like that.
00:37:23.404 --> 00:37:25.873
And i think it's one of those.
00:37:25.873 --> 00:37:28.209
It's beautiful. it's a beautiful.
00:37:28.209 --> 00:37:30.578
One of the things that sucks about making decisions that
00:37:30.578 --> 00:37:34.081
Have a, have a huge consequence beyond what you can see is, you know, you put
00:37:35.650 --> 00:37:38.953
There's a time where you're with your work and what you did that was right.
00:37:40.421 --> 00:37:42.757
You know, you put it in the hands of other people to question.
00:37:44.058 --> 00:37:44.925
That's a consequence.
00:37:44.925 --> 00:37:46.093
Didn't stay like that. god redeems.
00:37:46.093 --> 00:37:48.562
But there are parts of that,
00:37:48.562 --> 00:37:50.931
That journey that that were, marred
00:37:50.931 --> 00:37:53.901
Or covered for, for a season,
00:37:53.901 --> 00:37:57.271
Because i put some of that in a vulnerable position.
00:37:58.306 --> 00:38:00.508
And to those parts.
00:38:00.975 --> 00:38:08.182
I'll get there.
00:38:08.549 --> 00:38:09.350
Mariana.
00:38:09.350 --> 00:38:12.987
Well, let me let me say, well, you get it.
00:38:13.888 --> 00:38:15.456
Yeah.
00:38:15.456 --> 00:38:16.724
And if you want to cry, you keep letting it out.
00:38:16.724 --> 00:38:18.459
No, no, but let me tell you why.
00:38:18.459 --> 00:38:20.428
Because i believe that there is an element of vindication.
00:38:20.428 --> 00:38:23.597
You know, the bible talks about wood hayes double.
00:38:23.597 --> 00:38:26.300
You know, it's like when the fire comes, there's things that remain.
00:38:26.300 --> 00:38:29.804
Yeah.
00:38:30.037 --> 00:38:31.305
And those were like irrevocable moments.
00:38:31.305 --> 00:38:32.840
Yeah. of true revival that were filmed.
00:38:32.840 --> 00:38:36.510
Yeah. this is what people understand.
00:38:37.311 --> 00:38:38.779
We didn't do this. and i'm not fangirling right now.
00:38:38.779 --> 00:38:40.381
It's like i have devoted my life to this man.
00:38:40.381 --> 00:38:43.684
Yeah.
00:38:43.918 --> 00:38:45.686
And as a practitioner, i'm saying there was you didn't have a dirac
00:38:45.686 --> 00:38:48.289
Following you around.
00:38:48.289 --> 00:38:49.824
So you can get the next viral clip of you doing revival.
00:38:49.824 --> 00:38:52.126
You did it in the streets, in the local bodegas.
00:38:52.126 --> 00:38:54.795
Yeah, you did it on stage.
00:38:54.795 --> 00:38:56.564
And those services are they only exist in our minds.
00:38:56.564 --> 00:38:59.667
Yeah.
00:38:59.667 --> 00:39:01.168
I don't even think there's archival footage of this stuff.
00:39:01.168 --> 00:39:03.404
Yeah.
00:39:03.637 --> 00:39:04.438
And i just felt like
00:39:04.438 --> 00:39:06.207
That was kind of the last thing i wanted to ask you about for this.
00:39:06.207 --> 00:39:08.275
Yeah, because i wanted to acknowledge you as a revivalist.
00:39:08.275 --> 00:39:13.614
Thank you.
00:39:13.914 --> 00:39:15.349
And i believe history will reflect what i said, and i
00:39:15.349 --> 00:39:18.119
And but i think what happens is, let me say this.
00:39:18.119 --> 00:39:21.856
When you're two steps ahead of people, you're their leader.
00:39:23.023 --> 00:39:25.326
When you're ten steps ahead, you're their martyr.
00:39:26.360 --> 00:39:28.195
And you've always been ahead.
00:39:28.195 --> 00:39:30.564
So it's like, because you chase up ahead what god is doing.
00:39:30.564 --> 00:39:33.167
You're a forerunner.
00:39:33.167 --> 00:39:34.602
And so that's caused a level of martyrdom for you.
00:39:34.602 --> 00:39:37.405
But as somebody who is now living in your yes, i'm living in you're.
00:39:37.405 --> 00:39:41.809
Yes, stewarding
00:39:41.809 --> 00:39:43.778
Many of the people that were a part of that who are now at our various campus.
00:39:43.778 --> 00:39:47.047
They are.
00:39:47.047 --> 00:39:48.282
I just wanted to tell you. thank you. yeah.
00:39:48.282 --> 00:39:50.484
Now you're you're
00:39:50.484 --> 00:39:52.253
You're an amazing place for them to be able to have gone, i think,
00:39:52.253 --> 00:39:55.423
Yeah,
00:39:55.656 --> 00:39:57.191
There's so much about that part of our chapter and story
00:39:57.191 --> 00:39:59.794
That i'm glad that god redeems because we, you know, what we saw here?
00:39:59.794 --> 00:40:05.099
We had never happened.
00:40:05.599 --> 00:40:06.634
Yeah.
00:40:06.634 --> 00:40:08.536
And and that's not something that i'm going to always necessarily say, but
00:40:08.536 --> 00:40:10.971
When when your mistakes can have people
00:40:11.772 --> 00:40:15.142
Almost try to reduce a move of god to some salacious thing, that's half true.
00:40:16.677 --> 00:40:19.914
Anyway, it's one of those things where you want to remind people
00:40:19.914 --> 00:40:23.417
When they're on that doorstep of sin that's going to destroy stuff,
00:40:23.417 --> 00:40:26.887
Really count that cost, you know, because there's like.
00:40:28.022 --> 00:40:34.995
You know.
00:40:35.296 --> 00:40:44.071
Neither of us do, like, structured interview stuff.
00:40:45.105 --> 00:40:48.909
Yeah.
00:40:49.143 --> 00:40:49.977
And i'm getting it now
00:40:49.977 --> 00:40:52.079
Because i would have seen this question come and be like, mike, i'm not doing it.
00:40:52.079 --> 00:40:53.347
Not with a million. no. no frickin way.
00:40:53.347 --> 00:40:55.850
Yeah, we did it. we did prepare for this.
00:40:56.750 --> 00:40:58.118
No, i think i think it's just a it's a beautiful.
00:40:58.118 --> 00:41:00.688
Like when god gives you something to steward,
00:41:00.688 --> 00:41:03.290
Count the cost
00:41:03.657 --> 00:41:04.725
And, and, and it's hard to hear.
00:41:04.725 --> 00:41:08.195
If i would have, if i would have been on the other side of this
00:41:09.396 --> 00:41:11.465
Listening to someone have this convo,
00:41:11.465 --> 00:41:13.133
I probably would have said, well, i am counting it, but i look,
00:41:13.133 --> 00:41:15.970
I look back at that era and it just, there's so many amazing people.
00:41:15.970 --> 00:41:19.773
You know, i saw god do so much where some people ask, you know, how did you get up?
00:41:21.442 --> 00:41:24.845
I mean, you've seen what i've seen, brother.
00:41:25.746 --> 00:41:26.914
Like i'm not.
00:41:26.914 --> 00:41:28.849
God didn't fail me.
00:41:28.849 --> 00:41:29.917
Yeah, like i a day, right?
00:41:29.917 --> 00:41:33.354
What we saw, i was just so blessed to be a part of that.
00:41:34.488 --> 00:41:36.290
And i remember services like that.
00:41:36.290 --> 00:41:38.192
I remember seeing the tangible presence of god change people's lives. and,
00:41:38.192 --> 00:41:42.897
Yeah, it's a it's a it's a beautiful feeling.
00:41:43.797 --> 00:41:46.233
I have this thinking about,
00:41:46.233 --> 00:41:49.169
Even some of the mantle of that, that god has bestowed on you
00:41:49.169 --> 00:41:52.973
And what you're doing and, and stuff that we we were not we didn't do like the,
00:41:52.973 --> 00:41:57.545
The gift that you have right now to reach people digitally is really special.
00:41:57.545 --> 00:42:02.449
But yeah, i think i think when i think about revival,
00:42:03.551 --> 00:42:06.754
We serve a god that can, in the blink of an eye,
00:42:07.721 --> 00:42:11.158
Turn anything around, any situation, around any mistake.
00:42:12.259 --> 00:42:14.161
I am proof of that.
00:42:14.161 --> 00:42:15.663
Like i, i always tell people like, i'm 46, i'm not 96.
00:42:15.663 --> 00:42:20.568
Come on.
00:42:20.834 --> 00:42:22.303
Like the there's our stories are long in everybody.
00:42:22.303 --> 00:42:25.105
I have a chapter of mine that was that was
00:42:26.006 --> 00:42:27.474
That was hard and it happened to be really public.
00:42:27.474 --> 00:42:29.310
But the outweighing memory and gratitude i have to be a part of,
00:42:29.310 --> 00:42:33.814
Like when people speculate or try to judge stories they don't know,
00:42:33.814 --> 00:42:38.152
It's human nature
00:42:38.586 --> 00:42:40.588
To just take the little bit of information you have and just, yeah, destroy it.
00:42:40.588 --> 00:42:42.289
Try to destroy somebody's whole life.
00:42:42.289 --> 00:42:44.091
Not when you seen the stuff that you and i have seen.
00:42:44.091 --> 00:42:46.927
Yeah.
00:42:46.927 --> 00:42:48.495
And and i'm, i'm really grateful that, you know, new york has,
00:42:48.495 --> 00:42:51.532
As men have integrity that are stewarding that platform well. and,
00:42:51.532 --> 00:42:56.437
I, i'm, i'm grateful for
00:42:56.937 --> 00:42:58.772
The, for the new york time that we spent on, on the battlefields.
00:42:58.772 --> 00:43:02.543
But i think i'm trying to go back to the, the impetus of my floodgate to your issue
00:43:02.543 --> 00:43:07.948
That i was about to have it just because it's that that lane is open, you know it.
00:43:09.583 --> 00:43:13.754
You run in it, you stay in it.
00:43:14.388 --> 00:43:15.723
And i could i mean, there's a huge lane
00:43:15.723 --> 00:43:19.460
That is still waiting to be occupied by many people
00:43:20.461 --> 00:43:22.329
Who are willing, just to be faithful, to step out like you come in here.
00:43:22.329 --> 00:43:26.333
I mean, we're in your house in queens, overlooking the greatest city on earth.
00:43:26.333 --> 00:43:30.237
If you would have told you.
00:43:30.838 --> 00:43:32.339
Yeah, ten years ago. mike, this is this is your story.
00:43:32.339 --> 00:43:34.675
You would have been like, yeah.
00:43:34.675 --> 00:43:36.744
And if he's done it for, you can do it for anybody.
00:43:36.744 --> 00:43:39.146
If you'd done it for me.
00:43:39.146 --> 00:43:40.214
Yeah.
00:43:40.214 --> 00:43:42.116
Even this chapter, if you'd done it for me like i as i sit here today,
00:43:42.116 --> 00:43:43.951
I have a wife, i have a family that's better than they've ever been.
00:43:45.285 --> 00:43:47.388
I have like so, even through all that mess and destruction, that's how faithful
00:43:47.388 --> 00:43:51.425
Our god is.
00:43:51.425 --> 00:43:52.993
So i'm not an example of what happens when somebody messes up.
00:43:52.993 --> 00:43:55.462
You know, i think i hope i will always be an example of somebody who presses in
00:43:56.997 --> 00:44:00.100
And regardless of the circumstances, regardless of the sin, regardless
00:44:01.502 --> 00:44:03.971
Of what you've been faced with, you know, there's nothing that can hold down
00:44:03.971 --> 00:44:07.307
A man or woman of god that chooses to put their hand up again.
00:44:07.307 --> 00:44:10.711
Yeah, and that's that's kind of a message i've enjoyed leaning.
00:44:11.912 --> 00:44:13.881
I've been the guy on the front of the stage, heaving my guts out for a season.
00:44:13.881 --> 00:44:17.651
Right now, i'm a i'm a guy in a different position, still with the same passion.
00:44:17.651 --> 00:44:21.689
Being able to say, hey, by the way, i don't know what you're going through.
00:44:21.689 --> 00:44:24.692
I don't know why you clicked on this interview,
00:44:24.692 --> 00:44:26.727
But the whatever's happened to your story, it's not a period.
00:44:26.727 --> 00:44:30.798
Yeah.
00:44:31.031 --> 00:44:32.599
There's a there's a there's a page to be turned, you know,
00:44:32.599 --> 00:44:34.401
But thank you for your kind words and for your love and your support.
00:44:34.401 --> 00:44:36.570
And i love watching, what you're doing. and,
00:44:36.570 --> 00:44:40.207
Here's to the next million people.
00:44:40.974 --> 00:44:43.010
Because here's the thing about you and numbers, brother.
00:44:43.010 --> 00:44:44.878
You don't.
00:44:44.878 --> 00:44:46.447
Numbers represent people.
00:44:46.447 --> 00:44:47.948
Yeah, sometimes the numbers represent money to people.
00:44:47.948 --> 00:44:50.951
That's not mike.
00:44:51.318 --> 00:44:52.853
That's not you.
00:44:52.853 --> 00:44:54.321
And, i don't know.
00:44:54.321 --> 00:44:55.689
That's why god's going to keep on blessing it. so,
00:44:55.689 --> 00:44:58.192
Yeah, man, i'm grateful to be your friend.
00:44:58.192 --> 00:45:00.227
I don't appreciate you making me trigger cry out of nowhere.
00:45:00.227 --> 00:45:04.198
Well, i was trying to hold it together because i'm about to.
00:45:05.399 --> 00:45:06.300
I almost lost them.
00:45:06.300 --> 00:45:07.768
Like one of us has to keep this thing going because.
00:45:07.768 --> 00:45:10.137
But you know what, man?
00:45:10.137 --> 00:45:12.206
As we wrap up, and i thank you for each and every one of you tuning in, you got to
00:45:12.206 --> 00:45:14.975
Share this message.
00:45:15.442 --> 00:45:17.411
It's going to i know it's helped you, but it's going to help somebody else.
00:45:17.411 --> 00:45:19.213
You know, the thing.
00:45:19.680 --> 00:45:20.647
And i'll just end on this is,
00:45:20.647 --> 00:45:23.584
I love the idea of turn the page.
00:45:24.318 --> 00:45:25.853
The fact that you're, you're calling me man of integrity.
00:45:25.853 --> 00:45:29.089
That did something to me because i go back to 15 years ago.
00:45:30.224 --> 00:45:32.893
Yeah.
00:45:33.127 --> 00:45:34.862
Whoever, maybe more now or whatever was bella was two years old.
00:45:34.862 --> 00:45:36.797
That story where my wife left me and, you know, where i alcoholic my kid, you know.
00:45:38.465 --> 00:45:42.136
Yeah. it's like to to fast forward.
00:45:42.870 --> 00:45:45.506
Yeah.
00:45:45.506 --> 00:45:47.241
And it's like, it people probably watching can't even imagine me
00:45:47.241 --> 00:45:49.810
Being that dude, which is crazy to me, you know?
00:45:49.810 --> 00:45:53.347
And so it's, like, just as equally important to hear that from you.
00:45:54.648 --> 00:45:56.950
Yeah. that the hey, that's my perception. like this is them.
00:45:56.950 --> 00:45:59.553
It's like, you know, when people say like, i hate my signal
00:45:59.553 --> 00:46:02.356
Early, it's like, which version did you me?
00:46:02.356 --> 00:46:03.924
Because i probably agree with you, bro.
00:46:03.924 --> 00:46:05.592
I got like, which version did you me i hate that guy, too.
00:46:05.592 --> 00:46:09.563
It's like the spider man meme.
00:46:10.197 --> 00:46:11.999
You know, when people kind of say, you know, i,
00:46:11.999 --> 00:46:14.101
I didn't really like you, and you want to tell them you didn't definitely know me.
00:46:14.101 --> 00:46:17.704
Whoever you thought you dislike. but go ahead, please.
00:46:18.772 --> 00:46:19.540
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:46:19.540 --> 00:46:21.175
Let me say this because i before you before we log off
00:46:21.175 --> 00:46:24.745
When you use the rat in the garbage thing.
00:46:25.646 --> 00:46:27.347
It's funny because that
00:46:27.848 --> 00:46:29.082
That's a beautiful word picture for, like,
00:46:29.082 --> 00:46:32.119
What ended up on the front pages was the rat in our stories.
00:46:33.287 --> 00:46:35.556
What it was. it was the garbage.
00:46:36.190 --> 00:46:38.725
And the garbage can be cleaned out before the rats come.
00:46:38.725 --> 00:46:42.429
And i think that's a that's a beautiful.
00:46:43.297 --> 00:46:45.032
Could even be a prophetic interjection for somebody right now who
00:46:45.032 --> 00:46:48.168
Maybe, maybe the rats aren't running all over the sidewalk yet.
00:46:49.469 --> 00:46:51.205
But you can you can get somebody in there
00:46:52.105 --> 00:46:55.042
To inspect that, that pile of stuff you have in your soul right now.
00:46:55.042 --> 00:46:59.279
Maybe the rats will never have
00:46:59.913 --> 00:47:01.481
To run over your feet and up on a website, whatever it is.
00:47:01.481 --> 00:47:04.284
Like.
00:47:04.284 --> 00:47:06.053
There's that's the beautiful thing about being a christian that
00:47:06.053 --> 00:47:07.588
That we get to actually say that, like, our god is faithful.
00:47:07.588 --> 00:47:10.624
He's close to the brokenhearted.
00:47:10.624 --> 00:47:12.459
He has never once
00:47:12.459 --> 00:47:14.027
Rejected somebody cry for help.
00:47:14.661 --> 00:47:16.864
Yeah. so i think that,
00:47:16.864 --> 00:47:19.166
If you are searching around your life, what might you be hiding?
00:47:19.166 --> 00:47:22.135
It's a question i love to ask people.
00:47:22.135 --> 00:47:23.670
And then why?
00:47:23.670 --> 00:47:25.105
To maybe take a step forward into.
00:47:25.105 --> 00:47:26.907
Okay, well,
00:47:26.907 --> 00:47:27.808
If those guys on
00:47:27.808 --> 00:47:29.710
Youtube were saying there's an area that might be garbage filled right now
00:47:29.710 --> 00:47:32.379
That could produce rats someday, well, here it is.
00:47:32.379 --> 00:47:34.481
I don't know, that's a beautiful first step. yeah.
00:47:34.481 --> 00:47:37.284
And i don't care how successful you are. whatever.
00:47:37.284 --> 00:47:39.286
I had a measure of whatever in my life, and i had a giant.
00:47:39.286 --> 00:47:43.223
You know what i thought was a small piece of garbage was a dump.
00:47:44.524 --> 00:47:47.027
Yeah. rocking seagulls flying around.
00:47:47.828 --> 00:47:49.463
Yes. amen.
00:47:49.463 --> 00:47:50.764
I 104, you know, built right underneath it.
00:47:50.764 --> 00:47:53.667
So new york reference.
00:47:54.167 --> 00:47:56.003
But, yeah, i
00:47:56.336 --> 00:47:57.905
Think it could be a beautiful thing to just start to inspect.
00:47:57.905 --> 00:48:00.307
And you don't you don't have to have carnage to have breakthrough.
00:48:01.642 --> 00:48:03.710
Yeah.
00:48:03.944 --> 00:48:04.711
These two things.
00:48:04.711 --> 00:48:05.812
And i have to come together. yeah.
00:48:05.812 --> 00:48:07.047
Are we tag team for each end to end.
00:48:07.047 --> 00:48:09.049
Well, i mean anything and just to say because that garbage for me
00:48:09.049 --> 00:48:13.654
When when i look back at it, it was like your dad died prematurely.
00:48:15.022 --> 00:48:17.658
Mike, do you believe you'll die prematurely?
00:48:17.658 --> 00:48:20.994
And then there's that feeling creating nihilism, despair.
00:48:22.162 --> 00:48:24.798
Then do you not care?
00:48:25.299 --> 00:48:26.433
Because when you can't see a future,
00:48:26.433 --> 00:48:27.968
I mean, discipline is really just vision reverse engineered.
00:48:27.968 --> 00:48:31.872
So it's like, hey, i see myself getting here.
00:48:32.806 --> 00:48:34.574
So now i'm disciplined because i'm reverse engineering that vision.
00:48:34.574 --> 00:48:37.477
But when i lost a vision,
00:48:38.045 --> 00:48:39.980
I was like, what if i die young like my dad, like my grandpa, like my great?
00:48:39.980 --> 00:48:42.416
And it was like it was them, but the guard.
00:48:43.317 --> 00:48:44.918
So i think when you look down,
00:48:44.918 --> 00:48:46.787
You're like, it's garbage, but that's a water bottle.
00:48:46.787 --> 00:48:49.623
That's a gun, you know?
00:48:49.623 --> 00:48:51.491
And you i think a lot of counseling is like, let's talk about what it is.
00:48:51.491 --> 00:48:54.861
Yeah. it's not just a water bottle.
00:48:54.861 --> 00:48:56.430
Yeah.
00:48:56.430 --> 00:48:58.198
It's actually so there's some views of my past, you know, what have you.
00:48:58.198 --> 00:49:00.567
Yeah.
00:49:00.801 --> 00:49:01.601
This is garbage, pilar.
00:49:01.601 --> 00:49:02.703
And some of that stuff in the pile.
00:49:02.703 --> 00:49:04.705
If i just would have brought out that first water bottle.
00:49:04.705 --> 00:49:06.873
Yeah, that's actually not a water bottle. yeah.
00:49:06.873 --> 00:49:09.710
You got sexually abused when you were a kid. yeah.
00:49:09.710 --> 00:49:12.012
So that's going to affect you.
00:49:12.012 --> 00:49:13.914
Yeah. oh, there it is in high school. there it is in college.
00:49:13.914 --> 00:49:16.049
There it is. and you got saved. there it is. after you were saved.
00:49:16.049 --> 00:49:18.218
There it is as a preacher.
00:49:18.218 --> 00:49:19.519
There it is. as is the same water bottle. yeah.
00:49:19.519 --> 00:49:22.189
And so maybe you start getting that stuff checked before it becomes a,
00:49:22.189 --> 00:49:26.593
You know, a public dump.
00:49:27.094 --> 00:49:28.962
But that's that's a beautiful, beautiful thing to put your finger on.
00:49:28.962 --> 00:49:31.331
So we are garbage collectors today.
00:49:31.331 --> 00:49:33.567
I love you guys so much, carl.
00:49:33.567 --> 00:49:35.502
It's a pleasure. me.
00:49:35.502 --> 00:49:36.303
Love you. thank you.
00:49:36.303 --> 00:49:38.038
Such an honor. until next time. yeah.
00:49:38.038 --> 00:49:41.141
I really
00:49:41.408 --> 00:49:42.809
Want to thank you for supporting this ministry.
00:49:42.809 --> 00:49:45.278
Pray about what god would have you do.
00:49:46.113 --> 00:49:47.481
We don't tell people what to give.
00:49:47.481 --> 00:49:49.349
What we do love to talk about is the amazing, life saving projects
00:49:49.349 --> 00:49:53.787
That we do around the united states and around the world,
00:49:53.787 --> 00:49:57.057
Whether it's distributing the gospel
00:49:57.824 --> 00:49:59.393
In non-christian nations, even underground church networks,
00:49:59.393 --> 00:50:03.463
Or providing disaster relief to areas most affected around the united states,
00:50:04.965 --> 00:50:08.335
Many lives are being changed because of your generosity.
00:50:09.469 --> 00:50:15.642
Your.
00:50:15.876 --> 00:50:15.876

Mike Sognorelli - Carl Lentz On Spiritual Warfare, NYC, & The Fight For His Life

January 9, 2026 | 51:3

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