Praise

Henry Cloud: The Power of Setting Limits | Praise

October 20, 2025 | 58:27

Join Dr. Henry Cloud, a clinical psychologist and best-selling author, as he delves into the complex world of boundaries and relationships. " From navigating personal struggles to understanding God's will, Dr. Cloud and host Sheila Walsh offer insights and guidance to help viewers overcome challenges and find strength in their spiritual lives. Through engaging conversations and real-life examples, they explore the transformative power of setting healthy boundaries and the importance of seeking help and support from those around you. Get ready to discover a new perspective on life, love, and faith with the invaluable teachings.

#Author #Boundaries #Bible #Truth #SpiritualGrowth #Relationships #Anger #Emotion #EmotionalHealth #Peopleinyourlife #TrustGod #Faith #Giving

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Praise | Henry Cloud: The Power of Setting Limits | Praise | October 20, 2025

Male announcer: coming up tonight on "praise."
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Dr. henry cloud: god's ways are always fueled by relationship.
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They're never fueled by choices.
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And we have a theology, drives me crazy.
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I don't know how many sermons i hear and it's all about
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Making choices.
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The biblical theology is the fruits of choice come out of the
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Power of relationship and love that built your choice muscle to
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Be able to take that next hard step.
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And we're asking people to make choices sometimes when they're
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Too weak to make them on their own and they've got
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To have help.
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♪♪♪
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Announcer: tonight on "praise" from dallas clinical
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Psychologist, new york times bestselling author and
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Leadership expert dr. henry cloud.
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And now your host, sheila walsh.
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Sheila walsh: hey everybody, thank you so much for joining
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Me tonight.
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And i think you're gonna be very glad that you did.
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Do you ever have verses that you read that you think, okay,
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This is in god's word, so this is the truth.
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But how do i apply that to my actual day to day, sunday
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Through saturday life?
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Well, this verse i wanna talk about is found in romans
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Chapter 12.
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If you haven't read the book of romans recently, honestly,
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Do yourself a favor.
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It is fantastic.
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But this verse in particular, this is romans 12, verse 2, and
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It says this, "don't copy the behavior and customs of this
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World, but let god transform you into a new person.
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By changing the way you think.
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Then you'll learn to know god's will for you, which is good and
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Pleasing and perfect."
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Well, my guest tonight has helped me do just that.
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Henry, it's so great to have you on the show and particularly
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You've been gracious enough to say that we can look
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At "boundaries" again.
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I mean, how many years has "boundaries" been out?
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Dr. henry: it's been a few.
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Sheila: it's been a few and it's sold a few millions.
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Did you have any idea when you and john sat down with this that
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It was gonna be so significant?
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Dr. henry: no, in fact, the reason we wrote it's kind
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Of a funny story.
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I had written "changes that heal."
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Sheila: amazing book, by the way, amazing book.
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Dr. henry: thank you, but "boundaries" is the second
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Section of that book.
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So we would be out there speaking on it and doing events
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And a facilitator we're doing a planning meeting and
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A facilitator said when you guys are gonna speak on "changes
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That heal," what are all the questions about?
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And we laughed and we said, "oh, they're all about boundaries."
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He said, "why don't you write a book on that?"
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And i literally said that's a great idea because you write
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A book on it we'll never have to talk about it again.
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It'll answer the questions.
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But sheila said we didn't, we didn't have a clue the nerve
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That it would touch.
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And it came at a time when you never heard the word boundaries.
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It wasn't part of the common vernacular.
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And the recovery movement was just starting in the church.
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So people were they were talking a little bit about codependency.
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But people would go to that and then they'd be in church and
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They go, what does that have to do with the bible?
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And, you know, that's everything boundaries are all the way
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Through the bible and so that's kind of why we wrote it.
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Sheila: for somebody who might struggle with the word, how do
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You even define boundaries?
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Dr. henry: well, you know, we can get it really simple.
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A boundary is basically a property line.
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So if you have a house or an apartment, whatever it is,
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There's a property line that defines this is your property
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And this is your neighbors and there's a fence usually, right?
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Now if somebody steps over the fence, what do we call that?
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Sheila: trespassing.
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Dr. henry: trespassing, the bible says, "forgive us our
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Trespasses as we," so that's when we step over a line.
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And basically when you think of emotional, spiritual,
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Psychological boundaries, it defines who you are and who
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You're not, who other people are.
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Now the bible talks about--it doesn't tell us to be control
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Freaks except in one area, self-control.
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When people step over the fence, they try to control you or what
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They're not taking care of in their own yard falls into your
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Yard, their irresponsibility, their addiction, their rage
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Attacks, that gets over the fence into your head and that's
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Where there should be a clear boundary.
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And that's basically the simplest way to look at it.
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You're to control yourself, other people are not
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To control you.
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Sheila: where i think it can get confusing for a lot of people is
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And it shouldn't be.
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I mean, it should be the clearest when you combine it
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With christianity, but i've heard that from a lot of people
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Like, well, that's not, that's not a christian concept because
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We're supposed to love everyone.
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How do you speak to that?
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Dr. henry: you can lovingly say no.
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You know, it's really weird.
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The bible has two parallel tracks that run all the way
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Through it, grace and truth.
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In fact, in the psalms it says that righteousness and mercy in
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God have met, they have kissed each other.
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Boundaries are all about speaking the truth, but we're
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Always to speak the truth in love.
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And so there really is no conflict at all in the
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Scriptures about having boundaries and saying no to
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Something that's not good and doing it in a loving way.
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Where people get confused is, you know, you're in a long
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Suffering and be patient and forgiving and all, of course,
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But long suffering hasn't even started yet if we haven't done
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The suffering we need to do to be able to say no and then if
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Somebody's still out of control and all that we engage but we
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Don't participate, we don't enable and that takes some work
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And that's sometimes long suffering.
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Sheila: you know, i was thinking when i was reading through
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It again and i mean, i've read, i've probably read "boundaries"
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Four or five times.
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But reading it again just at this season in my life, it made
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Me reflect on being a child and growing up with, you know, my
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Father died by suicide when i was five.
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And i realized that i didn't know how to set good boundaries
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With my mom.
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Now my mom was not a bad person.
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She was a wonderful person.
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She loved god, but there was just this way of i felt
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Guilty somehow.
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I've been kind of involved in my father's death and i
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Felt guilty.
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I felt responsible.
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So even if i would come home from seminary, instead of
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Feeling like i could go hang with my friends, i felt like
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I should be with my mom, you know, i couldn't say no.
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What do you do when you recognize that some of your
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Boundary issues are actually to do with things that happened
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A long time ago?
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Dr. henry: and the important thing about that is, you know,
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We think of well that event happened a long time ago, but
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What we don't realize is in our growing up years, yeah, events
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Happen, but what they do is they set up patterns and wiring in
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Our brains and our hearts and our minds and our souls.
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And so if you're a lot of times with deeply empathic people,
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They feel for other people so much that they lose themselves
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And they're more focused all the time on how somebody else is
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Feeling don't wanna upset them.
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What can i do to make it and they're emotionally regulating
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Another person.
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And you can't do that.
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It never works.
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And so some of these patterns do go way back.
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You know, david said, "from my youth they dug deep trenches in
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My back."
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I mean, those things remain, but like, you know, the verse you
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Read in romans, god will transform our mind and how we
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See things and we start to see them clearly, then you have to
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Do the right thing and the old tapes--say tapes, how long ago
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Since we had a tape, the old files, digital files in your
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Head will tell you you're doing something bad, you're
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Being selfish.
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How can you do that after all she's done for you and all
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Of that?
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And one of the boundaries steps is when you start to say no and
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They're in a good way and not rescue somebody, the voice in
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Your head is gonna say you're being selfish and you have got
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To stand against that voice.
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Sheila: 'cause what i discovered in my own life is it would
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Actually make me kind of angry but i wouldn't show that.
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You know, i would feel like i couldn't do what i wanted and so
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I would try and appease my mom whether she even wanted it or
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Not i don't even know.
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But it's i feel like i lived a lot of my life with a lot of
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Suppressed anger simply from not feeling like no is
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A complete sentence.
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You get to say no.
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Dr. henry: it is a complete.
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You don't have to justify it.
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You don't have to explain it.
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You don't have to pay somebody for it.
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There's a great verse that describes exactly what you said
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Because when we're talking about this stuff, we're really talking
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About giving, right?
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You're giving your time, you're giving your attention, you're
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Giving lunch that you wanna go do this and you gotta go
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Do this.
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2 corinthians 9 says this, "give as you have purposed in
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Your heart."
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In other words, you're deciding what you're gonna give and what
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You're not gonna give.
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"give as you have purposed in your heart," and then it says
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This, "not begrudgingly or under compulsion."
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Now those two words, sheila: where is that verse?
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Dr. henry: 2 corinthians 9, it's in the context of giving money,
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But it's about giving.
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And the second verse, not begrudge.
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Begrudgingly is when we're not giving, we're giving in to
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Outside pressure and when we do that internally we begrudge it
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And that's anger or under compulsion which is not
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Outside pressure.
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It's inside pressure.
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And either way, you know, it's interesting when you look at all
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The signs of stress way back to hans selier who did the early
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Stuff on this.
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Your emotions really have three levels.
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The top level is what you register as a feeling.
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The second level is what your body is going to show.
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Like you've noticed sometimes somebody's saying, "oh i'm
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Fine," but their body posture, their facial express their body
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Can't hide it.
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Your body knows where you are.
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And then the bottom level is your nervous system that's
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Actually feeling that.
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And so what happens is a lot of people can be so out of touch
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With how that's hurting them and the anger and all of that they
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Don't even feel the top part.
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Some people can see the behavior, but underneath your
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Body knows that you can get sick with chronic internal stress.
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Sheila: in "boundaries," and if you're just joining me, i'm
00:11:24.106 --> 00:11:26.809
Talking tonight to dr. henry cloud, phenomenal relationship
00:11:26.809 --> 00:11:31.313
Expert and addresses a lot of leaders and one of the things i
00:11:31.313 --> 00:11:35.217
Was telling henry before we came on the air, one of the things i
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Love about him is this tremendous understanding of the
00:11:37.386 --> 00:11:40.790
Human spirit, the human psyche, and yet the word of god married
00:11:40.790 --> 00:11:44.994
Perfectly together.
00:11:44.994 --> 00:11:46.362
And going through all the kind of principles because you said
00:11:46.362 --> 00:11:48.597
That you know for everybody, there's principles involved.
00:11:48.597 --> 00:11:51.667
And one of the things you said that i thought was interesting
00:11:51.667 --> 00:11:53.702
Is you said you're responsible to people.
00:11:53.702 --> 00:11:56.839
You're not responsible for people.
00:11:56.839 --> 00:11:59.408
What do you mean by that?
00:11:59.408 --> 00:12:00.743
Dr. henry: well, that is another love part you were talking
00:12:00.743 --> 00:12:02.478
About before.
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You know, there's a law, one of the other laws that we talked
00:12:04.280 --> 00:12:07.817
About in the book is the law of sowing and reaping.
00:12:07.817 --> 00:12:11.287
All right, now god is not mocked.
00:12:11.287 --> 00:12:13.322
Okay, wherever you sow there's gonna be a reaping.
00:12:13.322 --> 00:12:16.125
So if somebody is being irresponsible or somebody is
00:12:16.125 --> 00:12:20.963
An addict, what you find is self-centered irresponsible
00:12:20.963 --> 00:12:26.302
People they are doing things that cause problems for
00:12:26.302 --> 00:12:31.273
Other people.
00:12:31.273 --> 00:12:32.641
And then what we call the codependent or the enabler is
00:12:32.641 --> 00:12:36.345
Taking responsibility and they're the ones reaping
00:12:36.345 --> 00:12:39.849
The pain.
00:12:39.849 --> 00:12:41.183
Somebody doesn't work, somebody else pays their bills, somebody
00:12:41.183 --> 00:12:42.918
Doesn't get sober, so the whole house suffers.
00:12:42.918 --> 00:12:45.721
And they're actually taking responsibility for the out of
00:12:45.721 --> 00:12:51.427
Control life of another person.
00:12:51.427 --> 00:12:53.229
You can't do that because you don't have control of them.
00:12:53.229 --> 00:12:57.499
So when we say for and to, you've got to take
00:12:57.499 --> 00:13:00.636
Responsibility for yourself and ask, okay, this is hurting me,
00:13:00.636 --> 00:13:06.175
How will i respond to them?
00:13:06.175 --> 00:13:09.912
And then we have control of ourselves and we respond to
00:13:09.912 --> 00:13:15.985
Another person so we are responsible in how we respond.
00:13:15.985 --> 00:13:20.222
We have to do it lovingly, we have to do it the way god
00:13:20.222 --> 00:13:22.524
Says it.
00:13:22.524 --> 00:13:23.859
We have to do it in a way that's gonna hopefully help them, but
00:13:23.859 --> 00:13:26.395
That's what it means to be respo--if you're with an addict,
00:13:26.395 --> 00:13:29.732
You've got to be responsible for yourself and how it's making you
00:13:29.732 --> 00:13:33.335
Feel and what it's doing in your life and the marriage in the
00:13:33.335 --> 00:13:35.204
House and then to be responsible to them would be maybe have an
00:13:35.204 --> 00:13:39.341
Intervention or do the confrontation or maybe have some
00:13:39.341 --> 00:13:42.645
Tough consequences.
00:13:42.645 --> 00:13:44.113
That is being responsible to another person.
00:13:44.113 --> 00:13:46.615
And i can't tell you how many zillions of times when somebody
00:13:46.615 --> 00:13:50.819
Starts to be responsible to somebody and set a limit, not
00:13:50.819 --> 00:13:54.056
Gonna bail you out anymore, this is not helping and all that
00:13:54.056 --> 00:13:57.426
That's when the other person finally has to deal with
00:13:57.426 --> 00:14:00.963
Themselves 'cause they're the only ones that can
00:14:00.963 --> 00:14:03.198
Control themselves.
00:14:03.198 --> 00:14:04.900
Sheila: for somebody who's maybe just tuning in and maybe this
00:14:04.900 --> 00:14:07.136
Concept is even new to them, how do you know if you've got good
00:14:07.136 --> 00:14:11.240
Boundaries or not?
00:14:11.240 --> 00:14:13.175
Dr. henry: well, your body will tell you.
00:14:13.175 --> 00:14:15.511
You feel fatigued all the time and maybe you're saying yes to
00:14:15.511 --> 00:14:18.881
More than more energy.
00:14:18.881 --> 00:14:20.683
I mean it can be good things, right?
00:14:20.683 --> 00:14:22.851
Your body can tell you because of the pain.
00:14:22.851 --> 00:14:25.521
Sometimes some people are getting, i mean, let's face it,
00:14:25.521 --> 00:14:28.924
There's horrible abuse, emotional, sometimes even
00:14:28.924 --> 00:14:32.227
Physical, all sorts of manipulation, and you're not
00:14:32.227 --> 00:14:37.533
Feeling good in that connection with somebody.
00:14:37.533 --> 00:14:41.303
And the first thing we gotta do is there's a verse in hebrews 5
00:14:41.303 --> 00:14:44.573
And i love it.
00:14:44.573 --> 00:14:45.908
It says that solid food like relationships, "solid food is
00:14:45.908 --> 00:14:51.814
For the mature who through experience have had their senses
00:14:51.814 --> 00:14:59.288
Trained to discern good from evil."
00:14:59.288 --> 00:15:02.758
God has wired you with a lot of senses.
00:15:02.758 --> 00:15:05.728
This doesn't feel right.
00:15:05.728 --> 00:15:07.062
This doesn't feel good.
00:15:07.062 --> 00:15:08.430
Why don't i like this?
00:15:08.430 --> 00:15:09.765
And a lot of people feel they gotta get back in touch with how
00:15:09.765 --> 00:15:12.434
They feel and then do something responsible with how they feel.
00:15:12.434 --> 00:15:15.904
Sheila: so let's just take even a parent child relationship and
00:15:15.904 --> 00:15:20.042
Establishing good boundaries.
00:15:20.042 --> 00:15:21.377
When our son was little, you know, things like if he forgot
00:15:21.377 --> 00:15:24.613
A book at school that he was supposed to like say buy i
00:15:24.613 --> 00:15:26.482
Had--said to him, "hey listen, remember you've got test
00:15:26.482 --> 00:15:28.784
Tomorrow you need to bring that book home."
00:15:28.784 --> 00:15:30.452
And told him really clearly and then christian came home and he
00:15:30.452 --> 00:15:33.856
Didn't have it.
00:15:33.856 --> 00:15:35.324
Barry was way better in saying, you know, christian, then we'll
00:15:35.324 --> 00:15:38.560
Just have to see where--whereas i'm like, i'm no, i'm gonna
00:15:38.560 --> 00:15:41.563
Drive around until i find somebody who has the book and
00:15:41.563 --> 00:15:44.400
Which doesn't really do anybody any favors, does it?
00:15:44.400 --> 00:15:46.502
Dr. henry: you know, i'm writing a book right now.
00:15:46.502 --> 00:15:47.836
Would you mind writing it for me 'cause i'm kind of, i'm kind of
00:15:47.836 --> 00:15:50.539
Overworked and i don't know.
00:15:50.539 --> 00:15:52.207
Sheila: i know, i know, i get it.
00:15:52.207 --> 00:15:53.542
I definitely have that in me.
00:15:53.542 --> 00:15:54.943
Dr. henry: okay, i'm gonna liberate a lot of parents here.
00:15:54.943 --> 00:15:59.415
I'm gonna focus on a phrase that you said.
00:15:59.415 --> 00:16:01.383
And if i were president, i would tweet and outlaw this phrase.
00:16:01.383 --> 00:16:05.954
It will not come out of the mouths of a parent ever again.
00:16:05.954 --> 00:16:08.624
You said you need to do this, you need to do that.
00:16:08.624 --> 00:16:12.394
Why?
00:16:12.394 --> 00:16:13.862
He has no need.
00:16:13.862 --> 00:16:15.497
He feels no need to get his book.
00:16:15.497 --> 00:16:17.566
Somebody else is gonna do it for him.
00:16:17.566 --> 00:16:20.202
Now think about this.
00:16:20.202 --> 00:16:22.304
Fourteen year olds on the couch watching video games.
00:16:22.304 --> 00:16:26.075
Mom comes down the stairs and says, "you need to get off that
00:16:26.075 --> 00:16:28.844
Couch right now and you need to go do your homework."
00:16:28.844 --> 00:16:32.147
He's looking at her.
00:16:32.147 --> 00:16:33.482
The kid feels no need to do that.
00:16:33.482 --> 00:16:35.317
It's a crazy maker, okay?
00:16:35.317 --> 00:16:37.619
Now, here's what's much more--his only need is to get
00:16:37.619 --> 00:16:41.457
This screaming lady out of my face, right?
00:16:41.457 --> 00:16:44.726
You've got to transfer the need onto the shoulders of the only
00:16:44.726 --> 00:16:48.797
Person who can do something about it.
00:16:48.797 --> 00:16:50.966
So what if she says, "you know, can i talk to you for
00:16:50.966 --> 00:16:54.470
A second.
00:16:54.470 --> 00:16:55.838
We're gonna go to the lakers game tomorrow, me and dad and
00:16:55.838 --> 00:16:58.507
Your sister and you possibly, but here's who's gonna get to
00:16:58.507 --> 00:17:02.744
Do that.
00:17:02.744 --> 00:17:04.113
Whoever's finished all their chores by 5 o'clock today, we're
00:17:04.113 --> 00:17:06.882
Gonna have an inspection and dad's got some stuff to do,
00:17:06.882 --> 00:17:09.284
I got some stuff too, and, you know, you've got two modules of
00:17:09.284 --> 00:17:12.421
Your homework.
00:17:12.421 --> 00:17:13.755
Now here's the way this works.
00:17:13.755 --> 00:17:15.124
If at 5 o'clock, everybody's done their chores, gets to go,
00:17:15.124 --> 00:17:19.161
But for those who haven't, who choose to not get it done, then
00:17:19.161 --> 00:17:24.800
Do you remember mabel the babysitter from hell?
00:17:24.800 --> 00:17:27.870
Do you remember her?"
00:17:27.870 --> 00:17:29.204
She goes, "well, i've called her," mom goes, "i've called her
00:17:29.204 --> 00:17:31.306
And she's available tomorrow.
00:17:31.306 --> 00:17:32.674
So if you choose not to do yours, you'll get to stay home
00:17:32.674 --> 00:17:36.745
With mabel.
00:17:36.745 --> 00:17:38.180
We'll go to the game.
00:17:38.180 --> 00:17:39.548
We'll miss you.
00:17:39.548 --> 00:17:40.883
We'll have a good time, but i'm pulling for you.
00:17:40.883 --> 00:17:42.251
I hope you get to go with us.
00:17:42.251 --> 00:17:43.585
Okay, i got my stuff to do.
00:17:43.585 --> 00:17:44.953
I'll see you."
00:17:44.953 --> 00:17:46.288
No nagging, no nothing.
00:17:46.288 --> 00:17:47.623
She walks out.
00:17:47.623 --> 00:17:48.991
That kid for the first time something occurs, he has
00:17:48.991 --> 00:17:52.261
A thought that's an improvement, right?
00:17:52.261 --> 00:17:55.764
And you know what that thought is?
00:17:55.764 --> 00:17:58.333
"oh no, i need to do my homework."
00:17:58.333 --> 00:18:02.037
Sheila: so the need comes from him, so he owns it.
00:18:02.037 --> 00:18:04.306
Dr. henry: so when barry said no, let him deal with not having
00:18:04.306 --> 00:18:08.210
It, that's gonna fall on him at school and he's going to
00:18:08.210 --> 00:18:12.314
Realize, you know what?
00:18:12.314 --> 00:18:13.649
I need to do better if life's gonna work.
00:18:13.649 --> 00:18:16.752
Sheila: yeah, i would just like to say to my son, i'm sorry,
00:18:16.752 --> 00:18:19.488
I'm sorry.
00:18:19.488 --> 00:18:20.889
Okay, let's talk about marriage relationships.
00:18:20.889 --> 00:18:23.325
I'm thinking if you know people are like ten, fifteen years into
00:18:23.325 --> 00:18:27.496
Marriage and maybe realize, you know what?
00:18:27.496 --> 00:18:30.165
We don't have good boundaries, we don't have good communication
00:18:30.165 --> 00:18:33.202
Skills, but we're a good way down the path here.
00:18:33.202 --> 00:18:37.673
How do you start in a relationship to have boundaries
00:18:37.673 --> 00:18:42.611
Without becoming like a maniac and making everybody furious
00:18:42.611 --> 00:18:46.682
Around you?
00:18:46.682 --> 00:18:48.016
Dr. henry: the children, they wake up, "mum living with
00:18:48.016 --> 00:18:49.384
A terrorist."
00:18:49.384 --> 00:18:50.719
Sheila: exactly.
00:18:50.719 --> 00:18:52.054
What would be a good first step for people?
00:18:52.054 --> 00:18:53.655
Dr. henry: well, the first step probably is to get alone or and
00:18:53.655 --> 00:18:57.326
Probably with a good trusted adviser who's not involved in
00:18:57.326 --> 00:19:00.662
The role, like a good counselor outside party.
00:19:00.662 --> 00:19:03.298
And just kind of describe what you're becoming aware of and
00:19:03.298 --> 00:19:07.636
Somebody that understands this.
00:19:07.636 --> 00:19:09.605
So here's the areas where i think it's affecting us, right?
00:19:09.605 --> 00:19:15.010
And then to look at first of all the part that you were playing,
00:19:15.010 --> 00:19:20.082
Jesus says get the log out of our own eye first and then we'll
00:19:20.082 --> 00:19:23.352
Be able to even see clearly 'cause a lot of times we can't.
00:19:23.352 --> 00:19:28.023
And so look at, okay, what am i doing to enable this and what,
00:19:28.023 --> 00:19:33.161
You know, what are the issues?
00:19:33.161 --> 00:19:35.631
And then sit down and figure out kind of like the best way to
00:19:35.631 --> 00:19:40.902
Start that conversation.
00:19:40.902 --> 00:19:42.604
Then what is important is have that conversation at a time when
00:19:42.604 --> 00:19:47.909
It's not happening.
00:19:47.909 --> 00:19:50.312
'cause people will try to do it in the middle of a conflict
00:19:50.312 --> 00:19:54.349
Unannounced, they're not prepared, they get overwhelmed.
00:19:54.349 --> 00:19:57.953
Sit down and say, "you know, i've been thinking about our
00:19:57.953 --> 00:20:00.589
Relationship," and make it about yourself.
00:20:00.589 --> 00:20:04.793
Say, "there's some there's some things that we do that i'm
00:20:04.793 --> 00:20:10.198
Realizing they're hurting me.
00:20:10.198 --> 00:20:14.369
There's some things that happen that sometimes make me move away
00:20:14.369 --> 00:20:20.776
From you or make me feel not close to you and i wanna feel
00:20:20.776 --> 00:20:26.581
Close to you and i think you do too.
00:20:26.581 --> 00:20:30.752
And so i wanna talk about those.
00:20:30.752 --> 00:20:33.689
And i'm sure maybe there's some things that i do and let's just
00:20:33.689 --> 00:20:37.259
Talk about these areas."
00:20:37.259 --> 00:20:39.127
Now sometimes sheila, unfortunately, you can't have
00:20:39.127 --> 00:20:44.966
A conversation like that because what's going on is so bad and
00:20:44.966 --> 00:20:50.939
The person might even be dangerous and if you're ever,
00:20:50.939 --> 00:20:55.010
You know, if you're physically being abused or in danger of
00:20:55.010 --> 00:20:59.481
That you've got to get to a safe place.
00:20:59.481 --> 00:21:01.850
You know, you've got to have some other people protect you
00:21:01.850 --> 00:21:04.720
And stand with you.
00:21:04.720 --> 00:21:07.489
But most times you can talk about it.
00:21:07.489 --> 00:21:08.990
Now if that conversation doesn't go well, and you run into
00:21:08.990 --> 00:21:13.862
Defensiveness, denial, all that kind of stuff then what you
00:21:13.862 --> 00:21:18.567
Probably should do is say, "you know what?
00:21:18.567 --> 00:21:23.038
I'm noticing we don't do well talking about this together.
00:21:23.038 --> 00:21:29.010
I want us to go talk to a good marriage counselor, talk to
00:21:29.010 --> 00:21:32.781
Our pastor."
00:21:32.781 --> 00:21:34.383
And then if he or she says, "well, i'm not going to
00:21:34.383 --> 00:21:37.652
Marriage counseling.
00:21:37.652 --> 00:21:39.020
I don't need that."
00:21:39.020 --> 00:21:40.355
Then i would say, "well, i'm gonna go to
00:21:40.355 --> 00:21:43.091
Marriage counseling."
00:21:43.091 --> 00:21:46.094
Sheila: you wanna show up?
00:21:46.094 --> 00:21:48.497
Dr. henry: "i'm gonna be talking about our relationship.
00:21:48.497 --> 00:21:51.366
It's probably going to affect you, so i would think you'd
00:21:51.366 --> 00:21:55.604
Probably do well to come with me, but if you don't, then i am
00:21:55.604 --> 00:21:58.740
Gonna go.
00:21:58.740 --> 00:22:00.075
We'll go talk to the pastor about this."
00:22:00.075 --> 00:22:02.110
Sheila: you know what i love about that henry is it's really
00:22:02.110 --> 00:22:04.312
Basically setting up a win-win situation as opposed to i've
00:22:04.312 --> 00:22:07.716
Learned new rules and you're gonna, you're gonna follow them,
00:22:07.716 --> 00:22:11.019
You know, no matter what.
00:22:11.019 --> 00:22:12.387
It gives the opportunity.
00:22:12.387 --> 00:22:13.789
And i love too that you say you don't do it when you're in the
00:22:13.789 --> 00:22:16.258
Middle of something, you know, because the temperature's too
00:22:16.258 --> 00:22:19.194
High, you know, it's just--
00:22:19.194 --> 00:22:20.562
Dr. henry: it's too high you're gonna fight or fly, you're gonna
00:22:20.562 --> 00:22:22.230
React, you're gonna withdraw, or you're gonna freeze.
00:22:22.230 --> 00:22:24.466
And it's really important that you know from the outset,
00:22:24.466 --> 00:22:32.174
Boundaries are not about ending relationships.
00:22:32.174 --> 00:22:36.645
Boundaries are about making relationships work.
00:22:36.645 --> 00:22:39.714
Boundaries are in the service of love.
00:22:39.714 --> 00:22:42.384
When god instituted this whole thing about relationship, what
00:22:42.384 --> 00:22:47.756
Did he do?
00:22:47.756 --> 00:22:49.391
Go through leviticus.
00:22:49.391 --> 00:22:50.759
He gave us all of these principles as moses says, so
00:22:50.759 --> 00:22:55.931
That it will go well with us and we can prosper.
00:22:55.931 --> 00:22:59.267
And you look through there and what he did was in the law and
00:22:59.267 --> 00:23:04.172
Everything the new testament teaches were about love, but
00:23:04.172 --> 00:23:07.509
Love has a structure to it.
00:23:07.509 --> 00:23:09.544
There is a right way to love and that's righteousness and there's
00:23:09.544 --> 00:23:14.115
A wrong way to love.
00:23:14.115 --> 00:23:15.484
And what the boundaries do are get relationships on the right
00:23:15.484 --> 00:23:18.954
Track so the love can grow.
00:23:18.954 --> 00:23:21.523
Because remember, love can only prosper where there's freedom.
00:23:21.523 --> 00:23:25.927
And if somebody's controlling another person that's
00:23:25.927 --> 00:23:28.530
No longer love.
00:23:28.530 --> 00:23:29.865
That's slavery.
00:23:29.865 --> 00:23:33.235
Sheila: one of the things you say in the book that
00:23:33.235 --> 00:23:34.703
I found really interesting.
00:23:34.703 --> 00:23:36.037
I wrote myself a couple of notes.
00:23:36.037 --> 00:23:37.839
But you said, "boundaries help protect what's most important,"
00:23:37.839 --> 00:23:42.277
But how do they protect our spiritual lives and our
00:23:42.277 --> 00:23:44.913
Relationship with god because that to me is huge?
00:23:44.913 --> 00:23:48.083
Dr. henry: well, that's the biggest deal, right?
00:23:48.083 --> 00:23:52.754
And when what there's so many things to protect our spiritual
00:23:52.754 --> 00:23:57.859
Life with god first of all is the connection, right?
00:23:57.859 --> 00:24:01.363
And he's the vine and we're the branches and we've got to abide
00:24:01.363 --> 00:24:05.233
In him.
00:24:05.233 --> 00:24:06.635
But when we're abiding in him, we are abiding in his truth and
00:24:06.635 --> 00:24:12.641
We're connected with the way that he would do things.
00:24:12.641 --> 00:24:16.011
Well, internally when we start to give ourselves over to
00:24:16.011 --> 00:24:23.218
Another person's control or something like that, we've kind
00:24:23.218 --> 00:24:27.989
Of disconnected internally from god and that's a move away.
00:24:27.989 --> 00:24:33.895
You know, jesus, they say one time you don't give in anybody,
00:24:33.895 --> 00:24:37.399
You just speak what is true, okay.
00:24:37.399 --> 00:24:40.535
He was about love, but he did that.
00:24:40.535 --> 00:24:43.838
And communion with god, communion with each other,
00:24:43.838 --> 00:24:47.042
Especially with god is going to always be when we're standing in
00:24:47.042 --> 00:24:52.380
Him and in his truth and from there we speak.
00:24:52.380 --> 00:24:58.853
You're talking about marriage or other, you know, relationships
00:24:58.853 --> 00:25:01.489
Like that.
00:25:01.489 --> 00:25:02.824
I was on a plane and talking about god's word how it orders
00:25:02.824 --> 00:25:05.460
All of this.
00:25:05.460 --> 00:25:06.928
Oh my gosh, the last thing you wanna do if you're on a plane is
00:25:06.928 --> 00:25:11.700
When somebody says, "so what do you do dude?"
00:25:11.700 --> 00:25:13.301
Don't say you're a psychologist.
00:25:13.301 --> 00:25:16.571
Sheila: whole life story coming up.
00:25:16.571 --> 00:25:17.939
Dr. henry: it's coming.
00:25:17.939 --> 00:25:19.274
I mean, it's coming and there's no 55 minute, well, sorry, it's
00:25:19.274 --> 00:25:21.576
Our time for dinner, right.
00:25:21.576 --> 00:25:23.612
So this woman, she goes, "oh, i gotta talk to you about
00:25:23.612 --> 00:25:26.147
My boyfriend."
00:25:26.147 --> 00:25:27.515
And i said, "what's going on with your boyfriend?"
00:25:27.515 --> 00:25:29.117
She goes, "well, we just broke up and i'm devastated.
00:25:29.117 --> 00:25:32.787
I'm always devastated when we do this."
00:25:32.787 --> 00:25:35.357
I said, "what do you mean when do you?"
00:25:35.357 --> 00:25:37.125
She said, "well, we have a pattern."
00:25:37.125 --> 00:25:39.160
She said, "i can't take it anymore and then i break up and
00:25:39.160 --> 00:25:41.997
I miss him so much and i'm so lonely and then i go back and
00:25:41.997 --> 00:25:45.600
It's good for a minute and then it goes back."
00:25:45.600 --> 00:25:48.303
I said, "well, what is it that makes it difficult?"
00:25:48.303 --> 00:25:51.506
She says, "is anger."
00:25:51.506 --> 00:25:53.808
She said, "i just can't live with his anger."
00:25:53.808 --> 00:25:56.144
And i said, "when does he get angry?"
00:25:56.144 --> 00:25:57.746
She says, "when i don't do what he wants to do."
00:25:57.746 --> 00:26:02.117
And if--she said, "i can keep him happy.
00:26:02.117 --> 00:26:04.986
I just do whatever he wants but if i don't do what he wants,
00:26:04.986 --> 00:26:08.690
Then he gets angry and then i can't take it anymore and then i
00:26:08.690 --> 00:26:11.693
Leave we break up."
00:26:11.693 --> 00:26:13.561
I said, "well, you know, there's this old saying that says, "if
00:26:13.561 --> 00:26:16.831
You rescue an angry man, you'll only have to do it
00:26:16.831 --> 00:26:20.468
Again tomorrow."
00:26:20.468 --> 00:26:22.303
And she goes, "what?"
00:26:22.303 --> 00:26:24.172
Sheila: who said that?
00:26:24.172 --> 00:26:25.507
Dr. henry: she did.
00:26:25.507 --> 00:26:26.875
She said, "where did you get that?"
00:26:26.875 --> 00:26:28.443
I said, "it's in the bible, proverbs 19:19, might take a
00:26:28.443 --> 00:26:31.946
Look, probably some other good stuff in there for you too."
00:26:31.946 --> 00:26:35.150
But god has told us all this stuff.
00:26:35.150 --> 00:26:38.386
Now, you said something really profound a little while ago.
00:26:38.386 --> 00:26:44.826
You said, you know, we start to have boundaries or whatever, and
00:26:44.826 --> 00:26:50.098
You said, but somebody says that's not christian
00:26:50.098 --> 00:26:53.001
To have boundaries.
00:26:53.001 --> 00:26:54.335
Do you know how much stuff is not christian or is christian
00:26:54.335 --> 00:26:59.974
That's not in the bible.
00:26:59.974 --> 00:27:02.110
I mean, there are a lot of--jesus said, "you are living
00:27:02.110 --> 00:27:05.380
According to the traditions of your elders, not the oracles
00:27:05.380 --> 00:27:09.884
Of god."
00:27:09.884 --> 00:27:11.219
And we inherit this stuff through the generations and live
00:27:11.219 --> 00:27:14.189
It out as 'cause we're told that's christian,
00:27:14.189 --> 00:27:16.391
That's christian.
00:27:16.391 --> 00:27:17.759
No, it's not.
00:27:17.759 --> 00:27:19.094
It's not.
00:27:19.094 --> 00:27:20.462
Sheila: that goes back to romans to me changing the way you think
00:27:20.462 --> 00:27:22.397
And only god can help you with that.
00:27:22.397 --> 00:27:25.066
I got a--knowing that i was gonna have the chance to talk to
00:27:25.066 --> 00:27:28.436
You today, i jumped onto my facebook page and i was asking
00:27:28.436 --> 00:27:31.673
People, "okay, if you had a chance to sit down with henry
00:27:31.673 --> 00:27:33.775
And talk to him, you know, what would you ask him?"
00:27:33.775 --> 00:27:36.878
And a lot of people, several women said i find it very hard
00:27:36.878 --> 00:27:42.283
To say no and even sundays one or two of them more like
00:27:42.283 --> 00:27:45.854
Spiritually i feel like i should say yes.
00:27:45.854 --> 00:27:48.690
How do you find the balance between wanting to serve, like,
00:27:48.690 --> 00:27:52.360
You know, wanting to be a foot washer for beginners and then
00:27:52.360 --> 00:27:56.264
Becoming--when have you crossed into becoming just the kind of
00:27:56.264 --> 00:27:59.400
Person that says yes to everything and no to nothing?
00:27:59.400 --> 00:28:03.238
Dr. henry: well, it's interesting you say when do you
00:28:03.238 --> 00:28:04.739
Cross over.
00:28:04.739 --> 00:28:06.107
You know, i have never met an infant or a toddler that had
00:28:06.107 --> 00:28:10.211
A problem saying no.
00:28:10.211 --> 00:28:13.314
Sheila: so true.
00:28:13.314 --> 00:28:14.649
Dr. henry: they don't like something and then they learn
00:28:14.649 --> 00:28:16.017
The words, you know, to become the toddler and they go, "no,
00:28:16.017 --> 00:28:18.219
No, no."
00:28:18.219 --> 00:28:19.587
I used to say to olivia, our oldest daughter,
00:28:19.587 --> 00:28:21.856
"olivia, breathe."
00:28:21.856 --> 00:28:23.358
She tell me, no.
00:28:23.358 --> 00:28:24.692
Just kind of to test it, right?
00:28:24.692 --> 00:28:26.628
But what happened, what happened to that natural thing that god
00:28:26.628 --> 00:28:29.831
Built into you, we get talked out of it or we get controlled
00:28:29.831 --> 00:28:35.336
Out of it or some people get abused out of it and that
00:28:35.336 --> 00:28:38.306
Ability to say know exactly what you said that it gets broken and
00:28:38.306 --> 00:28:43.745
That the no muscle is actually broken.
00:28:43.745 --> 00:28:47.415
And it's got to be restored.
00:28:47.415 --> 00:28:50.585
And the first thing you gotta kind of realize is that's
00:28:50.585 --> 00:28:55.056
Really happening.
00:28:55.056 --> 00:28:57.125
And you've got to acknowledge that there is a balance it's
00:28:57.125 --> 00:29:02.063
Throughout the scriptures of how do you serve.
00:29:02.063 --> 00:29:04.899
Great, great example you bring up.
00:29:04.899 --> 00:29:06.734
How do you serve and still have boundaries?
00:29:06.734 --> 00:29:09.270
Well, did you read the story of the codependent good samaritan?
00:29:09.270 --> 00:29:14.676
Sheila: slightly different than my bible.
00:29:14.676 --> 00:29:16.211
Dr. henry: slightly different than your bible, right?
00:29:16.211 --> 00:29:18.479
It goes like this.
00:29:18.479 --> 00:29:19.848
He found the man all beat up.
00:29:19.848 --> 00:29:21.182
He's gonna serve.
00:29:21.182 --> 00:29:22.550
He puts him into the inn.
00:29:22.550 --> 00:29:23.885
He gives the innkeeper money and then he says, "i'm gonna go away
00:29:23.885 --> 00:29:28.890
For a couple of days," to the innkeeper, "and when i come back
00:29:28.890 --> 00:29:31.526
I will take care of the balance," boundaries.
00:29:31.526 --> 00:29:34.529
He's gonna take care of his own needs and his own life while
00:29:34.529 --> 00:29:38.366
He's serving and he's gonna serve.
00:29:38.366 --> 00:29:40.602
But the codependent version says, "i'm gonna go take care of
00:29:40.602 --> 00:29:44.873
This," and then the guy goes, "what you're leaving me here?
00:29:44.873 --> 00:29:48.943
That's all you're gonna do for me?
00:29:48.943 --> 00:29:50.912
Don't you see what they did?
00:29:50.912 --> 00:29:52.747
How can you call yourself a christian?"
00:29:52.747 --> 00:29:56.417
And then the codependent samaritan goes, "oh yeah, you're
00:29:56.417 --> 00:29:59.087
Right, i'm sorry, i'm sorry, i'm sorry."
00:29:59.087 --> 00:30:02.090
And then his life goes down the tubes.
00:30:02.090 --> 00:30:05.827
He doesn't go take care of his business.
00:30:05.827 --> 00:30:08.029
He has no money to pay the innkeeper next week.
00:30:08.029 --> 00:30:11.633
Service and boundaries policies do not merely look out for your
00:30:11.633 --> 00:30:17.038
Own interests but also the interest of others.
00:30:17.038 --> 00:30:20.208
There's always a balance.
00:30:20.208 --> 00:30:22.143
I mean, where are you gonna draw the line?
00:30:22.143 --> 00:30:23.678
You gonna stop eating because there's--serving and boundaries
00:30:23.678 --> 00:30:29.117
Have no conflict.
00:30:29.117 --> 00:30:30.485
Sheila: if you're just joining us, i'm talking with
00:30:30.485 --> 00:30:32.520
Dr. henry cloud.
00:30:32.520 --> 00:30:33.888
And so many of you have said that the book "boundaries"
00:30:33.888 --> 00:30:37.792
Because here's you know the sub
00:30:37.792 --> 00:30:39.127
Is "when to say yes, how to say
00:30:39.127 --> 00:30:41.996
No to take control
00:30:41.996 --> 00:30:43.598
Of your life."
00:30:43.598 --> 00:30:44.933
I mean, god has used this book
00:30:44.933 --> 00:30:46.267
In really revolutionary ways in
00:30:46.267 --> 00:30:47.835
People's lives.
00:30:47.835 --> 00:30:49.837
One of the things that i found really interesting and
00:30:49.837 --> 00:30:51.673
Encouraging, you talk about when you come to the place, and
00:30:51.673 --> 00:30:54.642
I don't know if it was in the principle of activity, but it
00:30:54.642 --> 00:30:58.279
Was about the power of acknowledging that you
00:30:58.279 --> 00:31:01.516
Need help.
00:31:01.516 --> 00:31:02.850
That's huge.
00:31:02.850 --> 00:31:04.185
Talk about that.
00:31:04.185 --> 00:31:05.553
Dr. henry: well, it's kind of like--
00:31:05.553 --> 00:31:07.822
Sheila: it's the good news.
00:31:07.822 --> 00:31:09.157
It's not the bad news.
00:31:09.157 --> 00:31:10.525
Dr. henry: it is the good news.
00:31:10.525 --> 00:31:12.560
It all starts with that.
00:31:12.560 --> 00:31:14.395
There's a lot of people running around reliving adam and eve in
00:31:14.395 --> 00:31:19.067
Their own lives saying, "i don't need help.
00:31:19.067 --> 00:31:22.036
I can be wise.
00:31:22.036 --> 00:31:23.371
I can set my own rules.
00:31:23.371 --> 00:31:24.739
I can, you know, who needs god?"
00:31:24.739 --> 00:31:26.407
And they eat of the fruit of the knowledge of good and
00:31:26.407 --> 00:31:28.810
Evil, right?
00:31:28.810 --> 00:31:30.311
But we don't have that ability.
00:31:30.311 --> 00:31:34.615
That's number one.
00:31:34.615 --> 00:31:35.984
When we humble ourselves and say, "god, i may be off
00:31:35.984 --> 00:31:39.854
Kilter here."
00:31:39.854 --> 00:31:41.689
Or we humble ourselves and realize god i am off kilter
00:31:41.689 --> 00:31:47.228
Because i'm suffering.
00:31:47.228 --> 00:31:49.063
I'm in pain.
00:31:49.063 --> 00:31:50.498
This pain is not good.
00:31:50.498 --> 00:31:52.433
God has given us pain as a signal.
00:31:52.433 --> 00:31:55.103
If you step on my toe, my pain is gonna tell me surely you're
00:31:55.103 --> 00:32:02.944
Stepping on my toe.
00:32:02.944 --> 00:32:04.312
Could you not do that?
00:32:04.312 --> 00:32:05.646
That's a boundary.
00:32:05.646 --> 00:32:07.015
But the pain will tell you.
00:32:07.015 --> 00:32:08.983
Listen to your pain.
00:32:08.983 --> 00:32:11.119
Also when we're trying to help another person and helping isn't
00:32:11.119 --> 00:32:16.591
Helping, you may not even be in pain.
00:32:16.591 --> 00:32:19.594
You may be bailing them out one more time.
00:32:19.594 --> 00:32:22.263
You may be trying to get them to get sober.
00:32:22.263 --> 00:32:24.499
You may be nagging them.
00:32:24.499 --> 00:32:25.833
You may be preaching at them.
00:32:25.833 --> 00:32:27.201
You may be doing everything for them.
00:32:27.201 --> 00:32:28.970
You're trying to help, but you've gotta ask yourself, is my
00:32:28.970 --> 00:32:33.775
Helping helping?
00:32:33.775 --> 00:32:35.810
What is the fruit of my continuing to help?
00:32:35.810 --> 00:32:39.447
And if you're seeing a pattern of somebody continuing to not
00:32:39.447 --> 00:32:43.985
Take responsibility for their emotions for their behavior, for
00:32:43.985 --> 00:32:46.687
Their attitudes for their money, all of that stuff, you're
00:32:46.687 --> 00:32:50.525
Helping is not helping and you gotta ask yourself when i
00:32:50.525 --> 00:32:55.296
Say yes, what's it in the service of?
00:32:55.296 --> 00:33:00.034
It fits in the service of them being able to avoid getting
00:33:00.034 --> 00:33:05.473
A job one more time or being able to avoid going to recovery
00:33:05.473 --> 00:33:11.646
One more time or being able to avoid getting control of their
00:33:11.646 --> 00:33:16.150
Emotions one more time.
00:33:16.150 --> 00:33:18.152
You are giving in the service of something bad.
00:33:18.152 --> 00:33:22.790
It's not good.
00:33:22.790 --> 00:33:24.125
Sheila: yeah, it's funny.
00:33:24.125 --> 00:33:25.493
I remember i was in thailand at one point and i was working with
00:33:25.493 --> 00:33:28.029
A doctor friend who works with patients in a leper colony.
00:33:28.029 --> 00:33:32.700
And he said the most interesting thing he learned was how
00:33:32.700 --> 00:33:37.338
Impossible it is if you can't feel pain.
00:33:37.338 --> 00:33:39.941
Because he was talking about those whose limbs no longer felt
00:33:39.941 --> 00:33:42.310
Pain and so during the night they would be injured by rats
00:33:42.310 --> 00:33:45.146
And by different things.
00:33:45.146 --> 00:33:46.514
And he said, "you've no idea what a gift pain is."
00:33:46.514 --> 00:33:49.817
It's real life.
00:33:49.817 --> 00:33:51.185
Dr. henry: it is such a gift.
00:33:51.185 --> 00:33:52.587
It is such a gift.
00:33:52.587 --> 00:33:53.955
You know, i forgot.
00:33:53.955 --> 00:33:55.289
I looked up somebody could google it, how many times
00:33:55.289 --> 00:33:58.426
A toddler falls down when they're learning to walk.
00:33:58.426 --> 00:34:03.131
You know, what if a parent never let them fall, never let them
00:34:03.131 --> 00:34:08.202
Feel the pain of their mistake, and it's in the, i wanna say
00:34:08.202 --> 00:34:12.640
It's like a million times.
00:34:12.640 --> 00:34:13.975
I mean, it is a huge.
00:34:13.975 --> 00:34:16.144
And to not let people realize the consequences when that
00:34:16.144 --> 00:34:21.482
Boyfriend screams at her again and the consequences are she's
00:34:21.482 --> 00:34:25.353
Leaving and she's not coming back until he does what the
00:34:25.353 --> 00:34:28.856
Bible says repents and you see fruit with that, we can always
00:34:28.856 --> 00:34:34.662
Invite people back into our lives, but it always requires
00:34:34.662 --> 00:34:41.102
Repentance that's gonna happen.
00:34:41.102 --> 00:34:44.505
Sheila: one of the things i wondered about was when you and
00:34:44.505 --> 00:34:47.175
John first wrote this book years ago and now in fact i want our
00:34:47.175 --> 00:34:52.013
Viewers to know about this.
00:34:52.013 --> 00:34:53.347
It's called boundaries.me.
00:34:53.347 --> 00:34:55.216
Dr. henry: boundaries.me.
00:34:55.216 --> 00:34:56.584
It's a website, boundaries.me.
00:34:56.584 --> 00:34:59.253
Sheila: boundaries.me.
00:34:59.253 --> 00:35:00.588
So i've signed up for it and it's fantastic, the resources
00:35:00.588 --> 00:35:02.823
That you get, no matter what you might be dealing with in
00:35:02.823 --> 00:35:05.359
Relationships or just in life generally, henry addresses it.
00:35:05.359 --> 00:35:09.430
So boundaries.me.
00:35:09.430 --> 00:35:11.399
Dr. henry: there's over 100 many courses on there.
00:35:11.399 --> 00:35:14.368
If you gotta have a difficult conversation, if you got an
00:35:14.368 --> 00:35:16.304
Addict, you're dealing with a depressed person, you've got
00:35:16.304 --> 00:35:18.973
Anxiety, it's all on there.
00:35:18.973 --> 00:35:20.708
Sheila: yeah, it's fantastic.
00:35:20.708 --> 00:35:22.376
But i wondered, have you noticed it's changed over the years as
00:35:22.376 --> 00:35:26.681
To the kind of issues that people are struggling with from
00:35:26.681 --> 00:35:28.816
When you first wrote about boundaries?
00:35:28.816 --> 00:35:31.452
Has it changed?
00:35:31.452 --> 00:35:32.820
Dr. henry: well, here's what hasn't changed.
00:35:32.820 --> 00:35:36.724
I always talk about our life is like a pie and there's three big
00:35:36.724 --> 00:35:41.395
Slices to our life.
00:35:41.395 --> 00:35:44.265
One is what i call the clinical slice.
00:35:44.265 --> 00:35:47.201
So our emotional struggles, depression, anxiety, fears,
00:35:47.201 --> 00:35:50.104
Addictions, all that stuff, we all have that piece of
00:35:50.104 --> 00:35:53.274
Our lives.
00:35:53.274 --> 00:35:55.042
The second piece is our relational life.
00:35:55.042 --> 00:35:57.478
We all have relationships, family, marriage, dating.
00:35:57.478 --> 00:36:00.248
It shouldn't do marriage and dating.
00:36:00.248 --> 00:36:01.882
Pick one.
00:36:01.882 --> 00:36:03.251
Sheila: no, we generally frown on that too.
00:36:03.251 --> 00:36:04.585
Dr. henry: work relationships, extended family.
00:36:04.585 --> 00:36:06.387
We have a relational piece to our lives.
00:36:06.387 --> 00:36:09.390
And the third is our performance, finding your
00:36:09.390 --> 00:36:11.926
Talents and gifts and reaching goals and dreams.
00:36:11.926 --> 00:36:15.663
That pie hasn't changed at all really.
00:36:15.663 --> 00:36:20.134
We see the same--this is why god's word is eternal because it
00:36:20.134 --> 00:36:24.038
Addresses life.
00:36:24.038 --> 00:36:26.274
What has changed is, and this gets to bigger, bigger issues.
00:36:26.274 --> 00:36:31.279
You know, when i first started working with people, the big
00:36:31.279 --> 00:36:35.916
Boundaries issue was to get them in touch a lot of times and say
00:36:35.916 --> 00:36:43.124
No to everybody else wanting everything from them.
00:36:43.124 --> 00:36:48.562
Well, the boundaries of culture have changed so much that now we
00:36:48.562 --> 00:36:54.602
Find ourselves not getting them to realize the boundaries of
00:36:54.602 --> 00:36:59.940
Getting more for themselves but learning to say no to themselves
00:36:59.940 --> 00:37:04.612
Because they feel entitled to everything.
00:37:04.612 --> 00:37:07.581
And there's so much entitlement where people are demanding and
00:37:07.581 --> 00:37:12.553
Entitled that you have to do this for me and, you know, you
00:37:12.553 --> 00:37:16.490
You you you you that the boundary line we see a lot now
00:37:16.490 --> 00:37:19.727
Is empowering other people to say no, so there's so
00:37:19.727 --> 00:37:24.332
Much self-centeredness.
00:37:24.332 --> 00:37:26.734
It's just getting worse.
00:37:26.734 --> 00:37:28.502
Sheila: you know, it's so interesting.
00:37:28.502 --> 00:37:29.870
I was watching, i said to barry one night, let's do a little
00:37:29.870 --> 00:37:31.972
Kind of study watching commercials and to see how many
00:37:31.972 --> 00:37:35.876
Times the word deserve comes up.
00:37:35.876 --> 00:37:38.979
You deserve this.
00:37:38.979 --> 00:37:40.348
You deserve to have perfect skin.
00:37:40.348 --> 00:37:41.682
You deserve to be 30 pounds.
00:37:41.682 --> 00:37:43.050
And i'm like, where in god's word does it say you
00:37:43.050 --> 00:37:45.453
Deserve that?
00:37:45.453 --> 00:37:46.954
Dr. henry: thank you, thank you.
00:37:46.954 --> 00:37:49.123
You'll say you deserve this and you deserve that.
00:37:49.123 --> 00:37:52.426
Okay, answer this question.
00:37:52.426 --> 00:37:54.895
How in the world will i ever be grateful if everything i have
00:37:54.895 --> 00:37:59.700
I deserve?
00:37:59.700 --> 00:38:01.068
That means i worked for it.
00:38:01.068 --> 00:38:02.403
That means i earned it.
00:38:02.403 --> 00:38:04.672
Gratitude is one of the most health giving stances in life.
00:38:04.672 --> 00:38:08.943
How many times does the bible says, "give thanks?"
00:38:08.943 --> 00:38:12.113
Gratitude realizes, i don't deserve your love.
00:38:12.113 --> 00:38:18.085
I've violated.
00:38:18.085 --> 00:38:19.453
I fail, i fail in every area of life, but the people that love
00:38:19.453 --> 00:38:22.123
Me still thank you for loving me.
00:38:22.123 --> 00:38:24.859
And that takes away the entitlement.
00:38:24.859 --> 00:38:27.294
The other thing about the culture today and we could do
00:38:27.294 --> 00:38:29.530
A whole long show on this one.
00:38:29.530 --> 00:38:33.367
I'm really worried about the parenting narratives that are
00:38:33.367 --> 00:38:39.940
Out there today because they--it's so much is going on
00:38:39.940 --> 00:38:44.612
That has to do with taking agency away from kids or not
00:38:44.612 --> 00:38:51.585
Building the ability to have self-efficacy and responsibility
00:38:51.585 --> 00:38:58.092
And competency because there's so much the helicopter
00:38:58.092 --> 00:39:03.097
Parenting, the don't say no you might hurt their self esteem.
00:39:03.097 --> 00:39:07.768
Sheila: so you end up handicapping your own children.
00:39:07.768 --> 00:39:10.204
Dr. henry: handicapping.
00:39:10.204 --> 00:39:11.839
You're not--and i wanna build self-confidence, good.
00:39:11.839 --> 00:39:16.544
Self-confidence doesn't come from somebody telling me,
00:39:16.544 --> 00:39:19.113
"you're so awesome, you're so great."
00:39:19.113 --> 00:39:21.482
Self-confidence comes from learning to do something and
00:39:21.482 --> 00:39:24.852
Having to do it and then you don't think about it anymore you
00:39:24.852 --> 00:39:27.087
Just go do it.
00:39:27.087 --> 00:39:28.456
I feel confident.
00:39:28.456 --> 00:39:29.790
We don't ever run around--i mean, how many times do you walk
00:39:29.790 --> 00:39:31.559
On this set and go, okay, i gotta get some self-confidence.
00:39:31.559 --> 00:39:35.663
Somebody tell me i'm good.
00:39:35.663 --> 00:39:37.031
No, you walk in there.
00:39:37.031 --> 00:39:38.365
You don't even think about whether or not you're gonna do
00:39:38.365 --> 00:39:39.934
Well because--
00:39:39.934 --> 00:39:41.302
Sheila: i just think about, did somebody get my tea?
00:39:41.302 --> 00:39:42.636
Dr. henry: there you go.
00:39:42.636 --> 00:39:44.038
You've done it 10,000 times.
00:39:44.038 --> 00:39:47.374
And so what does confidence do for us?
00:39:47.374 --> 00:39:50.277
It's based in our abilities then you can stop thinking
00:39:50.277 --> 00:39:54.448
About yourself.
00:39:54.448 --> 00:39:55.816
Am i doing okay?
00:39:55.816 --> 00:39:57.151
Am i good?
00:39:57.151 --> 00:39:58.519
Am i bad?
00:39:58.519 --> 00:39:59.854
How is it?
00:39:59.854 --> 00:40:01.222
And you can do what you do so well.
00:40:01.222 --> 00:40:02.556
You get lost in the living out of your gifts, never thinking
00:40:02.556 --> 00:40:06.060
About the knowledge of good and evil, judging myself,
00:40:06.060 --> 00:40:08.596
Evaluating myself.
00:40:08.596 --> 00:40:10.264
You're just being yourself.
00:40:10.264 --> 00:40:11.599
That's how you were designed.
00:40:11.599 --> 00:40:12.967
Sheila: one of the things i was thinking when after i finished
00:40:12.967 --> 00:40:14.568
Reading your book, i was going back to where paul has that
00:40:14.568 --> 00:40:17.505
Place where he talks about and it's a very strong language in
00:40:17.505 --> 00:40:20.508
The original greek about begging god, this thorn in the flesh.
00:40:20.508 --> 00:40:24.111
But he talks about that literally begging god three
00:40:24.111 --> 00:40:26.747
Separate times to take it away and then discovers the spiritual
00:40:26.747 --> 00:40:30.117
Mystery that in our weakness that he is strong, that his
00:40:30.117 --> 00:40:34.822
Grace is enough for us for whatever we're facing right now.
00:40:34.822 --> 00:40:38.959
Dr. henry: yeah, god said no to him.
00:40:38.959 --> 00:40:41.629
Have you ever noticed god doesn't have a problem
00:40:41.629 --> 00:40:44.265
Saying no?
00:40:44.265 --> 00:40:46.600
Sheila: yeah, or explaining himself when he does say no.
00:40:46.600 --> 00:40:49.136
Dr. henry: job didn't get an explanation.
00:40:49.136 --> 00:40:51.005
He said, because i'm--
00:40:51.005 --> 00:40:52.373
Where did that phrase go?
00:40:52.373 --> 00:40:54.775
That disappeared.
00:40:54.775 --> 00:40:56.544
But it is, it's so true that, you know, we are going to,
00:40:56.544 --> 00:41:04.018
Especially at times experience what feels like i just can't
00:41:04.018 --> 00:41:10.024
Bear this.
00:41:10.024 --> 00:41:11.392
It's too much.
00:41:11.392 --> 00:41:12.726
God, how could you--and we don't understand why he allows
00:41:12.726 --> 00:41:16.030
Things sometimes.
00:41:16.030 --> 00:41:18.365
But you're right, the only way we make it through that is grace
00:41:18.365 --> 00:41:23.237
And his grace is sufficient.
00:41:23.237 --> 00:41:25.472
Now here's the thing that people don't realize about suffering
00:41:25.472 --> 00:41:28.108
And grace.
00:41:28.108 --> 00:41:30.010
They think it's only i'm just gonna lean on god which for sure
00:41:30.010 --> 00:41:34.214
You have to.
00:41:34.214 --> 00:41:35.549
He will give you strength to endure things and to go through
00:41:35.549 --> 00:41:37.451
Things and grow and learn, but god's grace doesn't just come
00:41:37.451 --> 00:41:42.823
From him.
00:41:42.823 --> 00:41:45.092
1 peter says when we are using our gifts and we're loving each
00:41:45.092 --> 00:41:49.563
Other and helping each other and all that, you are administering
00:41:49.563 --> 00:41:53.334
The grace of god in its various forms.
00:41:53.334 --> 00:41:57.371
That's what the passage says.
00:41:57.371 --> 00:41:59.440
When paul was going through whatever he went through, what
00:41:59.440 --> 00:42:03.477
Did he say?
00:42:03.477 --> 00:42:04.812
"god who covers the depressed sent titus to me."
00:42:04.812 --> 00:42:07.915
That's god's grace.
00:42:07.915 --> 00:42:09.550
The people in your life that holds your hand and walk you
00:42:09.550 --> 00:42:12.186
Through whatever you're going through, that's the grace of god
00:42:12.186 --> 00:42:15.823
Who put those gifts in those people never go through
00:42:15.823 --> 00:42:19.293
Suffering like that alone, never.
00:42:19.293 --> 00:42:22.162
God's grace is direct and it's in his body.
00:42:22.162 --> 00:42:25.799
Sheila: i think that's a huge point because i think when covid
00:42:25.799 --> 00:42:28.636
Hit and we all were like little hamsters back in our own little
00:42:28.636 --> 00:42:31.472
Beds, it shifted things.
00:42:31.472 --> 00:42:33.440
And honestly, i feel like something shifted that hasn't
00:42:33.440 --> 00:42:35.576
Kind of unshifted.
00:42:35.576 --> 00:42:37.177
I mean, several things have.
00:42:37.177 --> 00:42:38.545
We can now worship, we go and do things, but there was something
00:42:38.545 --> 00:42:41.615
I think happened internally that people almost were like, you
00:42:41.615 --> 00:42:45.319
Know what?
00:42:45.319 --> 00:42:46.687
No, i've got this.
00:42:46.687 --> 00:42:48.022
I've got this.
00:42:48.022 --> 00:42:49.390
And then realized that there's a difference between being alone
00:42:49.390 --> 00:42:51.058
And being lonely.
00:42:51.058 --> 00:42:52.526
Dr. henry: oh gosh.
00:42:52.526 --> 00:42:53.861
Sheila: what do you--how do you see this whole understanding
00:42:53.861 --> 00:42:56.930
From god's word and from boundaries impacting those who
00:42:56.930 --> 00:42:59.667
Feel like they never quite got back to a healthy place?
00:42:59.667 --> 00:43:02.369
Dr. henry: well, it's a good awareness.
00:43:02.369 --> 00:43:03.704
You know, before covid, the kind of numbers in depression and
00:43:03.704 --> 00:43:07.307
Anxiety and addictions in america, they would always hover
00:43:07.307 --> 00:43:10.544
Around 18% of the population would be diagnosable.
00:43:10.544 --> 00:43:16.050
I think it was about the middle of covid it started.
00:43:16.050 --> 00:43:18.952
That number went up to 40% of americans could be diagnosable
00:43:18.952 --> 00:43:25.359
With either depression, anxiety, or an addiction and so much of
00:43:25.359 --> 00:43:29.930
It came from the isolation, so much of it.
00:43:29.930 --> 00:43:33.801
Our biggest defense against anything bad is relationship
00:43:33.801 --> 00:43:37.504
And connection.
00:43:37.504 --> 00:43:38.872
Number one defense that we have and the most powerful.
00:43:38.872 --> 00:43:42.576
Well, people got into patterns like you're saying.
00:43:42.576 --> 00:43:46.246
And a lot of those patterns now have become kind of patterns,
00:43:46.246 --> 00:43:51.785
Their habits and it's like a fish doesn't know it's wet.
00:43:51.785 --> 00:43:55.022
You gotta wake up, take an audit of your life.
00:43:55.022 --> 00:44:00.094
Look at your week, go up to like a couple of months, but take
00:44:00.094 --> 00:44:04.898
An audit.
00:44:04.898 --> 00:44:06.233
And i'm not talking about just being around people.
00:44:06.233 --> 00:44:09.136
I'm talking about the concentric circles of people that actually
00:44:09.136 --> 00:44:14.041
Nourish you.
00:44:14.041 --> 00:44:16.243
What's the cadence of dosages that you get a real authentic
00:44:16.243 --> 00:44:22.249
Connections where you go in feeling one way and you come out
00:44:22.249 --> 00:44:26.420
Feeling different.
00:44:26.420 --> 00:44:27.821
That becomes a tree of life.
00:44:27.821 --> 00:44:31.125
God says a hope deferred makes the heart sick, but a longing
00:44:31.125 --> 00:44:34.895
Fulfilled it becomes a tree giving life in you.
00:44:34.895 --> 00:44:38.265
When you're sad and you go sit down with one of your buddies.
00:44:38.265 --> 00:44:42.603
I used to watch y'all on "women of faith" y'all were, you know,
00:44:42.603 --> 00:44:45.439
That club of little monkeys in the cage together.
00:44:45.439 --> 00:44:49.042
And you were so vibrant because we all need that community.
00:44:49.042 --> 00:44:55.382
And it's not from the big being around people and being social
00:44:55.382 --> 00:45:00.754
Certainly that's it, but jesus's life, he had the crowds, he had
00:45:00.754 --> 00:45:04.658
The industry he was involved in, religion, maybe carpentry, and
00:45:04.658 --> 00:45:09.229
Then you see these probably 18 or 20 other names that are
00:45:09.229 --> 00:45:12.666
Pretty regulars they maybe come to his christmas party or i
00:45:12.666 --> 00:45:15.836
Guess to his birthday and then you got the small group of 12
00:45:15.836 --> 00:45:20.674
And in the 12 you've got three and in the three you've got one.
00:45:20.674 --> 00:45:25.646
John was the closest.
00:45:25.646 --> 00:45:28.282
Our lives should reflect that.
00:45:28.282 --> 00:45:30.551
So do an audit.
00:45:30.551 --> 00:45:32.386
You know, tory and i have built into the schedule those
00:45:32.386 --> 00:45:36.790
Structures with a group and with a few couples and down to, you
00:45:36.790 --> 00:45:43.864
Know, us but also our individual best friends.
00:45:43.864 --> 00:45:50.737
You've got to have that.
00:45:50.737 --> 00:45:52.506
Sheila: that was a really great lesson for me to learn because
00:45:52.506 --> 00:45:55.876
The first part of covid i actually quite liked 'cause i
00:45:55.876 --> 00:45:58.078
Wasn't traveling anymore.
00:45:58.078 --> 00:45:59.413
Suddenly i was home in my jammies all day watching "great
00:45:59.413 --> 00:46:01.915
British baking show."
00:46:01.915 --> 00:46:03.283
And then i thought this is probably not healthy.
00:46:03.283 --> 00:46:04.818
So then i decided to have daytime jammies and
00:46:04.818 --> 00:46:06.854
Nighttime jammies.
00:46:06.854 --> 00:46:09.323
But then i began to realize that i was kind of spiraling again.
00:46:09.323 --> 00:46:12.392
And i have these three girls, i call them my safe sisters.
00:46:12.392 --> 00:46:15.629
And we because we couldn't meet, you know, regularly together, we
00:46:15.629 --> 00:46:20.400
Would jump on these zoom calls like at least once a week.
00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:23.470
And once or twice i didn't wanna do it 'cause i was just like i
00:46:23.470 --> 00:46:26.473
Was just removing myself a little bit more.
00:46:26.473 --> 00:46:29.943
And they would get on and they'd be like get your butt over there
00:46:29.943 --> 00:46:32.880
And sit down now and join this.
00:46:32.880 --> 00:46:34.481
It would be, it wasn't, "would you like to?"
00:46:34.481 --> 00:46:37.017
It was, "sheila, come on."
00:46:37.017 --> 00:46:38.652
And every single time, henry, every single time i
00:46:38.652 --> 00:46:41.688
Left differently.
00:46:41.688 --> 00:46:43.023
Dr. henry: you know, it's interesting when you don't want
00:46:43.023 --> 00:46:45.459
To, there's some state going inside that needs to be touched
00:46:45.459 --> 00:46:50.731
That you might not even put words to.
00:46:50.731 --> 00:46:53.133
You know, if somebody gets depressed, they lose their
00:46:53.133 --> 00:46:55.636
Appetite, right?
00:46:55.636 --> 00:46:57.404
And if you take that and we're talking about boundaries, here's
00:46:57.404 --> 00:47:02.142
What i always say to people and it's one of the most important
00:47:02.142 --> 00:47:04.845
Things you can realize.
00:47:04.845 --> 00:47:06.313
Boundaries are never built in a vacuum because what are you
00:47:06.313 --> 00:47:11.184
Gonna do?
00:47:11.184 --> 00:47:12.552
You're gonna try to say no and then you're gonna
00:47:12.552 --> 00:47:13.887
Feel guilty, okay?
00:47:13.887 --> 00:47:15.355
You better have--when you go into that difficult
00:47:15.355 --> 00:47:18.825
Conversation, you better have your group to go run to or your
00:47:18.825 --> 00:47:21.561
Safe sister to go run to right after it and you run to them and
00:47:21.561 --> 00:47:25.766
Say, "i'm feeling so bad.
00:47:25.766 --> 00:47:27.167
I didn't bail them out."
00:47:27.167 --> 00:47:28.502
And what are they gonna do?
00:47:28.502 --> 00:47:29.870
They're gonna get you back on track.
00:47:29.870 --> 00:47:32.706
God's ways are always fueled by relationship.
00:47:32.706 --> 00:47:37.144
They're never fueled by choices.
00:47:37.144 --> 00:47:39.613
And we have a theology, drives me crazy.
00:47:39.613 --> 00:47:44.184
I don't know how many sermons i hear and it's all about making
00:47:44.184 --> 00:47:48.622
Choices and the right choice and doing this, which is
00:47:48.622 --> 00:47:52.826
Absolutely true.
00:47:52.826 --> 00:47:54.795
But what empowers our ability to have self-control is
00:47:54.795 --> 00:47:59.266
Relationship and god's spirit and the work that he does and
00:47:59.266 --> 00:48:03.070
The body strengthening one another.
00:48:03.070 --> 00:48:05.572
And if you don't get it that the biblical theology is the fruits
00:48:05.572 --> 00:48:12.813
Of choice come out of the power of relationship and love that
00:48:12.813 --> 00:48:20.787
Built your choice muscle to be able to take that next
00:48:20.787 --> 00:48:24.224
Hard step.
00:48:24.224 --> 00:48:25.625
And there's too many times you don't hear that and we're asking
00:48:25.625 --> 00:48:29.629
People to make choices sometimes when they're too weak to make
00:48:29.629 --> 00:48:32.632
Them on their own and they've gotta have help.
00:48:32.632 --> 00:48:40.507
Sheila: henry, i'm gonna ask if you would pray for our viewers
00:48:40.507 --> 00:48:43.143
Because i think that would be great.
00:48:43.143 --> 00:48:47.381
Dr. henry: i don't know if i can right now.
00:48:47.381 --> 00:48:50.083
You're helping me, okay, i can pull this off.
00:48:50.083 --> 00:48:52.152
You're supporting me.
00:48:52.152 --> 00:48:53.520
Thank you, sheila, for being--
00:48:53.520 --> 00:48:55.022
No, it just, it just hurts my heart to see people here they
00:48:55.022 --> 00:48:59.493
Ought to be doing this and they ought to be doing that.
00:48:59.493 --> 00:49:01.561
That's why in the boundaries book we talk about step one is
00:49:01.561 --> 00:49:05.365
Plugging in.
00:49:05.365 --> 00:49:07.067
You can't do it without the power and you're not gonna get
00:49:07.067 --> 00:49:09.269
The power by yourself.
00:49:09.269 --> 00:49:11.038
So i'm gonna pray.
00:49:11.038 --> 00:49:14.041
Father, we come before you and i just wanna to thank you first of
00:49:14.041 --> 00:49:21.181
All for your word.
00:49:21.181 --> 00:49:23.383
Well, before your word, the word, jesus, you are the word.
00:49:23.383 --> 00:49:28.388
"in the beginning was the word."
00:49:28.388 --> 00:49:31.324
And you came to us and rescued us at our place of need.
00:49:31.324 --> 00:49:38.331
And then you gave us your ways, your word, and i wanna to thank
00:49:38.331 --> 00:49:41.802
You for your word, god, that instructs us in all of these
00:49:41.802 --> 00:49:45.472
Ways that these dilemmas, god, i thank you and i praise you for
00:49:45.472 --> 00:49:49.242
Giving us the lamp unto our feet.
00:49:49.242 --> 00:49:53.013
And god, i pray right now for people who first of all that
00:49:53.013 --> 00:49:58.452
Haven't realized that that you would help them find a way to
00:49:58.452 --> 00:50:04.124
Get into your word and to begin to see the life abundant that
00:50:04.124 --> 00:50:09.763
You have for them according to your ways.
00:50:09.763 --> 00:50:13.133
I pray that you would bring people around them to teach them
00:50:13.133 --> 00:50:16.436
These things, but first god people around them to support
00:50:16.436 --> 00:50:20.340
Them and hold them up where they're caught with people
00:50:20.340 --> 00:50:24.344
Trespassing their brains and their minds and sometimes even
00:50:24.344 --> 00:50:28.315
Their bodies and their possessions.
00:50:28.315 --> 00:50:30.951
Bring community, put them in communities.
00:50:30.951 --> 00:50:33.153
God i pray for churches right now that would even start groups
00:50:33.153 --> 00:50:37.824
To begin to support people in this and for friendships.
00:50:37.824 --> 00:50:42.262
And god we pray especially for you to protect the oppressed
00:50:42.262 --> 00:50:47.033
Anywhere somebody's boundaries are being violated that you come
00:50:47.033 --> 00:50:50.637
In and you rescue them and you promise to do that and awaken
00:50:50.637 --> 00:50:55.609
Them god, to make that hard step to reach out.
00:50:55.609 --> 00:50:59.846
Lo, you stand at the door and knock and we gotta open
00:50:59.846 --> 00:51:03.316
The door.
00:51:03.316 --> 00:51:04.684
And i pray that you would help them to see the voices that are
00:51:04.684 --> 00:51:07.053
Coming in their lives to help them and take advantage of
00:51:07.053 --> 00:51:10.557
Connecting with those voices.
00:51:10.557 --> 00:51:12.893
And we thank you.
00:51:12.893 --> 00:51:14.227
And i thank you for sheila and all that she, all that she has
00:51:14.227 --> 00:51:18.832
Done for so many people for your work in her life and for this
00:51:18.832 --> 00:51:23.937
Network that gets your word to so many people.
00:51:23.937 --> 00:51:26.439
We pray for all of them in jesus's name, amen.
00:51:26.439 --> 00:51:29.442
Sheila: amen. amen.
00:51:29.442 --> 00:51:32.479
Thanks, henry.
00:51:32.479 --> 00:51:33.813
You know, i was thinking this morning before i came in here of
00:51:33.813 --> 00:51:38.218
I spent a month in a psychiatric hospital after my life kind
00:51:38.218 --> 00:51:42.088
Of crashed.
00:51:42.088 --> 00:51:43.456
And i remember the very first morning and it was a christian
00:51:43.456 --> 00:51:46.126
Unit within a hospital.
00:51:46.126 --> 00:51:47.494
And i remember standing with all the other patients maybe i don't
00:51:47.494 --> 00:51:51.164
Know, maybe like 12 of us in a circle.
00:51:51.164 --> 00:51:53.767
And they would go around and say, "hi, my name's john i'm
00:51:53.767 --> 00:51:57.604
Here because of this and my name's susan i'm here because
00:51:57.604 --> 00:52:00.273
Of this."
00:52:00.273 --> 00:52:01.608
And it got to me and i was like, "i'm sheila and i have no
00:52:01.608 --> 00:52:03.710
Idea why i'm here."
00:52:03.710 --> 00:52:05.045
And they were like no we get that.
00:52:05.045 --> 00:52:06.413
We get that.
00:52:06.413 --> 00:52:07.781
So what i'm praying for for each of you is courage, you know.
00:52:07.781 --> 00:52:11.218
It's like because my father was very violent before he died,
00:52:11.218 --> 00:52:15.855
I internalize this message that you can lose the love of anybody
00:52:15.855 --> 00:52:19.926
I mean, if you're not careful.
00:52:19.926 --> 00:52:21.394
If your own father who once really loved you then seemed to
00:52:21.394 --> 00:52:24.331
Hate you if that's possible with god too.
00:52:24.331 --> 00:52:27.100
And so even through most of my life and so much of my life in
00:52:27.100 --> 00:52:30.503
Christian ministry, i would vote myself off the island before you
00:52:30.503 --> 00:52:33.607
Got a chance to.
00:52:33.607 --> 00:52:34.975
Now if you needed me, i'd be there for you, but i never would
00:52:34.975 --> 00:52:37.944
Say help.
00:52:37.944 --> 00:52:39.679
I need help.
00:52:39.679 --> 00:52:41.014
And honestly henry that has been a salvation in my life just
00:52:41.014 --> 00:52:43.683
These few women who know me well enough to--and we're it's not
00:52:43.683 --> 00:52:49.155
Like they're always rescuing sheila.
00:52:49.155 --> 00:52:51.558
I mean, we're there for each other.
00:52:51.558 --> 00:52:52.926
You know, one of us has gone through breast cancer, one of us
00:52:52.926 --> 00:52:55.095
Gone through something else, but it's like there's such joy in
00:52:55.095 --> 00:52:58.898
Being fully known.
00:52:58.898 --> 00:53:00.233
And i think it's the desire of every human being to be fully
00:53:00.233 --> 00:53:03.270
Known and fully loved, but we're so afraid if we're fully known
00:53:03.270 --> 00:53:06.306
We won't be fully loved that we trade away being known.
00:53:06.306 --> 00:53:09.709
And yet i think that's the relationship god invites us into
00:53:09.709 --> 00:53:12.445
To be fully known.
00:53:12.445 --> 00:53:13.813
Dr. henry: one thousand percent.
00:53:13.813 --> 00:53:16.216
You know, he created us and we were naked and unashamed.
00:53:16.216 --> 00:53:20.587
And the first thing that happened and that's where we
00:53:20.587 --> 00:53:23.290
Find ourselves now is in this fallen world, first thing we did
00:53:23.290 --> 00:53:27.360
Was we covered up our shame.
00:53:27.360 --> 00:53:32.265
And it's interesting, you know, the bible, you know, a lot of
00:53:32.265 --> 00:53:35.735
Churches, you can't say this, but i'm talking about the
00:53:35.735 --> 00:53:37.871
Bible here.
00:53:37.871 --> 00:53:39.205
The bible's word for sex is know.
00:53:39.205 --> 00:53:43.243
And not like some church people, you know, it's k-n-o-w.
00:53:43.243 --> 00:53:51.051
Abraham knew sarah and she conceived, okay.
00:53:51.051 --> 00:53:55.355
To be fully known, i think the symbol of the fig leaf over the
00:53:55.355 --> 00:53:59.626
Most intimate part of your body is a symbol of it's the most
00:53:59.626 --> 00:54:06.733
Intimate parts of our hearts, minds, and souls that we feel
00:54:06.733 --> 00:54:11.271
The most ashamed of.
00:54:11.271 --> 00:54:13.340
And that's exactly where we need to take the fig leaf off and
00:54:13.340 --> 00:54:16.476
We've got to open up.
00:54:16.476 --> 00:54:18.078
But that presupposes you're in a safe place.
00:54:18.078 --> 00:54:21.614
And jesus always, always came to people, anybody that was
00:54:21.614 --> 00:54:30.824
Vulnerable, anybody that was broken, anybody that was in sin,
00:54:30.824 --> 00:54:36.296
Anybody that would just say, "i need help."
00:54:36.296 --> 00:54:41.134
That's who he rushes to.
00:54:41.134 --> 00:54:42.769
And we should be the same way.
00:54:42.769 --> 00:54:45.538
Sheila: well henry, i wanna thank you so much.
00:54:45.538 --> 00:54:47.574
I mean, god has used you so much in my own life and in the life
00:54:47.574 --> 00:54:50.343
Of my friends, my family, and my son and my husband.
00:54:50.343 --> 00:54:55.148
We probably owe you money, but we're not gonna give you any.
00:54:55.148 --> 00:54:57.884
But you do need to go onto boundary is boundaries.me.
00:54:57.884 --> 00:55:01.254
Is it dot org or something or just boundaries.me?
00:55:01.254 --> 00:55:03.523
Dr. henry: boundaries.me.
00:55:03.523 --> 00:55:04.891
Not .com, not any dot, boundaries.me and you'll find
00:55:04.891 --> 00:55:08.528
The whole thing there.
00:55:08.528 --> 00:55:10.029
Sheila: yeah, so i did that yesterday.
00:55:10.029 --> 00:55:11.698
I watched a whole series of henry's teachings.
00:55:11.698 --> 00:55:14.467
And here's what i loved very scriptural, very practical,
00:55:14.467 --> 00:55:19.205
Very doable.
00:55:19.205 --> 00:55:20.573
There would be something from each one that you think,
00:55:20.573 --> 00:55:22.308
Okay, lord.
00:55:22.308 --> 00:55:23.643
You know, i'm gonna take this today and think on this.
00:55:23.643 --> 00:55:25.345
I'm gonna meditate on this.
00:55:25.345 --> 00:55:27.247
So i really encourage that.
00:55:27.247 --> 00:55:28.615
And also if you don't have boundaries, then i would so
00:55:28.615 --> 00:55:32.952
Encourage you to get a copy of this book and now there's an
00:55:32.952 --> 00:55:35.321
Updated and expanded version that has tracked with the times.
00:55:35.321 --> 00:55:40.493
But just on behalf of all our viewers and of matt and laurie
00:55:40.493 --> 00:55:44.464
And all our tbn family, just want to thank you for who you
00:55:44.464 --> 00:55:47.634
Are and the way that you have poured your life out into what
00:55:47.634 --> 00:55:51.371
God has called you to do.
00:55:51.371 --> 00:55:52.739
And it's just it's a beautiful thing.
00:55:52.739 --> 00:55:55.408
We're very grateful to you.
00:55:55.408 --> 00:55:57.343
Dr. henry: thank you.
00:55:57.343 --> 00:56:00.413
Didn't start that way, but it was the first step.
00:56:00.413 --> 00:56:03.550
I mean, i was--i wrote about it in my book "why i believe,"
00:56:03.550 --> 00:56:07.454
Which is my testimony.
00:56:07.454 --> 00:56:09.622
It all started when i hit bottom, you know, just like you
00:56:09.622 --> 00:56:13.660
Did and i went into a dark empty church one afternoon and said,
00:56:13.660 --> 00:56:18.731
"god, i don't even know if you're there, but i need help."
00:56:18.731 --> 00:56:21.701
And he showed up.
00:56:21.701 --> 00:56:23.570
Sheila: yeah, that's what he does.
00:56:23.570 --> 00:56:25.038
You admit you need help and god showed up.
00:56:25.038 --> 00:56:27.740
So just remember that we love you, we pray for you.
00:56:27.740 --> 00:56:31.811
On behalf of us all here at tbn, we just wanna say thank you
00:56:31.811 --> 00:56:35.615
For joining us and we'll see you next time.
00:56:35.615 --> 00:56:39.052
♪♪♪
00:56:39.052 --> 00:56:39.052

Henry Cloud: The Power of Setting Limits | Praise

October 20, 2025 | 58:27

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