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The Rosenberg Report

Joel Rosenberg: China’s War on Faith | The Rosenberg Report

June 4, 2026 | 23:5

Joel Rosenberg: China’s War on Faith | The Rosenberg Report
On this episode of The Rosenberg Report, Joel Rosenberg talks to Sam Brownback about China’s war on faith.
#Faith #Culture #Nations #Government #Persecution #Control #Military #Trials-HardTimes #Christianity #JoelRosenberg

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The Rosenberg Report | Joel Rosenberg: China’s War on Faith | The Rosenberg Report | June 4, 2026
  • Tonight on the rosenberg report,
  • 00:00:00.890 --> 00:00:03.226
  • As president trump and his team seek the best way
  • 00:00:03.226 --> 00:00:06.296
  • To win the war against iran and its terror proxies
  • 00:00:06.296 --> 00:00:10.066
  • And end russia's wicked war in ukraine.
  • 00:00:10.066 --> 00:00:13.703
  • A fascinating and powerful new book shines a much needed
  • 00:00:13.703 --> 00:00:17.207
  • Spotlight on communist china's war against christianity.
  • 00:00:17.207 --> 00:00:21.211
  • How bad is it?
  • 00:00:21.211 --> 00:00:22.579
  • Why is it getting worse and what should be done?
  • 00:00:22.579 --> 00:00:25.448
  • It's a one on one interview with sam brownback,
  • 00:00:25.448 --> 00:00:28.418
  • President trump's former ambassador
  • 00:00:28.418 --> 00:00:30.620
  • For international religious freedom.
  • 00:00:30.620 --> 00:00:32.655
  • On his new book, china's war on faith.
  • 00:00:32.655 --> 00:00:35.625
  • And it all starts right here, right now on the rosenberg
  • 00:00:35.625 --> 00:00:39.095
  • Report.
  • 00:00:39.095 --> 00:00:48.271
  • China has declared war, for all intents and purposes, on
  • 00:00:49.339 --> 00:00:53.476
  • People of faith, and christians of all denominations
  • 00:00:53.476 --> 00:00:57.981
  • Are being brutally suppressed in communist china.
  • 00:00:57.981 --> 00:01:02.452
  • It's a story that is not getting enough attention.
  • 00:01:02.452 --> 00:01:05.054
  • It's a story that's not drawing enough activism, prayer,
  • 00:01:05.054 --> 00:01:09.926
  • Or even understanding among christians, much less others.
  • 00:01:09.926 --> 00:01:13.196
  • But tonight we have a wonderful guest, somebody who's written
  • 00:01:13.196 --> 00:01:16.766
  • The definitive book on this topic, china's war on faith.
  • 00:01:16.766 --> 00:01:21.504
  • Good evening, and welcome to the rosenberg report.
  • 00:01:21.504 --> 00:01:24.140
  • We are so glad that you're with us tonight.
  • 00:01:24.140 --> 00:01:25.675
  • And while we have been talking about iran's war on jews,
  • 00:01:25.675 --> 00:01:29.946
  • On christians, on on israel from all directions, tonight
  • 00:01:29.946 --> 00:01:34.517
  • We're shifting to something that, as you know,
  • 00:01:34.517 --> 00:01:38.288
  • If you're a regular viewer of the show,
  • 00:01:38.288 --> 00:01:40.223
  • I have also a real concern about and that is communist china.
  • 00:01:40.223 --> 00:01:43.993
  • My last political thriller, as you know,
  • 00:01:43.993 --> 00:01:46.396
  • Was the beijing betrayal.
  • 00:01:46.396 --> 00:01:48.097
  • And so i wanted to
  • 00:01:48.097 --> 00:01:49.566
  • Focus on the release of a remarkable new book
  • 00:01:49.566 --> 00:01:53.536
  • Called china's war on faith by a man who really is an expert
  • 00:01:53.536 --> 00:01:58.041
  • On international religious freedom.
  • 00:01:58.041 --> 00:01:59.576
  • Sam brownback was a congressman.
  • 00:01:59.576 --> 00:02:01.744
  • That's when i met him back in 1994.
  • 00:02:01.744 --> 00:02:04.480
  • So we go way back.
  • 00:02:04.480 --> 00:02:06.216
  • He eventually ran
  • 00:02:06.216 --> 00:02:07.383
  • For senate from kansas and served in that role,
  • 00:02:07.383 --> 00:02:09.852
  • And we deepened our friendship there.
  • 00:02:09.852 --> 00:02:11.721
  • Then he became the he was elected governor of kansas.
  • 00:02:11.721 --> 00:02:15.058
  • I remember going and visiting him
  • 00:02:15.058 --> 00:02:16.826
  • And staying at the mansion with
  • 00:02:16.826 --> 00:02:18.294
  • He and his wife
  • 00:02:18.294 --> 00:02:19.229
  • And seeing his heart from domestic issues
  • 00:02:19.229 --> 00:02:22.298
  • As well as foreign policy issues,
  • 00:02:22.298 --> 00:02:23.833
  • And then eventually president donald j.
  • 00:02:23.833 --> 00:02:26.502
  • Trump, in his first term, appointed sam brownback
  • 00:02:26.502 --> 00:02:29.172
  • To be the u.s.
  • 00:02:29.172 --> 00:02:30.640
  • Ambassador for international freedom,
  • 00:02:30.640 --> 00:02:32.775
  • Based on a piece of legislation
  • 00:02:32.775 --> 00:02:34.644
  • That sam himself had helped craft when he was in the senate.
  • 00:02:34.644 --> 00:02:37.847
  • So i want to welcome him to the rosenberg report tonight.
  • 00:02:37.847 --> 00:02:42.385
  • Ambassador. governor. congressman
  • 00:02:42.385 --> 00:02:45.288
  • And friend sam brownback, welcome to the rosenberg report.
  • 00:02:46.422 --> 00:02:49.726
  • So glad you're here.
  • 00:02:49.726 --> 00:02:50.893
  • And congratulations on this just newly published book.
  • 00:02:50.893 --> 00:02:53.896
  • It's so important and it's so good.
  • 00:02:53.896 --> 00:02:56.699
  • And that's why i was happy to say yes to you
  • 00:02:56.699 --> 00:02:59.602
  • When you asked me to write the forward.
  • 00:02:59.602 --> 00:03:02.138
  • Joel, it's
  • 00:03:02.138 --> 00:03:02.705
  • Just great to join you
  • 00:03:02.705 --> 00:03:04.674
  • There and to see you in your natural habitat.
  • 00:03:04.674 --> 00:03:06.876
  • And thank you so much for helping out with this book
  • 00:03:06.876 --> 00:03:10.813
  • And the tie in between your thriller on beijing, betrayal,
  • 00:03:10.813 --> 00:03:14.984
  • And this book of what's taking place on china's
  • 00:03:14.984 --> 00:03:18.021
  • War on faith just couldn't have been more symbiotic.
  • 00:03:18.021 --> 00:03:21.357
  • And it's it's really what you've specialized in
  • 00:03:21.357 --> 00:03:24.661
  • Is these thrillers that take place before the actual happens.
  • 00:03:24.661 --> 00:03:29.599
  • And that's what i'm writing fiction.
  • 00:03:30.400 --> 00:03:31.901
  • And, and this book is 100% true.
  • 00:03:31.901 --> 00:03:34.304
  • And that's
  • 00:03:34.304 --> 00:03:35.471
  • What makes your book china's war on faith, so chilling.
  • 00:03:35.471 --> 00:03:37.840
  • Well, it is, and it's getting worse.
  • 00:03:38.608 --> 00:03:41.277
  • Unfortunately, we're seeing now christian pastors
  • 00:03:41.277 --> 00:03:45.315
  • Arrested, put in jail, disappearing in numbers
  • 00:03:45.315 --> 00:03:48.851
  • We haven't seen really probably since mao is taking place.
  • 00:03:48.851 --> 00:03:53.756
  • Why is this level of persecution against christians happening
  • 00:03:53.756 --> 00:03:57.727
  • With such ferocity now?
  • 00:03:57.727 --> 00:03:59.762
  • What's what's has something changed
  • 00:04:00.496 --> 00:04:03.333
  • Politically or socially in communist china?
  • 00:04:03.333 --> 00:04:07.136
  • I think they're more scared than they've ever been.
  • 00:04:07.136 --> 00:04:10.139
  • Joel,
  • 00:04:10.139 --> 00:04:10.673
  • I think the chinese
  • 00:04:10.673 --> 00:04:11.941
  • Communist party is more fearful than they've ever been.
  • 00:04:11.941 --> 00:04:15.445
  • Because
  • 00:04:15.445 --> 00:04:17.246
  • They fear religious freedom more than they fear.
  • 00:04:17.246 --> 00:04:20.016
  • Our aircraft carriers
  • 00:04:20.016 --> 00:04:21.584
  • Are our nuclear weapons, for that matter,
  • 00:04:21.584 --> 00:04:23.786
  • Because it means they lose control.
  • 00:04:23.786 --> 00:04:26.522
  • China is a religious.
  • 00:04:26.522 --> 00:04:27.824
  • There are spiritual people, and now they're searching.
  • 00:04:27.824 --> 00:04:31.894
  • China is one of the fastest
  • 00:04:31.894 --> 00:04:33.062
  • Growing christian countries in the world.
  • 00:04:33.062 --> 00:04:36.099
  • And they're seeing i'm sure they're picking up on that
  • 00:04:36.099 --> 00:04:38.701
  • And seeing that and feeling that and seeing that
  • 00:04:38.701 --> 00:04:41.704
  • The people are getting fed up with chinese communism,
  • 00:04:41.704 --> 00:04:45.742
  • What it's done to them, the control
  • 00:04:45.742 --> 00:04:47.744
  • It puts on top of them, how much it holds back their nation.
  • 00:04:47.744 --> 00:04:51.848
  • And so they're really in a fear mode.
  • 00:04:51.848 --> 00:04:54.183
  • They're not acting as a confident regime.
  • 00:04:54.183 --> 00:04:56.285
  • They're
  • 00:04:56.285 --> 00:04:56.953
  • Acting as a regime in fear,
  • 00:04:56.953 --> 00:04:58.688
  • Which is really one of these terrifying moments
  • 00:04:58.688 --> 00:05:01.023
  • Actually, over the next, i think really 5 to 10 years,
  • 00:05:01.023 --> 00:05:04.527
  • This may be the optimal time that china communist party
  • 00:05:04.527 --> 00:05:08.998
  • Looks at
  • 00:05:08.998 --> 00:05:10.133
  • Really attacking the world because their demographics
  • 00:05:10.133 --> 00:05:12.835
  • Are going down, their economy is going down.
  • 00:05:12.835 --> 00:05:15.171
  • They built up this big military based on our trading,
  • 00:05:15.171 --> 00:05:18.875
  • Really with them.
  • 00:05:18.875 --> 00:05:19.776
  • But their domestic problem
  • 00:05:19.776 --> 00:05:21.778
  • Is specifically and particularly people of faith
  • 00:05:21.778 --> 00:05:26.015
  • Who are standing up to them and who don't follow communism.
  • 00:05:26.015 --> 00:05:30.086
  • They don't believe in communism.
  • 00:05:30.086 --> 00:05:31.821
  • They're not going along
  • 00:05:31.821 --> 00:05:33.022
  • With all the push that xi jinping is doing.
  • 00:05:33.022 --> 00:05:36.826
  • I think what you're seeing is then really acting out of fear.
  • 00:05:36.826 --> 00:05:40.196
  • Yeah, i think this is fascinating.
  • 00:05:40.196 --> 00:05:41.464
  • And your analysis is rings true.
  • 00:05:41.464 --> 00:05:45.134
  • I just think most,
  • 00:05:45.134 --> 00:05:46.302
  • Most christians, most americans
  • 00:05:46.302 --> 00:05:47.804
  • Haven't heard this analysis yet.
  • 00:05:47.804 --> 00:05:50.106
  • Now, now this issue of fear
  • 00:05:50.106 --> 00:05:53.042
  • Confirm it for me, if you would.
  • 00:05:53.676 --> 00:05:56.546
  • When when the
  • 00:05:56.546 --> 00:05:59.248
  • Cultural revolution happened in the 1970s
  • 00:05:59.248 --> 00:06:02.718
  • And even before that,
  • 00:06:02.718 --> 00:06:05.254
  • The real crackdown against christianity back in 49.
  • 00:06:05.254 --> 00:06:07.890
  • And, you know, in the 50s,
  • 00:06:07.890 --> 00:06:10.259
  • My understanding is that the number of christians
  • 00:06:10.259 --> 00:06:13.663
  • In in china, mainland china was only about 250,000 or so.
  • 00:06:13.663 --> 00:06:19.936
  • And now i see estimates ranging
  • 00:06:19.936 --> 00:06:22.438
  • From 80 million to 100 million or more.
  • 00:06:22.438 --> 00:06:26.175
  • First of all, are those numbers accurate?
  • 00:06:26.175 --> 00:06:30.012
  • Nobody knows.
  • 00:06:30.379 --> 00:06:31.380
  • I've seen them range as high as 120 million.
  • 00:06:31.380 --> 00:06:34.283
  • What i do know is that it's been a fast
  • 00:06:34.283 --> 00:06:36.853
  • Growing christian population in china,
  • 00:06:36.853 --> 00:06:39.889
  • That that has taken place and that continues to grow
  • 00:06:39.889 --> 00:06:42.892
  • In spite of all of the crackdown.
  • 00:06:42.892 --> 00:06:44.760
  • So we do know that that piece is taking place.
  • 00:06:44.760 --> 00:06:47.263
  • And that's got a really so a lot of fear in communist
  • 00:06:47.263 --> 00:06:50.833
  • Who really christianity
  • 00:06:50.833 --> 00:06:54.003
  • Is directly opposed to communism that has no authority
  • 00:06:54.003 --> 00:06:58.608
  • Other than the state
  • 00:06:58.608 --> 00:07:00.810
  • Who sees communism, sees all your rights
  • 00:07:00.810 --> 00:07:03.246
  • Coming from the government, and we see
  • 00:07:03.246 --> 00:07:05.014
  • All your rights is coming from god, right?
  • 00:07:05.014 --> 00:07:07.016
  • These are these are the direct conflict of these two systems.
  • 00:07:07.016 --> 00:07:10.953
  • And now you've got all this christianity
  • 00:07:10.953 --> 00:07:13.022
  • That's growing,
  • 00:07:13.022 --> 00:07:13.756
  • In addition to the problems
  • 00:07:13.756 --> 00:07:15.124
  • They've already had with the muslim uyghurs,
  • 00:07:15.124 --> 00:07:17.126
  • With the tibetan buddhist, and with falun gong,
  • 00:07:17.126 --> 00:07:19.362
  • Who they've really just gone at hammer and tong and doing
  • 00:07:19.362 --> 00:07:23.499
  • Horrible things like forced organ harvesting with as well.
  • 00:07:23.499 --> 00:07:26.536
  • So they're seeing it really across the board.
  • 00:07:26.536 --> 00:07:29.438
  • So just to be clear, you're saying that
  • 00:07:29.438 --> 00:07:31.874
  • While the exact numbers of how many christians
  • 00:07:31.874 --> 00:07:34.243
  • There are today in communist china is not known.
  • 00:07:34.243 --> 00:07:37.580
  • You're saying that it's definitive that the dynamic
  • 00:07:37.580 --> 00:07:41.384
  • Is we've gone from relatively almost no christians.
  • 00:07:41.384 --> 00:07:44.687
  • There's this massive surge as people are making
  • 00:07:44.687 --> 00:07:47.924
  • A choice to reject atheism, to reject communism,
  • 00:07:47.924 --> 00:07:51.527
  • To at least search out is jesus god?
  • 00:07:51.527 --> 00:07:54.797
  • And is christianity true?
  • 00:07:54.797 --> 00:07:56.332
  • Even though if i say yes as a as a chinese person,
  • 00:07:56.332 --> 00:08:00.403
  • I may lose my job, i may lose my ability
  • 00:08:00.403 --> 00:08:03.573
  • To send my kids to get a university education.
  • 00:08:03.573 --> 00:08:05.841
  • I may be imprisoned,
  • 00:08:05.841 --> 00:08:07.043
  • I may be tortured, i might even be executed.
  • 00:08:07.043 --> 00:08:09.645
  • And yet tens of millions are coming to faith in jesus.
  • 00:08:09.645 --> 00:08:13.516
  • It's becoming an exponential,
  • 00:08:13.516 --> 00:08:14.850
  • Probably the largest
  • 00:08:14.850 --> 00:08:16.319
  • And greatest
  • 00:08:16.319 --> 00:08:17.386
  • Spiritual awakening, christian awakening in the world.
  • 00:08:17.386 --> 00:08:20.289
  • Maybe ever.
  • 00:08:20.289 --> 00:08:21.891
  • That's accurate.
  • 00:08:22.291 --> 00:08:23.726
  • May the scale is such that this could be.
  • 00:08:23.726 --> 00:08:27.196
  • And you can see clearly god is on the move.
  • 00:08:27.196 --> 00:08:30.600
  • And these christians that we have in the book that we
  • 00:08:30.600 --> 00:08:33.369
  • We feature in the book, they are dynamic,
  • 00:08:33.369 --> 00:08:37.039
  • They are beautiful, they're loving there.
  • 00:08:37.039 --> 00:08:39.609
  • They are just really amazing people.
  • 00:08:39.609 --> 00:08:42.778
  • Coming up next on the rosenberg report,
  • 00:08:42.778 --> 00:08:45.214
  • Who are some of the chinese christians
  • 00:08:45.214 --> 00:08:47.516
  • Who are emerging as true heroes, standing courageously
  • 00:08:47.516 --> 00:08:51.287
  • For jesus christ amidst china's brutal war on faith?
  • 00:08:51.287 --> 00:08:55.157
  • And how can their stories inspire our faith?
  • 00:08:55.157 --> 00:08:58.527
  • Find out when the rosenberg report continues on tbn
  • 00:08:58.527 --> 00:09:02.698
  • Right after the break.
  • 00:09:02.698 --> 00:09:05.006
  • Right after the break.
  • 00:09:05.006 --> 00:09:09.239
  • Ambassador.
  • 00:09:09.573 --> 00:09:10.474
  • So grateful for your friendship and and.
  • 00:09:10.474 --> 00:09:13.043
  • Your.
  • 00:09:13.043 --> 00:09:13.910
  • Your clear eyed thinking and writing
  • 00:09:13.910 --> 00:09:18.048
  • And speaking out against china's war on faith.
  • 00:09:18.048 --> 00:09:22.619
  • I think most people know that china is bad.
  • 00:09:22.619 --> 00:09:25.856
  • I don't think they understand the depth of the depravity
  • 00:09:25.856 --> 00:09:29.493
  • And the wickedness.
  • 00:09:29.493 --> 00:09:30.761
  • And we've been so focused on the horror of the iranian regime,
  • 00:09:30.761 --> 00:09:34.264
  • But also of the russian regime and its attack and invasion
  • 00:09:34.264 --> 00:09:38.035
  • And massacre of so many in ukraine.
  • 00:09:38.035 --> 00:09:42.339
  • The communist china is actually kind
  • 00:09:42.339 --> 00:09:43.840
  • Of people aren't focusing on it so much.
  • 00:09:43.840 --> 00:09:45.876
  • That's why i wrote the beijing betrayal last year.
  • 00:09:45.876 --> 00:09:47.978
  • But but this book is so important.
  • 00:09:47.978 --> 00:09:50.647
  • China's war on faith.
  • 00:09:50.647 --> 00:09:51.648
  • So talk to me more about the christian heroes
  • 00:09:51.648 --> 00:09:54.284
  • That you profile in the book the communist,
  • 00:09:54.284 --> 00:09:57.320
  • The chinese heroes that are standing up for
  • 00:09:57.320 --> 00:10:00.424
  • Jesus christ against such danger.
  • 00:10:00.424 --> 00:10:03.794
  • And what are the
  • 00:10:03.794 --> 00:10:05.662
  • What are the things that the communist chinese
  • 00:10:05.662 --> 00:10:07.864
  • Government is doing to them
  • 00:10:07.864 --> 00:10:10.333
  • Because of this, this, this repression and this, this,
  • 00:10:10.333 --> 00:10:14.771
  • This sickening.
  • 00:10:15.138 --> 00:10:18.575
  • Attempt to not just suppress,
  • 00:10:18.575 --> 00:10:21.278
  • But to wipe out christianity and other faith in the country.
  • 00:10:21.278 --> 00:10:26.049
  • You know, joel, these guys
  • 00:10:26.616 --> 00:10:28.585
  • And you've run into people like this whose faith is so
  • 00:10:28.585 --> 00:10:31.621
  • Dynamic and beautiful and loving and deep that
  • 00:10:31.621 --> 00:10:35.358
  • It just exudes from them.
  • 00:10:35.358 --> 00:10:37.094
  • And that's what i see in a number of these
  • 00:10:37.094 --> 00:10:39.062
  • Chinese christians.
  • 00:10:39.062 --> 00:10:40.263
  • They can't stop witnessing of the lord they love of jesus.
  • 00:10:40.263 --> 00:10:45.202
  • I mentioned pastor peter xu
  • 00:10:45.202 --> 00:10:47.904
  • Arrested five times.
  • 00:10:47.904 --> 00:10:51.374
  • The last time they had him hanging on a cross
  • 00:10:51.374 --> 00:10:55.011
  • Formation in his jail cell that nearly killed him.
  • 00:10:55.011 --> 00:10:59.015
  • He thought he was going to die.
  • 00:10:59.015 --> 00:11:00.117
  • He just
  • 00:11:00.117 --> 00:11:01.284
  • He thought he just was it and it was going to going to
  • 00:11:01.284 --> 00:11:04.154
  • Pass away.
  • 00:11:04.154 --> 00:11:05.255
  • And they they let him down at the very last minute.
  • 00:11:05.255 --> 00:11:07.290
  • They took him over to the ward and they
  • 00:11:07.290 --> 00:11:08.792
  • And they thought they had him softened up sufficiently
  • 00:11:08.792 --> 00:11:11.595
  • To sign the confession that that god's a fake,
  • 00:11:11.595 --> 00:11:14.598
  • Jesus is a fraud, all this sort of stuff.
  • 00:11:14.598 --> 00:11:16.900
  • Warden sitting there and he says, okay, sign it.
  • 00:11:16.900 --> 00:11:19.202
  • We're going to let you go.
  • 00:11:19.202 --> 00:11:20.771
  • And peter looks at the warden and he says to him.
  • 00:11:20.771 --> 00:11:24.174
  • Thank you
  • 00:11:24.174 --> 00:11:25.008
  • For allowing me
  • 00:11:25.008 --> 00:11:26.009
  • To participate in the sufferings of christ. wow.
  • 00:11:26.009 --> 00:11:29.579
  • And the warden does that get him out of here?
  • 00:11:29.579 --> 00:11:31.481
  • He's a real christian, you know, and that's the kind of people.
  • 00:11:31.481 --> 00:11:34.918
  • And they view themselves as particularly hardened
  • 00:11:34.918 --> 00:11:38.955
  • By the circumstances
  • 00:11:38.955 --> 00:11:41.124
  • They've been in to finish the circumnavigation of the gospel,
  • 00:11:41.124 --> 00:11:44.461
  • Taking it back to jerusalem.
  • 00:11:44.461 --> 00:11:46.263
  • That's what they think that the lord has preserved for them,
  • 00:11:46.263 --> 00:11:49.432
  • That they're.
  • 00:11:49.432 --> 00:11:50.066
  • Thinking toughened up to,
  • 00:11:50.066 --> 00:11:51.168
  • To endure the type of persecution
  • 00:11:51.168 --> 00:11:53.003
  • That really is ripped right out of the book of acts.
  • 00:11:53.003 --> 00:11:55.338
  • Really well.
  • 00:11:55.338 --> 00:11:56.473
  • It is completely is.
  • 00:11:56.473 --> 00:11:57.974
  • Pastor wang yi is in jail right now.
  • 00:11:57.974 --> 00:12:00.877
  • We feature him in the book as well.
  • 00:12:00.877 --> 00:12:02.612
  • He's really a martin luther king type of figure,
  • 00:12:02.612 --> 00:12:06.116
  • Where he writes
  • 00:12:06.483 --> 00:12:07.651
  • A letter just before he's going to be arrested,
  • 00:12:07.651 --> 00:12:10.687
  • And he knows he's going to be arrested
  • 00:12:10.687 --> 00:12:12.022
  • Because he says publicly on his sermons,
  • 00:12:12.022 --> 00:12:15.292
  • He says we're all sinners, including xi
  • 00:12:15.292 --> 00:12:18.895
  • Jinping is a sinner and is going to need to repent.
  • 00:12:18.895 --> 00:12:21.932
  • And you're going
  • 00:12:21.932 --> 00:12:22.933
  • I mean, when i read that line, i kind of laugh
  • 00:12:22.933 --> 00:12:25.402
  • Thinking, well, you know what's coming now, right?
  • 00:12:25.402 --> 00:12:28.405
  • If you're calling xi jinping a sinner.
  • 00:12:28.405 --> 00:12:30.640
  • And he was arrested. yeah.
  • 00:12:30.640 --> 00:12:33.176
  • And but he writes these beautiful words about,
  • 00:12:33.176 --> 00:12:36.313
  • You can arrest me, you can hurt me,
  • 00:12:36.313 --> 00:12:39.783
  • But you can't take my soul away from me.
  • 00:12:39.783 --> 00:12:43.019
  • And it's just that's the sort of christian leaders
  • 00:12:43.019 --> 00:12:47.324
  • And believers
  • 00:12:47.324 --> 00:12:48.525
  • That we're seeing in these really horrific circumstances
  • 00:12:48.525 --> 00:12:52.495
  • That i think we need to clearly and unequivocally stand up
  • 00:12:52.495 --> 00:12:56.533
  • For the chinese, christians and all people of faith in china
  • 00:12:56.533 --> 00:13:00.036
  • As a push back to the chinese communist party.
  • 00:13:00.036 --> 00:13:03.139
  • Yeah. absolutely.
  • 00:13:03.139 --> 00:13:05.141
  • When you were serving in the first trump
  • 00:13:05.141 --> 00:13:07.811
  • Administration in this role, that as u.s.
  • 00:13:07.811 --> 00:13:12.382
  • Ambassador for international religious
  • 00:13:12.382 --> 00:13:13.984
  • Freedom, a position that was created
  • 00:13:13.984 --> 00:13:16.319
  • Because of legislation that you helped
  • 00:13:16.319 --> 00:13:19.022
  • Shape and get through the senate,
  • 00:13:19.022 --> 00:13:20.857
  • You never thought you would be appointed the ambassador to
  • 00:13:20.857 --> 00:13:24.327
  • To carry it out. but
  • 00:13:24.327 --> 00:13:27.097
  • What was
  • 00:13:27.364 --> 00:13:28.431
  • President trump's approach on religious freedom?
  • 00:13:28.431 --> 00:13:32.135
  • I think that's important because clearly trump has been
  • 00:13:32.135 --> 00:13:36.172
  • The toughest president in my lifetime.
  • 00:13:36.172 --> 00:13:39.676
  • I'm 59 on on china, on communist china.
  • 00:13:39.676 --> 00:13:44.381
  • And yet he also worked very hard to try to navigate
  • 00:13:44.381 --> 00:13:49.252
  • Some sort of diplomatic efforts and try
  • 00:13:49.252 --> 00:13:53.523
  • To not get ourselves, ourselves into a military confrontation
  • 00:13:53.523 --> 00:13:56.693
  • Over taiwan or anything else. right.
  • 00:13:56.693 --> 00:13:58.762
  • He just held this summit with xi jinping.
  • 00:13:58.762 --> 00:14:01.665
  • And, you know, you know the president.
  • 00:14:01.665 --> 00:14:02.832
  • Well, what did you see?
  • 00:14:02.832 --> 00:14:03.934
  • What can you tell us?
  • 00:14:03.934 --> 00:14:05.936
  • What i'm amazed,
  • 00:14:05.936 --> 00:14:07.737
  • Really, at the man and how he deals with things.
  • 00:14:07.737 --> 00:14:10.473
  • But what i saw was the first two years was dealing with trade
  • 00:14:10.473 --> 00:14:14.945
  • Kind of security issues before he started going at the human
  • 00:14:14.945 --> 00:14:20.183
  • Rights issues and security and religious freedom.
  • 00:14:20.183 --> 00:14:23.553
  • It was the last half of that
  • 00:14:23.553 --> 00:14:24.955
  • First trump term that he really let.
  • 00:14:24.955 --> 00:14:26.923
  • Okay, we can go on that because we've we've
  • 00:14:26.923 --> 00:14:29.693
  • Started to deal with some of these issues,
  • 00:14:29.693 --> 00:14:31.127
  • But we've got to do this.
  • 00:14:31.127 --> 00:14:32.362
  • The president believes the world needs more religion.
  • 00:14:32.362 --> 00:14:35.765
  • He said this publicly.
  • 00:14:35.765 --> 00:14:37.434
  • He said this often.
  • 00:14:37.434 --> 00:14:38.802
  • He is a man that believes in the power of faith
  • 00:14:38.802 --> 00:14:42.138
  • And its value, and indeed its
  • 00:14:42.138 --> 00:14:45.742
  • Foundational piece of what it is to the united states
  • 00:14:45.742 --> 00:14:49.813
  • Experience in our position as the world's leading country.
  • 00:14:49.813 --> 00:14:52.882
  • And he wants to see more of that around the world.
  • 00:14:52.882 --> 00:14:55.285
  • So that's where i think he really looks at it.
  • 00:14:55.285 --> 00:14:58.688
  • Talk to me about two advisors that are so close to
  • 00:14:58.688 --> 00:15:02.525
  • President trump. and how do they see this issue?
  • 00:15:02.525 --> 00:15:05.095
  • One, of course, would be vice president jd vance.
  • 00:15:05.095 --> 00:15:07.764
  • I don't know him. i'm watching him closely.
  • 00:15:07.764 --> 00:15:10.500
  • But we haven't met.
  • 00:15:10.500 --> 00:15:11.401
  • We haven't i haven't interviewed him yet.
  • 00:15:11.401 --> 00:15:12.902
  • And then, of course,
  • 00:15:12.902 --> 00:15:13.970
  • The other one is secretary of state marco rubio.
  • 00:15:13.970 --> 00:15:16.673
  • And he i do know and do know well.
  • 00:15:16.673 --> 00:15:19.442
  • And obviously he is both an evangelical
  • 00:15:19.442 --> 00:15:21.678
  • Christian from a catholic background,
  • 00:15:21.678 --> 00:15:23.580
  • Very similar to to your love for the catholic church
  • 00:15:23.580 --> 00:15:27.384
  • As well as evangelical christianity. so
  • 00:15:27.384 --> 00:15:30.754
  • But how do these two
  • 00:15:31.221 --> 00:15:32.756
  • See communist china and this issue of china's war on faith?
  • 00:15:32.756 --> 00:15:36.793
  • And how do you think they're advising the president?
  • 00:15:36.793 --> 00:15:39.796
  • I'm asking not just for what's happening right
  • 00:15:39.796 --> 00:15:41.531
  • Now, but because these are the two names
  • 00:15:41.531 --> 00:15:43.500
  • That are probably most likely to run
  • 00:15:43.500 --> 00:15:47.704
  • To to succeed president trump, which makes it important
  • 00:15:47.704 --> 00:15:50.607
  • For us to understand kind of where are they coming from?
  • 00:15:50.607 --> 00:15:54.577
  • Vance, i don't know as well as i do.
  • 00:15:55.345 --> 00:15:56.880
  • Rubio i've met with vance.
  • 00:15:56.880 --> 00:15:59.215
  • I talked about religious freedom issues with him.
  • 00:15:59.215 --> 00:16:01.484
  • He's been on board with those issues.
  • 00:16:01.484 --> 00:16:04.721
  • And so i think he would be advising the president that way.
  • 00:16:04.721 --> 00:16:07.657
  • Rubio, i do know, would advise the president that way.
  • 00:16:07.657 --> 00:16:10.493
  • He chaired
  • 00:16:10.493 --> 00:16:11.361
  • He was one of the honorary co-chairs
  • 00:16:11.361 --> 00:16:12.762
  • Of our international religious freedom summit.
  • 00:16:12.762 --> 00:16:14.898
  • He has been a hawk on china for a long period of time.
  • 00:16:14.898 --> 00:16:19.035
  • And the turn i think we really need to make,
  • 00:16:19.035 --> 00:16:22.105
  • Joel, is to see this as not a human rights issue,
  • 00:16:22.105 --> 00:16:25.608
  • But as a national security issue that we can use
  • 00:16:25.608 --> 00:16:28.778
  • As a weapon and pushing back against communist china.
  • 00:16:28.778 --> 00:16:33.583
  • They will not allow any freedom of religion
  • 00:16:33.583 --> 00:16:36.753
  • Whatsoever by anybody.
  • 00:16:36.753 --> 00:16:38.922
  • The dalai lama can't go home to his home country,
  • 00:16:38.922 --> 00:16:42.492
  • His home area.
  • 00:16:42.492 --> 00:16:43.359
  • They want
  • 00:16:43.359 --> 00:16:44.160
  • To appoint the chinese communists,
  • 00:16:44.160 --> 00:16:45.662
  • Want to appoint the next dalai lama, the muslim uighurs.
  • 00:16:45.662 --> 00:16:49.599
  • It's the only country in the world
  • 00:16:49.599 --> 00:16:51.301
  • You cannot name a child muhammad.
  • 00:16:51.301 --> 00:16:54.437
  • Only country in the world.
  • 00:16:54.437 --> 00:16:55.705
  • Legally, you can't do that.
  • 00:16:55.705 --> 00:16:57.207
  • And then, of course, what they're doing
  • 00:16:57.207 --> 00:16:58.741
  • To the christians and falun gong,
  • 00:16:58.741 --> 00:17:00.143
  • They've just they've done things like forced
  • 00:17:00.143 --> 00:17:01.945
  • Organ harvesting on falun gong, which is just a diabolical,
  • 00:17:01.945 --> 00:17:07.484
  • Barbaric practice you can't even hardly imagine.
  • 00:17:07.484 --> 00:17:10.854
  • So i'm saying, let's get all of those faith work with them,
  • 00:17:10.854 --> 00:17:14.858
  • Bring in people that have been persecuted to the white house
  • 00:17:14.858 --> 00:17:18.761
  • To meet with the president,
  • 00:17:18.761 --> 00:17:19.896
  • The vice president, secretary of state.
  • 00:17:19.896 --> 00:17:22.765
  • Let's hold a summit of world religious leaders and world
  • 00:17:22.765 --> 00:17:26.169
  • Leaders to talk
  • 00:17:26.169 --> 00:17:27.370
  • About the need for religious freedom in the world today.
  • 00:17:27.370 --> 00:17:30.206
  • Everywhere, for everybody, including communist china.
  • 00:17:30.206 --> 00:17:33.476
  • Let's start really driving this thing
  • 00:17:33.476 --> 00:17:35.211
  • With our g20 summit that the us will host.
  • 00:17:35.211 --> 00:17:38.248
  • Let's make religious freedom
  • 00:17:38.248 --> 00:17:39.616
  • One of the key pillars and platforms of the g20 summit.
  • 00:17:39.616 --> 00:17:43.853
  • Amen.
  • 00:17:43.853 --> 00:17:45.288
  • Coming up next on the rosenberg report.
  • 00:17:45.288 --> 00:17:47.657
  • How can we stand with
  • 00:17:47.657 --> 00:17:48.925
  • Our persecuted chinese brothers and sisters in christ?
  • 00:17:48.925 --> 00:17:52.729
  • How should we be praying?
  • 00:17:52.729 --> 00:17:53.997
  • And what else should we be doing to defeat china's
  • 00:17:53.997 --> 00:17:57.033
  • War on faith?
  • 00:17:57.033 --> 00:17:58.301
  • Don't miss
  • 00:17:58.301 --> 00:17:59.536
  • The rest of my conversation with ambassador sam brownback
  • 00:17:59.536 --> 00:18:02.772
  • When the rosenberg report continues on tbn.
  • 00:18:02.772 --> 00:18:06.276
  • Right after the break.
  • 00:18:06.276 --> 00:18:09.002
  • Right after the break.
  • 00:18:09.002 --> 00:18:12.817
  • Welcome back to.
  • 00:18:13.218 --> 00:18:13.985
  • The rosenberg report.
  • 00:18:13.985 --> 00:18:15.053
  • As we continue my conversation with sam brownback.
  • 00:18:15.053 --> 00:18:18.423
  • The author of china's war on faith.
  • 00:18:18.423 --> 00:18:21.359
  • Sam, thank you so much again for being on the rosenberg report.
  • 00:18:21.359 --> 00:18:24.296
  • Talk to me about what christians what can we be doing?
  • 00:18:24.296 --> 00:18:28.400
  • What should we be doing?
  • 00:18:28.400 --> 00:18:29.401
  • How should we be praying for
  • 00:18:29.401 --> 00:18:31.336
  • Our brothers and sisters that are being persecuted
  • 00:18:31.336 --> 00:18:33.438
  • In communist china right now?
  • 00:18:33.438 --> 00:18:37.909
  • They don't ask.
  • 00:18:38.276 --> 00:18:39.344
  • The christians in china don't ask to be released.
  • 00:18:39.344 --> 00:18:42.280
  • I mean, some do,
  • 00:18:42.280 --> 00:18:43.915
  • But most of them just ask for the courage
  • 00:18:43.915 --> 00:18:45.817
  • To be able to stand in
  • 00:18:45.817 --> 00:18:47.285
  • And to express their faith and to live their faith
  • 00:18:47.285 --> 00:18:50.155
  • In, in the face of this level of persecution, of going to jail.
  • 00:18:50.155 --> 00:18:54.492
  • As i mentioned earlier, there are unprecedented numbers
  • 00:18:54.492 --> 00:18:58.463
  • Of pastors now being rounded up in china and sent into jail.
  • 00:18:58.463 --> 00:19:03.335
  • Or they even used the term disappeared as a noun, happening
  • 00:19:03.335 --> 00:19:08.840
  • To a lot of christian leaders that are in that country.
  • 00:19:08.840 --> 00:19:11.843
  • But they're not asking to
  • 00:19:11.843 --> 00:19:15.080
  • Be protected as much as they asked for the courage
  • 00:19:15.080 --> 00:19:18.316
  • To be able to stand and to witness of what christ,
  • 00:19:18.316 --> 00:19:21.920
  • Who christ is and who he is in their lives.
  • 00:19:21.920 --> 00:19:24.256
  • It's it's beautiful, straight out of the book of acts.
  • 00:19:24.256 --> 00:19:27.859
  • Yeah,
  • 00:19:27.859 --> 00:19:29.527
  • I've seen these guys that that they've had.
  • 00:19:29.527 --> 00:19:32.564
  • But we then i think we should be praying that the west stands
  • 00:19:32.564 --> 00:19:37.302
  • Up to
  • 00:19:37.302 --> 00:19:37.969
  • The chinese communist party,
  • 00:19:37.969 --> 00:19:39.204
  • Because truly,
  • 00:19:39.204 --> 00:19:40.338
  • One of these systems is going to win in the future.
  • 00:19:40.338 --> 00:19:43.475
  • It'll be either going to be the authoritarian system
  • 00:19:43.475 --> 00:19:45.944
  • Of the chinese communist party and its acolyte countries,
  • 00:19:45.944 --> 00:19:49.247
  • Or it's going to be western civilization,
  • 00:19:49.247 --> 00:19:51.249
  • With its foundation in the judeo-christian ethic
  • 00:19:51.249 --> 00:19:53.985
  • And belief that every person is created in the image of god,
  • 00:19:53.985 --> 00:19:57.722
  • Has immeasurable dignity and and unalienable rights.
  • 00:19:57.722 --> 00:20:02.294
  • Yeah, that's that's well put, sam and i and i appreciate that.
  • 00:20:02.294 --> 00:20:05.730
  • And we'll pray for the president to president trump to
  • 00:20:05.730 --> 00:20:10.168
  • First of all,
  • 00:20:10.535 --> 00:20:11.569
  • You'll be able to meet him and give him a copy of
  • 00:20:11.569 --> 00:20:15.373
  • China's war on faith, as well as the secretary of state
  • 00:20:15.373 --> 00:20:17.776
  • As well as the
  • 00:20:17.776 --> 00:20:18.677
  • The vice president and his senior team,
  • 00:20:18.677 --> 00:20:20.912
  • So they can absorb these things, and that you will have
  • 00:20:20.912 --> 00:20:24.015
  • The voice into this second administration,
  • 00:20:24.015 --> 00:20:27.385
  • As well as other governments and state legislatures,
  • 00:20:27.385 --> 00:20:31.222
  • Governors who who can be looking together
  • 00:20:31.222 --> 00:20:33.558
  • To develop a strategy.
  • 00:20:33.558 --> 00:20:34.993
  • You've laid out a number of things
  • 00:20:34.993 --> 00:20:37.128
  • The west can be doing,
  • 00:20:37.128 --> 00:20:38.296
  • Should be doing, and certainly led by the united states.
  • 00:20:38.296 --> 00:20:40.865
  • As we celebrate 250 years in the united states
  • 00:20:40.865 --> 00:20:44.936
  • Of religious freedom,
  • 00:20:44.936 --> 00:20:46.638
  • You know, more impressive than any nation
  • 00:20:47.505 --> 00:20:50.442
  • On the face of the earth in the history of mankind.
  • 00:20:50.442 --> 00:20:53.478
  • The united states, for all our flaws,
  • 00:20:53.478 --> 00:20:56.014
  • Has really set the set the standard.
  • 00:20:56.014 --> 00:20:57.916
  • Ronald reagan said,
  • 00:20:57.916 --> 00:21:00.018
  • Before we got really engaged with the soviet union
  • 00:21:00.018 --> 00:21:03.021
  • And fighting them when we were in detente,
  • 00:21:03.021 --> 00:21:04.856
  • He said, no, no detente.
  • 00:21:04.856 --> 00:21:06.725
  • We win, you lose.
  • 00:21:06.725 --> 00:21:08.460
  • And he goes at it and he says, we are at war.
  • 00:21:08.460 --> 00:21:10.862
  • Whether we realize
  • 00:21:10.862 --> 00:21:12.764
  • They are at war with us, whether we realize
  • 00:21:12.764 --> 00:21:14.766
  • We are at war with them,
  • 00:21:14.766 --> 00:21:16.034
  • I think that's where we are with the ccp right now.
  • 00:21:16.034 --> 00:21:18.536
  • We've got to realize they're at war with us.
  • 00:21:18.536 --> 00:21:20.638
  • We've got to respond in kind.
  • 00:21:20.638 --> 00:21:23.141
  • Thank you.
  • 00:21:23.141 --> 00:21:24.209
  • Thank you so much. and thank you guys for watching.
  • 00:21:24.209 --> 00:21:25.944
  • I want to encourage you
  • 00:21:25.944 --> 00:21:27.345
  • Not only to buy a copy of china's war on faith
  • 00:21:27.345 --> 00:21:31.316
  • By ambassador sam brownback, not only buy it and read it
  • 00:21:31.316 --> 00:21:34.519
  • For yourself as a couple,
  • 00:21:34.519 --> 00:21:36.121
  • But by copies for your small group bible study,
  • 00:21:36.121 --> 00:21:39.090
  • By one for your pastor. buy one for friends.
  • 00:21:39.090 --> 00:21:41.960
  • This is
  • 00:21:41.960 --> 00:21:43.161
  • A really important issue, and it's so important that even
  • 00:21:43.161 --> 00:21:46.164
  • While we've been focusing on the iranian threat,
  • 00:21:46.164 --> 00:21:48.366
  • And i went to kyiv and met with president zelensky to talk
  • 00:21:48.366 --> 00:21:51.503
  • About the russian threat, vladimir putin.
  • 00:21:51.503 --> 00:21:53.638
  • But but i want us to also keep our eyes
  • 00:21:53.638 --> 00:21:57.542
  • Fixed on the communist china threat to christianity,
  • 00:21:57.542 --> 00:22:01.980
  • To the united states, to our allies in the pacific
  • 00:22:01.980 --> 00:22:05.483
  • And judeo-christian civilization.
  • 00:22:05.483 --> 00:22:08.486
  • Communist china, as we've talked about on
  • 00:22:08.486 --> 00:22:09.954
  • This show, is a threat to israel because they are funding,
  • 00:22:09.954 --> 00:22:13.491
  • Fueling, encouraging, providing intelligence
  • 00:22:13.491 --> 00:22:15.393
  • To iran and iran's allies in its war against us.
  • 00:22:15.393 --> 00:22:19.764
  • So at multiple levels, communist china is a huge threat.
  • 00:22:19.764 --> 00:22:24.002
  • And this book is so important.
  • 00:22:24.002 --> 00:22:26.337
  • Well, that's all the time we have for tonight.
  • 00:22:26.337 --> 00:22:28.206
  • Thank you so much for watching.
  • 00:22:28.206 --> 00:22:29.874
  • I want to encourage you to walk
  • 00:22:29.874 --> 00:22:31.409
  • In the power of the holy spirit as you walk.
  • 00:22:31.409 --> 00:22:33.044
  • With the lord jesus. christ this week.
  • 00:22:33.044 --> 00:22:34.846
  • Spend time in his word.
  • 00:22:34.846 --> 00:22:36.481
  • Be praying for the persecuted church
  • 00:22:36.481 --> 00:22:38.817
  • In iran, in communist china and in russia
  • 00:22:38.817 --> 00:22:42.554
  • And elsewhere around the world in nigeria.
  • 00:22:42.554 --> 00:22:45.423
  • And pray that christianity will prevail, that western
  • 00:22:45.423 --> 00:22:50.061
  • Civilization, judeo-christian civilization will prevail.
  • 00:22:50.061 --> 00:22:53.498
  • Thank you.
  • 00:22:53.498 --> 00:22:54.432
  • Have a great week and lord willing,
  • 00:22:54.432 --> 00:22:56.801
  • I'll see you next week right here on the rosenberg report.
  • 00:22:56.801 --> 00:22:56.801