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Allen Jackson NOW

Allen Jackson: Oct. 7 - One Year Later | Allen Jackson Now

October 13, 2025 | 22:17

Allen Jackson: Oct. 7 - One Year Later | Allen Jackson Now
Natalie Sanandaji and EJ Kimball join Allen Jakcson to discuss current events.
#News #Media #Israel #War #Government #Politics #Culture #Humaninterest #PersonalStory

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Allen Jackson NOW | Allen Jackson: Oct. 7 - One Year Later | Allen Jackson Now | October 13, 2025
  • Good evening, i'm alan jackson.
  • 00:00:17.676 --> 00:00:19.311
  • Welcome to nashville.
  • 00:00:19.311 --> 00:00:20.912
  • It's been more than a year since the brutal hamas
  • 00:00:20.912 --> 00:00:23.448
  • Attack on the jews at the nobel music festival.
  • 00:00:23.448 --> 00:00:26.918
  • A year of tears and mourning, but also a year of pushing back.
  • 00:00:26.918 --> 00:00:30.555
  • Not just in gaza, but in lebanon and iran as well.
  • 00:00:30.555 --> 00:00:34.626
  • Hostages are still being held.
  • 00:00:34.626 --> 00:00:36.728
  • The israeli prime minister, benjamin
  • 00:00:36.728 --> 00:00:38.396
  • Netanyahu, has made clear that he will not stop
  • 00:00:38.396 --> 00:00:41.266
  • Until all the signs of the threat
  • 00:00:41.266 --> 00:00:42.667
  • To the people of israel have been shut down in this country.
  • 00:00:42.667 --> 00:00:46.271
  • It's also been an extremely challenging year since the u.s.
  • 00:00:46.271 --> 00:00:49.574
  • And israel have a strong relationship and a rich history.
  • 00:00:49.574 --> 00:00:52.711
  • But from the college campuses
  • 00:00:52.711 --> 00:00:54.079
  • To the streets to the businesses and even neighborhoods,
  • 00:00:54.079 --> 00:00:57.282
  • Our jewish community in the states has been under attack.
  • 00:00:57.282 --> 00:01:00.485
  • No one is giving up.
  • 00:01:00.485 --> 00:01:01.686
  • And in some cases, it's made our jewish allies even stronger,
  • 00:01:01.686 --> 00:01:04.890
  • More ready to fight back, it seems.
  • 00:01:04.890 --> 00:01:06.892
  • Which brings us to our guest tonight,
  • 00:01:06.892 --> 00:01:08.727
  • Joining us right here in nashville, e.j.
  • 00:01:08.727 --> 00:01:11.296
  • Campbell, the director of the interfaith
  • 00:01:11.296 --> 00:01:12.864
  • Outreach and engagement.
  • 00:01:12.864 --> 00:01:14.566
  • And natalie sanandaji,
  • 00:01:14.566 --> 00:01:16.434
  • Who survived the attack at the nova music festival
  • 00:01:16.434 --> 00:01:19.237
  • And is now a public affairs officer.
  • 00:01:19.237 --> 00:01:21.806
  • Both work for the combat anti-semitism movement.
  • 00:01:21.806 --> 00:01:24.876
  • Welcome to our show.
  • 00:01:25.343 --> 00:01:27.979
  • Thank you.
  • 00:01:27.979 --> 00:01:29.181
  • Natalie, i want to start, i think, with the most obvious.
  • 00:01:29.181 --> 00:01:31.950
  • We want to know how you're doing.
  • 00:01:31.950 --> 00:01:33.318
  • You've had over a year now since that horrific attack at nova.
  • 00:01:33.318 --> 00:01:36.688
  • Tell us how you are.
  • 00:01:37.155 --> 00:01:39.090
  • I feel very fortunate, especially,
  • 00:01:39.090 --> 00:01:41.626
  • Since about a month after the attacks
  • 00:01:42.427 --> 00:01:44.596
  • I started working for the combat anti-semitism movement and
  • 00:01:44.596 --> 00:01:48.667
  • Working with them and speaking out
  • 00:01:48.667 --> 00:01:50.435
  • And speaking out on the news and interviewing
  • 00:01:50.435 --> 00:01:53.205
  • Has given me the opportunity to take something horrible
  • 00:01:53.205 --> 00:01:55.807
  • That happened to me and try to turn it into something good.
  • 00:01:55.807 --> 00:01:59.010
  • A lot of the work we do is with interfaith relations,
  • 00:01:59.010 --> 00:02:01.880
  • And i'm just trying to build a better future.
  • 00:02:01.880 --> 00:02:05.617
  • Well, i have been there.
  • 00:02:06.151 --> 00:02:07.352
  • I mean, i've walked through that field
  • 00:02:07.352 --> 00:02:08.820
  • And then i've walked through
  • 00:02:08.820 --> 00:02:09.754
  • Then to the streets of those communities
  • 00:02:09.754 --> 00:02:12.123
  • That were so traumatized by that horror.
  • 00:02:12.123 --> 00:02:15.327
  • And i want you to just our
  • 00:02:15.327 --> 00:02:18.930
  • The compassion we have
  • 00:02:19.397 --> 00:02:20.899
  • For what you've been required to overcome, i think is amazing.
  • 00:02:20.899 --> 00:02:24.436
  • The courage you and the israeli community
  • 00:02:24.436 --> 00:02:26.471
  • Has demonstrated for the whole global community
  • 00:02:26.471 --> 00:02:29.074
  • To see the way you have overcome that is truly remarkable.
  • 00:02:29.074 --> 00:02:31.810
  • I think it's a gift to all of us.
  • 00:02:31.810 --> 00:02:33.979
  • Thank you very much.
  • 00:02:33.979 --> 00:02:35.213
  • I think more people in this country need to hear your story,
  • 00:02:35.213 --> 00:02:38.116
  • Because the support from
  • 00:02:38.116 --> 00:02:39.050
  • This country has been unfortunately, mixed.
  • 00:02:39.050 --> 00:02:42.387
  • Something your prime minister was
  • 00:02:42.387 --> 00:02:43.888
  • Not hesitant about addressing.
  • 00:02:43.888 --> 00:02:46.491
  • What's happening on america's college campuses is horrific.
  • 00:02:46.491 --> 00:02:50.795
  • Anti-semitic mobs have taken over leading universities
  • 00:02:50.795 --> 00:02:54.099
  • That call for the annihilation of israel.
  • 00:02:54.099 --> 00:02:56.501
  • They attacked jewish students.
  • 00:02:56.501 --> 00:02:58.069
  • They attacked jewish faculty.
  • 00:02:58.069 --> 00:02:59.971
  • This is reminiscent of what happened
  • 00:03:00.739 --> 00:03:02.140
  • In german universities in the 1930s.
  • 00:03:02.140 --> 00:03:05.243
  • It's unconscionable.
  • 00:03:05.243 --> 00:03:06.845
  • It has to be stopped.
  • 00:03:06.845 --> 00:03:07.912
  • It has to be condemned and condemned unequivocally.
  • 00:03:07.912 --> 00:03:10.949
  • But that's not what happened.
  • 00:03:10.949 --> 00:03:12.651
  • The response of several university
  • 00:03:12.651 --> 00:03:14.419
  • Presidents was shameful.
  • 00:03:14.419 --> 00:03:15.887
  • I really want to hear from both of you on this.
  • 00:03:15.887 --> 00:03:18.123
  • I was shocked at what happened here
  • 00:03:18.123 --> 00:03:20.091
  • In the states, on our university campuses.
  • 00:03:20.091 --> 00:03:23.361
  • Did you expect that?
  • 00:03:23.361 --> 00:03:24.462
  • Did you understand that was coming,
  • 00:03:24.462 --> 00:03:26.164
  • Or was that as much of a shock the use it was to me?
  • 00:03:26.164 --> 00:03:28.400
  • Natalie, you tell us first, but i want you both to comment.
  • 00:03:28.400 --> 00:03:31.036
  • I started interviewing,
  • 00:03:31.036 --> 00:03:33.038
  • Just about four days after the attacks and the reason
  • 00:03:33.038 --> 00:03:36.741
  • Why, to me, it
  • 00:03:37.075 --> 00:03:38.276
  • Felt so necessary to do so is because i completely expected
  • 00:03:38.276 --> 00:03:41.146
  • This reaction from the world, unfortunately.
  • 00:03:41.146 --> 00:03:44.182
  • I, i knew that very soon,
  • 00:03:44.749 --> 00:03:47.385
  • Right after the attacks,
  • 00:03:47.385 --> 00:03:48.320
  • There was a little bit of
  • 00:03:48.320 --> 00:03:49.154
  • Silence. and then i knew very soon
  • 00:03:49.154 --> 00:03:52.257
  • The world will start attacking us.
  • 00:03:52.257 --> 00:03:54.426
  • And that's why i wanted to interview.
  • 00:03:54.426 --> 00:03:55.994
  • I wanted to put a face to the statistics,
  • 00:03:55.994 --> 00:03:59.164
  • And i hoped that through interviewing,
  • 00:03:59.164 --> 00:04:00.999
  • People would see me and think to themselves,
  • 00:04:00.999 --> 00:04:02.867
  • You know,
  • 00:04:02.867 --> 00:04:03.635
  • This could have been
  • 00:04:03.635 --> 00:04:04.602
  • My daughter, this could have been my friend.
  • 00:04:04.602 --> 00:04:07.372
  • I feel that it's harder to see a face
  • 00:04:07.372 --> 00:04:11.076
  • And then to flat out say these attacks were justified.
  • 00:04:11.076 --> 00:04:14.479
  • The rape was justified.
  • 00:04:14.479 --> 00:04:15.380
  • The killing was justified.
  • 00:04:15.380 --> 00:04:17.816
  • So i did expect it.
  • 00:04:17.816 --> 00:04:19.317
  • And that's why
  • 00:04:19.317 --> 00:04:20.852
  • It was so important for me to start interviewing right away.
  • 00:04:20.852 --> 00:04:24.989
  • Well, you know, e.j.,
  • 00:04:25.490 --> 00:04:27.859
  • I've lived in israel.
  • 00:04:27.859 --> 00:04:28.827
  • I studied at the university there.
  • 00:04:28.827 --> 00:04:30.295
  • So i have some awareness,
  • 00:04:30.295 --> 00:04:32.464
  • But i wasn't prepared for what boiled up on these campuses.
  • 00:04:32.464 --> 00:04:35.367
  • Were you surprised by that?
  • 00:04:35.367 --> 00:04:36.968
  • Unfortunately, i was not.
  • 00:04:36.968 --> 00:04:39.604
  • As as an organization, we were started in february
  • 00:04:39.604 --> 00:04:44.376
  • 2019, and we were started because we saw that
  • 00:04:44.376 --> 00:04:48.646
  • There were areas in fighting anti-semitism
  • 00:04:48.646 --> 00:04:51.716
  • That weren't getting the
  • 00:04:51.716 --> 00:04:52.984
  • Attention they needed in a major area was on college campuses.
  • 00:04:52.984 --> 00:04:56.521
  • This issue was there for years.
  • 00:04:56.521 --> 00:04:59.290
  • It's been cultivated for generations
  • 00:04:59.290 --> 00:05:03.094
  • On these college campuses, and it was masked under the guise
  • 00:05:03.094 --> 00:05:07.465
  • Of free speech when they would shut down speakers
  • 00:05:07.465 --> 00:05:11.703
  • Who had viewpoints that they didn't agree with,
  • 00:05:11.703 --> 00:05:13.638
  • Whether it was conservative voices, whether it was idf
  • 00:05:13.638 --> 00:05:17.509
  • Or former idf, soldiers coming to campus to talk.
  • 00:05:17.509 --> 00:05:22.447
  • So when october 7th happened, and 24 hours
  • 00:05:22.447 --> 00:05:26.951
  • Later, you've got protests starting on college campuses.
  • 00:05:26.951 --> 00:05:30.221
  • Sadly, it wasn't a shock to me, but to you and to many people,
  • 00:05:30.221 --> 00:05:34.426
  • It was a complete shock that this was happening.
  • 00:05:34.426 --> 00:05:37.395
  • But october 7th
  • 00:05:37.395 --> 00:05:40.765
  • Was not
  • 00:05:40.999 --> 00:05:42.033
  • The cause for the protests on college campuses.
  • 00:05:42.033 --> 00:05:44.869
  • October 7th was the excuse
  • 00:05:45.437 --> 00:05:48.273
  • To launch this movement on college campuses
  • 00:05:48.273 --> 00:05:52.811
  • Because they are they are siding with a terrorist organization,
  • 00:05:52.811 --> 00:05:58.149
  • Not standing up for the rights of the palestinian people.
  • 00:05:58.149 --> 00:06:02.187
  • They were standing up for a terrorist organization
  • 00:06:02.187 --> 00:06:05.990
  • Aiming to commit genocide against the jewish people.
  • 00:06:05.990 --> 00:06:09.561
  • Well, what was shocking was these high profile universities.
  • 00:06:09.561 --> 00:06:13.965
  • I won't call them a lead any longer
  • 00:06:13.965 --> 00:06:16.968
  • With these high profile schools had clearly
  • 00:06:16.968 --> 00:06:19.337
  • Been creating propaganda in their students.
  • 00:06:19.337 --> 00:06:22.607
  • They weren't informed.
  • 00:06:22.607 --> 00:06:23.741
  • They didn't even understand what they were chanting.
  • 00:06:23.741 --> 00:06:26.511
  • They've just been mobilized along an ideology of hate,
  • 00:06:26.511 --> 00:06:29.848
  • And they're paying enormous amounts of money
  • 00:06:30.782 --> 00:06:33.017
  • To be programed in a very disgusting way.
  • 00:06:33.017 --> 00:06:36.754
  • So do you think we can change the nature of these campuses?
  • 00:06:36.754 --> 00:06:39.991
  • What do we have to do to turn that around?
  • 00:06:39.991 --> 00:06:41.960
  • Yeah, i think the biggest thing
  • 00:06:41.960 --> 00:06:44.462
  • To turn this around is leadership.
  • 00:06:44.462 --> 00:06:47.298
  • We saw that certain universities where college presidents
  • 00:06:47.298 --> 00:06:51.202
  • Would come out and say, this is not okay on our campus.
  • 00:06:51.202 --> 00:06:54.706
  • We are going to stand up and protect
  • 00:06:54.706 --> 00:06:57.008
  • The rights of jewish students and not just
  • 00:06:57.008 --> 00:07:00.378
  • Jewish students, but those that are supporting israel.
  • 00:07:00.378 --> 00:07:04.148
  • Versus these, you know, former,
  • 00:07:04.782 --> 00:07:07.986
  • Elite universities where their college presidents
  • 00:07:07.986 --> 00:07:11.623
  • Were afraid to speak the truth, which is that activity,
  • 00:07:11.623 --> 00:07:16.427
  • Those actions are reprehensible
  • 00:07:16.427 --> 00:07:20.164
  • And should be violating their codes of conduct
  • 00:07:20.164 --> 00:07:24.102
  • And should be called out immediately and shut down.
  • 00:07:24.102 --> 00:07:27.705
  • Those those were creating a hostile environment
  • 00:07:27.705 --> 00:07:31.009
  • For jewish students and would not have been tolerated against,
  • 00:07:31.009 --> 00:07:35.613
  • Any other minority group on their campus.
  • 00:07:35.613 --> 00:07:39.183
  • That's absolutely true.
  • 00:07:39.183 --> 00:07:40.618
  • It's an issue of leadership, and it's something that
  • 00:07:40.618 --> 00:07:44.222
  • We've seen as a major failure at a lot of these universities.
  • 00:07:44.222 --> 00:07:48.192
  • And when we allow it in the universities
  • 00:07:48.192 --> 00:07:50.461
  • That it infects the broader culture,
  • 00:07:50.461 --> 00:07:52.096
  • Because the students absorb that propaganda and go out
  • 00:07:52.096 --> 00:07:55.400
  • Into the marketplace with that hate planted in their soul.
  • 00:07:55.400 --> 00:07:59.370
  • I think a recent example of that that was so clear.
  • 00:07:59.370 --> 00:08:01.472
  • While the idf was mapping out a strategy to respond to iran.
  • 00:08:01.472 --> 00:08:04.709
  • Their plans were leaked from the pentagon.
  • 00:08:05.577 --> 00:08:08.513
  • I mean, that is anti semitism on display.
  • 00:08:08.513 --> 00:08:11.883
  • But no doubt those seeds planted in some elite university.
  • 00:08:11.883 --> 00:08:15.620
  • How does that feel
  • 00:08:16.054 --> 00:08:17.155
  • To the jewish community when the pentagon is leaking
  • 00:08:17.155 --> 00:08:19.991
  • Israel's battle plans?
  • 00:08:19.991 --> 00:08:22.160
  • Yeah, it's, it's very dangerous.
  • 00:08:22.794 --> 00:08:26.230
  • And one of the biggest challenges from that leak
  • 00:08:26.230 --> 00:08:30.301
  • Was the trust between the united states and israel.
  • 00:08:30.301 --> 00:08:34.472
  • I mean, the the united states and israel are,
  • 00:08:34.472 --> 00:08:37.675
  • You know, israel is one of the united states, its closest
  • 00:08:37.675 --> 00:08:41.379
  • Ally and certainly the closest ally in the region.
  • 00:08:41.379 --> 00:08:44.983
  • And when israel cannot trust
  • 00:08:44.983 --> 00:08:48.419
  • That these conversations at high levels
  • 00:08:48.419 --> 00:08:51.522
  • Will be kept secret,
  • 00:08:51.522 --> 00:08:54.025
  • It disturbs that trust.
  • 00:08:54.025 --> 00:08:55.560
  • And it's not just a threat for israel in the region.
  • 00:08:55.560 --> 00:08:59.530
  • But imagine now,
  • 00:08:59.530 --> 00:09:00.698
  • If israel is carrying out these actions against iran,
  • 00:09:00.698 --> 00:09:04.736
  • And the united states is partially in the dark about
  • 00:09:04.736 --> 00:09:07.639
  • What's going to happen. and when it's going to happen.
  • 00:09:07.639 --> 00:09:10.141
  • And the risk
  • 00:09:10.141 --> 00:09:11.376
  • That that could potentially pose to our troops in the region.
  • 00:09:11.376 --> 00:09:15.113
  • So it's it's a very dangerous situation.
  • 00:09:15.113 --> 00:09:18.116
  • And you're right.
  • 00:09:18.116 --> 00:09:19.250
  • What started on the college campuses,
  • 00:09:19.250 --> 00:09:21.519
  • All those people there, they go out and have jobs
  • 00:09:21.519 --> 00:09:26.090
  • And it
  • 00:09:26.290 --> 00:09:27.125
  • Permeates into their their daily lives.
  • 00:09:27.125 --> 00:09:30.161
  • Well, you're both very gracious.
  • 00:09:30.795 --> 00:09:32.030
  • It doesn't just disturb trust.
  • 00:09:32.030 --> 00:09:33.598
  • It's a breach of trust.
  • 00:09:33.598 --> 00:09:35.600
  • And that has to be identified, rooted out.
  • 00:09:35.600 --> 00:09:37.702
  • We can't tolerate it and accept that.
  • 00:09:37.702 --> 00:09:39.370
  • It's just not okay.
  • 00:09:39.370 --> 00:09:41.639
  • When we come back, we'd like to hear what it was like for you.
  • 00:09:41.639 --> 00:09:44.475
  • Natalie, on october the 7th.
  • 00:09:44.475 --> 00:09:46.511
  • We'll be back in just a moment.
  • 00:09:46.511 --> 00:09:54.007
  • We'll be back in just a moment.
  • 00:09:54.007 --> 00:09:59.326
  • We're back now with e.j.
  • 00:09:59.860 --> 00:10:01.162
  • Campbell, the director of interfaith
  • 00:10:01.162 --> 00:10:02.630
  • Outreach and engagement
  • 00:10:02.630 --> 00:10:04.298
  • And the public affairs officer, natalie sanandaji.
  • 00:10:04.298 --> 00:10:07.601
  • They both now work to combat anti-semitism.
  • 00:10:07.601 --> 00:10:10.838
  • Natalie, can you take just a few minutes
  • 00:10:11.672 --> 00:10:13.841
  • And tell us about your experiences on october 7th?
  • 00:10:13.841 --> 00:10:16.510
  • We've seen the news clips,
  • 00:10:16.510 --> 00:10:18.245
  • But i'm sure of what
  • 00:10:18.245 --> 00:10:19.246
  • Your experiences were dramatically different.
  • 00:10:19.246 --> 00:10:21.716
  • So me and my friends arrived at the festival at around 1 a.m.,
  • 00:10:21.716 --> 00:10:25.619
  • And typically with festivals like these,
  • 00:10:25.619 --> 00:10:27.521
  • They go anywhere from 24 hours to three days.
  • 00:10:27.521 --> 00:10:30.324
  • So you bring camping gear with you.
  • 00:10:30.324 --> 00:10:31.992
  • You bring sleeping bags and tents.
  • 00:10:31.992 --> 00:10:34.161
  • And after a few hours of dancing, me
  • 00:10:34.161 --> 00:10:36.363
  • And my friends
  • 00:10:36.363 --> 00:10:37.598
  • Decided to rest for a few hours and wake up for the sunrise
  • 00:10:37.598 --> 00:10:40.034
  • Set of the festival, which is supposed
  • 00:10:40.034 --> 00:10:41.936
  • To be the most exciting part.
  • 00:10:41.936 --> 00:10:44.105
  • And instead of waking up to the sound of the sunrise set music,
  • 00:10:44.105 --> 00:10:47.608
  • We woke up to the sound of rockets.
  • 00:10:47.608 --> 00:10:49.376
  • And for me, when i started interviewing,
  • 00:10:50.177 --> 00:10:52.079
  • One of the most important things for me to point out
  • 00:10:52.079 --> 00:10:54.315
  • To american audiences is the way we were woken up.
  • 00:10:54.315 --> 00:10:57.485
  • So one of our friends was on the dance floor
  • 00:10:57.485 --> 00:10:59.520
  • When the first rockets were intercepted,
  • 00:10:59.520 --> 00:11:01.088
  • And she knew that we were sleeping,
  • 00:11:01.088 --> 00:11:02.923
  • And she wants to come wake us up
  • 00:11:02.923 --> 00:11:04.158
  • And make sure we were alert to the situation.
  • 00:11:04.158 --> 00:11:06.660
  • So she came and she was smiling, and she kind of nudged us away
  • 00:11:06.660 --> 00:11:09.730
  • Because she was like, good morning, guys.
  • 00:11:09.730 --> 00:11:12.166
  • I just wanted you to know a few rockets were intercepted
  • 00:11:12.166 --> 00:11:14.401
  • Overhead, but it's fine.
  • 00:11:14.401 --> 00:11:16.170
  • It's normal for the area that we're in.
  • 00:11:16.170 --> 00:11:17.738
  • And, you know, it's the holidays.
  • 00:11:17.738 --> 00:11:18.839
  • They like to do this on the holidays.
  • 00:11:18.839 --> 00:11:20.775
  • I'm sure it's just going to be a few.
  • 00:11:20.775 --> 00:11:22.243
  • It'll pass and the party will continue.
  • 00:11:22.243 --> 00:11:23.844
  • So like, nothing to worry about.
  • 00:11:23.844 --> 00:11:25.346
  • Just wanted you guys to be awake.
  • 00:11:25.346 --> 00:11:27.548
  • And i tried to tell people, you know,
  • 00:11:27.548 --> 00:11:29.517
  • Imagine a festival happening
  • 00:11:29.517 --> 00:11:31.452
  • In california, imagine coachella festival and imagine
  • 00:11:31.452 --> 00:11:34.822
  • People are dancing and suddenly
  • 00:11:34.822 --> 00:11:36.090
  • Rockets are intercepted over their heads.
  • 00:11:36.090 --> 00:11:39.326
  • There's no way that they would react in such a calm manner.
  • 00:11:39.326 --> 00:11:42.396
  • But for israelis, unfortunately, this is their reality.
  • 00:11:42.396 --> 00:11:45.166
  • This is something they deal with on a semi-regular basis.
  • 00:11:45.166 --> 00:11:49.003
  • But i sort of counting the rockets, and eventually
  • 00:11:49.003 --> 00:11:51.972
  • We start to realize
  • 00:11:51.972 --> 00:11:52.973
  • This is a way more serious situation
  • 00:11:52.973 --> 00:11:55.176
  • Than what we originally thought.
  • 00:11:55.176 --> 00:11:57.244
  • The security tells us to evacuate.
  • 00:11:58.012 --> 00:11:59.647
  • We start heading to our cars
  • 00:11:59.647 --> 00:12:01.982
  • After a few minutes of trying to drive out.
  • 00:12:01.982 --> 00:12:03.951
  • It's thousands of people trying to drive at the same time.
  • 00:12:03.951 --> 00:12:06.787
  • We're driving very slowly,
  • 00:12:06.787 --> 00:12:07.922
  • And security starts yelling at us
  • 00:12:07.922 --> 00:12:09.323
  • To get out of our cars and start running.
  • 00:12:09.323 --> 00:12:11.926
  • And we could understand why they would
  • 00:12:11.926 --> 00:12:13.060
  • Tell us to run from rockets.
  • 00:12:13.060 --> 00:12:14.295
  • But we figured, you know, we should listen to them.
  • 00:12:14.295 --> 00:12:15.896
  • So we pull our car over.
  • 00:12:15.896 --> 00:12:17.765
  • And right after we pull our car over,
  • 00:12:17.765 --> 00:12:20.301
  • That's when we hear the first gunshots.
  • 00:12:20.301 --> 00:12:22.436
  • And from there, we ran for about four hours
  • 00:12:22.436 --> 00:12:25.940
  • Running from hamas terrorists running from gunshots.
  • 00:12:25.940 --> 00:12:30.177
  • And one of the main questions i got asked was how i knew
  • 00:12:30.177 --> 00:12:33.647
  • What direction to run to.
  • 00:12:33.647 --> 00:12:34.748
  • How i knew what decisions to make to save my life.
  • 00:12:34.748 --> 00:12:36.884
  • And the answer is that nobody knew. and,
  • 00:12:36.884 --> 00:12:40.921
  • There's a phrase that holocaust survivors
  • 00:12:41.789 --> 00:12:44.158
  • Coined when it came to life and death situations
  • 00:12:44.158 --> 00:12:47.027
  • And how they knew what decisions to make.
  • 00:12:47.027 --> 00:12:48.529
  • And it's, the kind of phrase called choiceless choice.
  • 00:12:48.529 --> 00:12:51.799
  • And basically,
  • 00:12:52.132 --> 00:12:53.300
  • The meaning is that in these life and death situations,
  • 00:12:53.300 --> 00:12:55.236
  • You don't have much time to try to assess
  • 00:12:55.236 --> 00:12:57.171
  • What decisions are going to be the better
  • 00:12:57.171 --> 00:12:58.439
  • Decision, which one will save your life
  • 00:12:58.439 --> 00:13:00.274
  • As opposed to getting you killed.
  • 00:13:00.274 --> 00:13:01.976
  • You have to make a decision in that moment.
  • 00:13:01.976 --> 00:13:04.111
  • And all the decisions we made while running for the hamas
  • 00:13:04.111 --> 00:13:06.714
  • Terrorists were choiceless choices.
  • 00:13:06.714 --> 00:13:08.716
  • And i'll just end with an example of the main
  • 00:13:08.716 --> 00:13:11.585
  • Choiceless choice that will always stick with me.
  • 00:13:11.585 --> 00:13:14.521
  • About three hours into running.
  • 00:13:14.521 --> 00:13:16.156
  • We pass by a group of friends that were hiding in a ditch
  • 00:13:16.156 --> 00:13:19.460
  • And they called us over
  • 00:13:19.960 --> 00:13:21.362
  • And they told us to come hide with them
  • 00:13:21.362 --> 00:13:22.663
  • And we start crawling into this ditch.
  • 00:13:22.663 --> 00:13:24.031
  • And there's maybe
  • 00:13:24.031 --> 00:13:24.999
  • Ten of them in this giant ditch in the ground.
  • 00:13:24.999 --> 00:13:28.202
  • And one of the three friends i came with, he was standing on
  • 00:13:28.202 --> 00:13:31.138
  • Top of the ditch. he didn't crawling with us.
  • 00:13:31.138 --> 00:13:33.107
  • And he looks down at all of us in this ditch,
  • 00:13:33.107 --> 00:13:35.309
  • Laying in this stitch, and he starts freaking out.
  • 00:13:35.309 --> 00:13:37.578
  • He starts yelling at us
  • 00:13:37.578 --> 00:13:38.979
  • That this is a horrible idea,
  • 00:13:38.979 --> 00:13:40.314
  • And that if the hamas terrorists find us, we're sitting ducks.
  • 00:13:40.314 --> 00:13:42.883
  • They're going to come from above us and kill us all.
  • 00:13:42.883 --> 00:13:45.419
  • And he said our only option
  • 00:13:45.419 --> 00:13:46.620
  • For survival is to continue running.
  • 00:13:46.620 --> 00:13:49.056
  • So we got out. we continue to run.
  • 00:13:49.056 --> 00:13:51.492
  • And unfortunately
  • 00:13:51.926 --> 00:13:54.061
  • For the 10 or 15 friends that we left behind
  • 00:13:54.061 --> 00:13:56.163
  • In that ditch,
  • 00:13:56.163 --> 00:13:56.864
  • We found out a day or two later
  • 00:13:56.864 --> 00:13:58.766
  • That none of them had made it out alive.
  • 00:13:58.766 --> 00:14:01.235
  • And that's just one of the many examples of choices, choices
  • 00:14:01.235 --> 00:14:03.771
  • We made, whether it was turning left or right,
  • 00:14:03.771 --> 00:14:06.173
  • Whether it was choosing to hide or continue to run.
  • 00:14:06.173 --> 00:14:09.276
  • And i consider myself very lucky to be here
  • 00:14:10.210 --> 00:14:12.846
  • And to be able to speak to you, but i'm speaking out on behalf
  • 00:14:12.846 --> 00:14:16.917
  • Not just of my story, but i'm speaking
  • 00:14:16.917 --> 00:14:18.686
  • On behalf of all of those who didn't make it
  • 00:14:18.686 --> 00:14:20.220
  • And all those who no longer have a voice.
  • 00:14:20.220 --> 00:14:21.755
  • So i want to say thank you
  • 00:14:21.755 --> 00:14:23.357
  • For having me, allowing me to speak on their behalf.
  • 00:14:23.357 --> 00:14:26.894
  • Well, we're honored to have you.
  • 00:14:26.894 --> 00:14:28.095
  • I have many friends or i have had many friends
  • 00:14:28.095 --> 00:14:30.798
  • Who were holocaust survivors,
  • 00:14:30.798 --> 00:14:32.933
  • And their voices have been so important to help
  • 00:14:32.933 --> 00:14:36.403
  • With a number of decisions from that day until this.
  • 00:14:36.403 --> 00:14:38.939
  • And your voice is important.
  • 00:14:38.939 --> 00:14:41.175
  • We can't afford to forget.
  • 00:14:41.175 --> 00:14:42.710
  • And i thank you for your courage,
  • 00:14:42.710 --> 00:14:43.978
  • Because i know this isn't easy. thank you.
  • 00:14:43.978 --> 00:14:46.046
  • But it really leads me to my next question.
  • 00:14:46.046 --> 00:14:48.182
  • It's been reported that hamas influence
  • 00:14:48.182 --> 00:14:50.351
  • Has been building in the us for a long time,
  • 00:14:50.351 --> 00:14:54.121
  • And it's out of the public eye for the most part, americans
  • 00:14:54.121 --> 00:14:56.557
  • Aren't aware we don't live with the awareness of rockets,
  • 00:14:56.557 --> 00:14:59.593
  • But that it surfaced when these organized campus
  • 00:14:59.593 --> 00:15:01.795
  • Groups and others began appearing
  • 00:15:01.795 --> 00:15:03.263
  • So quickly all over our country following that october attack.
  • 00:15:03.263 --> 00:15:07.101
  • Well, the fbi director, christopher wray, has spoken
  • 00:15:07.101 --> 00:15:10.371
  • Openly about the potential for real trouble,
  • 00:15:10.371 --> 00:15:12.873
  • Not in israel now, but in the united states.
  • 00:15:12.873 --> 00:15:16.110
  • There was already a heightened risk of violence
  • 00:15:16.110 --> 00:15:18.779
  • In the united states before october 7th.
  • 00:15:18.779 --> 00:15:22.182
  • Since then, we've seen a rogue's
  • 00:15:22.182 --> 00:15:25.285
  • Gallery of foreign terrorist organizations call for attacks
  • 00:15:25.285 --> 00:15:29.423
  • Against americans and our allies.
  • 00:15:29.423 --> 00:15:32.760
  • And given those calls for action,
  • 00:15:32.760 --> 00:15:35.996
  • Our most immediate concern has been that individuals
  • 00:15:35.996 --> 00:15:39.366
  • Or small groups will draw some kind of twisted inspiration
  • 00:15:39.366 --> 00:15:42.870
  • From the events in the middle east,
  • 00:15:42.870 --> 00:15:44.805
  • Or the reports show that this campus chaos was created
  • 00:15:44.805 --> 00:15:47.741
  • By a group called american muslims for palestine,
  • 00:15:47.741 --> 00:15:50.911
  • Incubated, funded
  • 00:15:51.345 --> 00:15:52.546
  • And directed by the students for justice in palestine. e.j.
  • 00:15:52.546 --> 00:15:56.050
  • What more can you tell us about that?
  • 00:15:56.050 --> 00:15:58.085
  • Is it a real threat here? it is a real threat here.
  • 00:15:58.085 --> 00:16:00.854
  • And the american muslims for palestine
  • 00:16:00.854 --> 00:16:04.258
  • Is is actually currently, being sued in virginia
  • 00:16:04.258 --> 00:16:09.530
  • Specifically because of their connection
  • 00:16:09.530 --> 00:16:12.066
  • To previous organizations that were documented
  • 00:16:12.066 --> 00:16:15.436
  • To be part of the hamas support network in the united states.
  • 00:16:15.436 --> 00:16:19.106
  • And we're talking about groups
  • 00:16:19.106 --> 00:16:20.674
  • In the united states in the 90s and in the 80s.
  • 00:16:20.674 --> 00:16:24.678
  • And this movement really started in the united states.
  • 00:16:24.678 --> 00:16:27.781
  • You could even go back into the early 1960s
  • 00:16:27.781 --> 00:16:30.751
  • When the muslim brotherhood
  • 00:16:30.751 --> 00:16:32.086
  • Group, which started in egypt, came to the united states.
  • 00:16:32.086 --> 00:16:36.023
  • And, you know, the the hamas organization
  • 00:16:36.023 --> 00:16:40.527
  • Is considered the muslim brotherhood group in palestine.
  • 00:16:40.527 --> 00:16:44.164
  • That's so they are part of this muslim brotherhood movement.
  • 00:16:44.164 --> 00:16:47.935
  • So this is something
  • 00:16:47.935 --> 00:16:49.069
  • That's been happening in the united states for years.
  • 00:16:49.069 --> 00:16:52.673
  • There have been ebbs and flows with the influence of it,
  • 00:16:52.673 --> 00:16:55.642
  • But this is 100% part of that support network.
  • 00:16:55.642 --> 00:16:59.613
  • And we're seeing not just what's happening today,
  • 00:16:59.613 --> 00:17:03.350
  • But we're seeing the years
  • 00:17:03.350 --> 00:17:05.285
  • Of of activity that's led to what we're seeing today.
  • 00:17:05.285 --> 00:17:10.023
  • Natalie, there's a quote i want to ask you about.
  • 00:17:10.991 --> 00:17:13.594
  • When i read it, it really touched my heart.
  • 00:17:13.594 --> 00:17:15.362
  • You said that
  • 00:17:15.362 --> 00:17:16.463
  • Your mother taught you that holding a grudge and hating
  • 00:17:16.463 --> 00:17:18.932
  • Someone is like drinking poison,
  • 00:17:18.932 --> 00:17:20.667
  • And then expecting the other person to get hurt.
  • 00:17:20.667 --> 00:17:23.637
  • Well, hamas and hezbollah need to be stopped.
  • 00:17:23.637 --> 00:17:26.340
  • Hating the whole group of people
  • 00:17:26.340 --> 00:17:27.541
  • Isn't going to solve the problem.
  • 00:17:27.541 --> 00:17:29.576
  • Can you tell us what you're doing?
  • 00:17:29.576 --> 00:17:31.612
  • Explain that quote and how you're living that out.
  • 00:17:31.612 --> 00:17:35.349
  • So as i said before, i feel very fortunate
  • 00:17:35.349 --> 00:17:38.051
  • That since the attacks, i've had the opportunity
  • 00:17:38.051 --> 00:17:40.988
  • To start working for the combat anti-semitism movement
  • 00:17:40.988 --> 00:17:44.024
  • And take something horrible that happened to me
  • 00:17:44.024 --> 00:17:46.460
  • And try to turn into something good.
  • 00:17:46.460 --> 00:17:47.861
  • And doing that good is building bridges and building
  • 00:17:47.861 --> 00:17:51.832
  • Bridges between our community and the muslim community.
  • 00:17:51.832 --> 00:17:55.636
  • Because
  • 00:17:55.869 --> 00:17:57.037
  • Going in and hating it's not going to fix what happened.
  • 00:17:57.037 --> 00:17:59.339
  • It's not going to change what happening.
  • 00:17:59.339 --> 00:18:00.541
  • You can't change the past.
  • 00:18:00.541 --> 00:18:02.009
  • You can only change the future.
  • 00:18:02.009 --> 00:18:03.810
  • And that's my goal is, to change the future and,
  • 00:18:03.810 --> 00:18:07.381
  • I, i really have my mom to thank for that,
  • 00:18:07.381 --> 00:18:10.284
  • For that type of point of view that she's given me,
  • 00:18:10.284 --> 00:18:12.586
  • That i've been able to carry with me. and,
  • 00:18:12.586 --> 00:18:15.889
  • Go on through my life, you know,
  • 00:18:16.523 --> 00:18:18.525
  • Not hating because it's it's easy to hate.
  • 00:18:18.525 --> 00:18:21.662
  • You can easily hate someone
  • 00:18:21.662 --> 00:18:22.896
  • That did something like that to you,
  • 00:18:22.896 --> 00:18:24.031
  • But you have to understand that a whole group of people
  • 00:18:24.031 --> 00:18:27.000
  • Is not hamas. they're not all hamas.
  • 00:18:27.000 --> 00:18:29.369
  • They don't have the same ideologies.
  • 00:18:29.369 --> 00:18:31.605
  • And even when it comes to the the people of gaza,
  • 00:18:31.605 --> 00:18:35.809
  • I don't hate all of them.
  • 00:18:35.809 --> 00:18:36.810
  • I don't blame all of them.
  • 00:18:36.810 --> 00:18:38.445
  • I try to put myself in their shoes.
  • 00:18:38.445 --> 00:18:39.880
  • I try to imagine
  • 00:18:39.880 --> 00:18:41.715
  • If i was born into that culture, into that society.
  • 00:18:41.715 --> 00:18:44.551
  • If i was brainwashed
  • 00:18:44.551 --> 00:18:45.586
  • From such a young age, would i think differently?
  • 00:18:45.586 --> 00:18:49.289
  • Would i break out of it or would i follow suit?
  • 00:18:49.289 --> 00:18:52.192
  • And the answer is you. you can't know.
  • 00:18:52.192 --> 00:18:56.196
  • Well,
  • 00:18:56.430 --> 00:18:57.631
  • I appreciate your courage and both of you for your voice.
  • 00:18:57.631 --> 00:18:59.600
  • It's important that only remember
  • 00:18:59.600 --> 00:19:00.734
  • What our friends in israel.
  • 00:19:00.734 --> 00:19:01.602
  • But remember what we have to do
  • 00:19:01.602 --> 00:19:03.370
  • In the united states to keep us all safe.
  • 00:19:03.370 --> 00:19:05.939
  • Thank you both for joining us today.
  • 00:19:05.939 --> 00:19:07.608
  • We want to stay in touch in the years ahead.
  • 00:19:07.608 --> 00:19:10.310
  • And in a moment, i'm going to share some of my own thoughts.
  • 00:19:10.310 --> 00:19:24.524
  • In the book of romans chapter 12, we're given some life advice
  • 00:19:25.726 --> 00:19:29.229
  • Not to be overcome by evil, but to overcome evil with good.
  • 00:19:29.229 --> 00:19:33.233
  • When we hear a story as horrific as what happened
  • 00:19:33.233 --> 00:19:35.636
  • In israel on october the 7th,
  • 00:19:35.636 --> 00:19:37.504
  • I think it's easy to be focused on the evil.
  • 00:19:37.504 --> 00:19:39.906
  • But i want to bring you back to the assignment that we have
  • 00:19:39.906 --> 00:19:42.476
  • To overcome evil with the good in us.
  • 00:19:42.476 --> 00:19:45.479
  • In that way, we can pray for the peace
  • 00:19:45.479 --> 00:19:47.114
  • Of jerusalem, stand with our friends in israel.
  • 00:19:47.114 --> 00:19:49.783
  • We don't want to deny that evil exist.
  • 00:19:49.783 --> 00:19:52.052
  • We just have to be determined
  • 00:19:52.052 --> 00:19:53.220
  • Not to let hatred grow in our heart.
  • 00:19:53.220 --> 00:19:55.289
  • That we can't respond to evil with more evil.
  • 00:19:55.289 --> 00:19:57.357
  • That we have to realize that there is good
  • 00:19:57.357 --> 00:19:59.559
  • Goodness comes from god and the people of faith.
  • 00:19:59.559 --> 00:20:02.162
  • We can overcome that evil by expressing god's goodness
  • 00:20:02.162 --> 00:20:05.732
  • In our world.
  • 00:20:05.732 --> 00:20:06.867
  • With that, i assure you there's more reasons for hope
  • 00:20:06.867 --> 00:20:09.770
  • Than despair.
  • 00:20:09.770 --> 00:20:11.371
  • I'll be back in just a moment.
  • 00:20:11.371 --> 00:20:26.453
  • Thank
  • 00:20:26.687 --> 00:20:27.854
  • You for joining us tonight for this most important story.
  • 00:20:27.854 --> 00:20:30.057
  • We didn't have a chance to read your emails,
  • 00:20:30.057 --> 00:20:32.192
  • But please remember, if you haven't yet,
  • 00:20:32.192 --> 00:20:34.127
  • Take a moment to send us your thoughts.
  • 00:20:34.127 --> 00:20:36.029
  • You can do that at comments at alan jackson now.com.
  • 00:20:36.029 --> 00:20:39.399
  • Your feedback and questions.
  • 00:20:39.399 --> 00:20:40.901
  • They do a lot to shape our show.
  • 00:20:40.901 --> 00:20:42.703
  • I'm alan jackson.
  • 00:20:42.703 --> 00:20:43.804
  • You have a wonderful evening.
  • 00:20:43.804 --> 00:20:43.804