Thomas S. Kidd & Cynthia Scott: Celebrating our Freedoms and Independence | Takeaways with Kirk Cameron

May 25, 2026 | 53:10

Kirk Cameron is joined by Thomas S. Kidd and Cynthia Scott discussing our nation’s independence, the price of freedom and the guidance of God throughout our country’s history.

#Author #Freedom #FreedomofSpeech #IdentityinChrist #Communication #TrustGod #Faith #Nations #History #AmericanHistory #Foundation #KirkCameron

Closed captions

Show Timecode

Takeaways with Kirk Cameron | Thomas S. Kidd & Cynthia Scott: Celebrating our Freedoms and Independence | Takeaways with Kirk Cameron | May 25, 2026

Kirk cameron: this year marks the 250th anniversary of the
00:00:01.814 --> 00:00:04.283
United states of america.
00:00:04.416 --> 00:00:05.851
As we celebrate the holidays throughout the year honoring our
00:00:05.951 --> 00:00:06.985
Veterans, it's easy to take for granted how hard fought those
00:00:09.288 --> 00:00:13.392
Battles were and the freedoms we enjoy today as a result of
00:00:13.392 --> 00:00:17.629
Their sacrifices.
00:00:17.629 --> 00:00:19.364
My guests thomas s. kidd and cynthia scott will share
00:00:19.364 --> 00:00:23.168
Insights about our country's history involving prayer, the
00:00:23.168 --> 00:00:27.406
Providence of god, and why we're known as the land of the free
00:00:27.406 --> 00:00:31.710
And the home of the brave.
00:00:31.710 --> 00:00:33.078
Thomas s. kidd: the evangelicals or kind of rationalist
00:00:33.078 --> 00:00:34.947
Christians or deists, they all believe that we live in a world
00:00:34.947 --> 00:00:38.684
That's created by god.
00:00:38.684 --> 00:00:40.552
If we lose that in america, i mean, i think that's devastating
00:00:40.552 --> 00:00:44.323
To what has unified us in the past around this common idea
00:00:44.323 --> 00:00:48.327
That all men are created equal.
00:00:48.327 --> 00:00:50.129
Cynthia scott: i am more and more astonished at what god did.
00:00:50.129 --> 00:00:52.431
Because he created a system of government, not a theocracy or a
00:00:52.431 --> 00:00:56.802
Monarchy, but rather a system that would provide for freedom
00:00:56.802 --> 00:01:00.606
For every person.
00:01:00.606 --> 00:01:02.074
Kirk: it's all coming up next on "takeaways."
00:01:02.074 --> 00:01:07.746
Kirk: my first guest is thomas s. kidd.
00:01:11.583 --> 00:01:14.253
He serves as research professor of church history at midwestern
00:01:14.253 --> 00:01:18.056
Baptist theological seminary in kansas city.
00:01:18.056 --> 00:01:21.426
He's also authored numerous books on american history,
00:01:21.426 --> 00:01:24.596
Including this one, which we're gonna talk about today, it's
00:01:24.596 --> 00:01:28.133
Called "god of liberty: a religious history of the
00:01:28.133 --> 00:01:31.904
American revolution.
00:01:31.904 --> 00:01:33.972
Thomas, thanks so much for coming on "takeaways."
00:01:33.972 --> 00:01:35.908
Thomas: thanks for having me.
00:01:35.908 --> 00:01:37.409
Kirk: so, many 5th graders today are being taught to be ashamed
00:01:37.409 --> 00:01:40.746
To be an american because of what america was supposedly
00:01:40.746 --> 00:01:44.950
Built on.
00:01:44.950 --> 00:01:46.285
And it was built on colonizers, and it was built on greedy
00:01:46.285 --> 00:01:48.854
Opportunists who came over and they were slave owners and they,
00:01:48.854 --> 00:01:53.325
Even christians will say they were in full rebellion against
00:01:53.325 --> 00:01:55.994
The civil authority of the crown of england, and they never
00:01:55.994 --> 00:01:58.163
Should have done what they did.
00:01:58.163 --> 00:01:59.865
Yet, you assert in your book that the timing of the
00:01:59.865 --> 00:02:05.070
Revolution coincided with this greater religious awakening and
00:02:05.070 --> 00:02:10.042
That evangelical christians had a large role in shaping biblical
00:02:10.042 --> 00:02:14.680
Freedom as we know it today.
00:02:14.680 --> 00:02:18.951
How would you make that case in light of everyone who says, "no,
00:02:18.951 --> 00:02:25.524
America was a product of the enlightenment"?
00:02:25.524 --> 00:02:28.193
Thomas: right, well, when you think about the patriot
00:02:28.193 --> 00:02:29.995
Movement, i mean, obviously, there are thousands and
00:02:29.995 --> 00:02:32.297
Thousands of people who were involved with the patriot
00:02:32.297 --> 00:02:34.533
Movement, and most of those people were just kind of
00:02:34.533 --> 00:02:36.301
Everyday christians.
00:02:36.301 --> 00:02:38.170
You know, we focus on the five or six sort of celebrity
00:02:38.170 --> 00:02:41.073
Founders, but you know, when you get out into the rank and file,
00:02:41.073 --> 00:02:44.409
There's just a lot of regular christians.
00:02:44.409 --> 00:02:45.978
I mean, one of the chaplains, for instance, that i tell the
00:02:45.978 --> 00:02:49.514
Story of in the book is a man named david avery, who, i think,
00:02:49.514 --> 00:02:53.018
Almost no one has heard of today.
00:02:53.018 --> 00:02:55.187
But he was there at the battle of bunker hill as a chaplain
00:02:55.187 --> 00:02:58.357
Praying over the troops as the battle was happening.
00:02:58.357 --> 00:03:02.294
And that was so normal that the continental army had its
00:03:02.294 --> 00:03:06.131
Chaplains and many of them were evangelical christians, and
00:03:06.131 --> 00:03:10.135
Praying for god to help them in the war.
00:03:10.135 --> 00:03:12.904
And, i think, that that role that david avery played, i mean
00:03:12.904 --> 00:03:16.508
He's standing on a hill overlooking the battle of bunker
00:03:16.508 --> 00:03:19.011
Hill and praying over the troops that that's a much more typical
00:03:19.011 --> 00:03:24.082
Kind of role in the patriot army and the the patriot movement
00:03:24.082 --> 00:03:27.719
Than, you know, somebody reading john locke and coming to
00:03:27.719 --> 00:03:31.223
Political conclusions about it.
00:03:31.223 --> 00:03:32.591
Kirk: yeah, yeah, and so it wasn't just george washington or
00:03:32.591 --> 00:03:38.263
Adams, it wasn't just jefferson or benjamin franklin who had
00:03:38.263 --> 00:03:44.036
These ideas.
00:03:44.036 --> 00:03:45.404
And we'll get into franklin because he was not the kind of
00:03:45.404 --> 00:03:47.039
Christian perhaps that george washington was or some of the
00:03:47.039 --> 00:03:49.641
Other ministers who were involved at the founding.
00:03:49.641 --> 00:03:53.645
But you're saying it's the everyday people.
00:03:53.645 --> 00:03:55.147
It was the chaplains, it was the soldiers, it was the people who
00:03:55.147 --> 00:03:58.383
Really understood these principles and were fighting
00:03:58.383 --> 00:04:02.220
For them.
00:04:02.220 --> 00:04:03.588
Thomas: right, and many of the people in the patriot movement
00:04:03.588 --> 00:04:06.558
Had been influenced by the great awakening of the 1740s.
00:04:06.558 --> 00:04:10.195
Many had come to faith in christ during those decades.
00:04:10.195 --> 00:04:14.032
And so, there are a lot of the rank and file people in the
00:04:14.032 --> 00:04:17.803
Patriot movement who are just everyday christians who think
00:04:17.803 --> 00:04:21.373
About what's happening between britain and america in christian
00:04:21.373 --> 00:04:25.143
And biblical terms.
00:04:25.143 --> 00:04:26.578
They're praying for, you know, god's favor in the war and
00:04:26.578 --> 00:04:31.083
They're building america and american principles on biblical
00:04:31.083 --> 00:04:34.753
And christian values.
00:04:34.753 --> 00:04:36.121
And i think sometimes we get so wound up about, oh.
00:04:36.121 --> 00:04:39.558
The enlightenment and, you know, the secular principles, and very
00:04:39.558 --> 00:04:43.595
Learned people, and everything.
00:04:43.595 --> 00:04:45.097
But we have to realize that the revolution really depended on
00:04:45.097 --> 00:04:48.633
Everyday americans to work and, obviously, to be fought and won.
00:04:48.633 --> 00:04:53.305
Kirk: yeah, i think that's exactly right.
00:04:53.305 --> 00:04:56.308
I remember taking trips to boston.
00:04:56.308 --> 00:04:57.909
I remember taking trips to the east coast and hearing and
00:04:57.909 --> 00:05:00.846
Learning about all these wars and visiting those graveyards,
00:05:00.846 --> 00:05:03.048
And they were everyday people.
00:05:03.048 --> 00:05:04.783
The battle of lexington and concord, and these were like
00:05:04.783 --> 00:05:08.553
Farmers, these were the everyday people.
00:05:08.553 --> 00:05:10.822
And it's fascinating to me that none of this would have happened
00:05:10.822 --> 00:05:14.626
Had it not been for the bible.
00:05:14.626 --> 00:05:16.595
Because you said these were people fighting for
00:05:16.595 --> 00:05:18.163
Biblical principles.
00:05:18.163 --> 00:05:19.531
These were ideas that they had because their pastors were
00:05:19.531 --> 00:05:22.033
Teaching it to them on sunday mornings.
00:05:22.033 --> 00:05:23.902
Well, prior to the printing press and the reformation, who
00:05:23.902 --> 00:05:28.340
Would have had any of these kinds of ideas?
00:05:28.340 --> 00:05:29.808
You just went along with the religious leader and the king.
00:05:29.808 --> 00:05:33.145
But we had this bible.
00:05:33.145 --> 00:05:35.013
And so, they understood these things.
00:05:35.013 --> 00:05:37.449
And that's why we've got to get back to the bible today, and
00:05:37.449 --> 00:05:41.453
We've got to get our preachers back to the bible, and our civil
00:05:41.453 --> 00:05:44.523
Leaders to be informed and inspired by the bible.
00:05:44.523 --> 00:05:47.859
Thomas: yeah, your average american in 1776 had a very high
00:05:47.859 --> 00:05:52.531
Knowledge of the bible.
00:05:52.531 --> 00:05:54.099
Biblical literacy was sky high at that time.
00:05:54.099 --> 00:05:57.269
And so, if you're gonna understand what's happening in a
00:05:57.269 --> 00:06:00.071
War like the revolutionary war, it's gonna be framed in
00:06:00.071 --> 00:06:03.275
Biblical categories.
00:06:03.275 --> 00:06:04.609
I mean, one example i always give is that the pamphlet
00:06:04.609 --> 00:06:07.846
"common sense" by thomas paine, even though paine is kind of
00:06:07.846 --> 00:06:11.650
Skeptical about christianity, really the most pivotal section
00:06:11.650 --> 00:06:16.021
Of common sense, which is not a very long pamphlet, is a
00:06:16.021 --> 00:06:19.458
Treatise on 1 samuel 8, where god said to israel, "you don't
00:06:19.458 --> 00:06:23.929
Want a king.
00:06:23.929 --> 00:06:25.297
A king's gonna oppress you and abuse you.
00:06:25.297 --> 00:06:27.699
So you don't want a king."
00:06:27.699 --> 00:06:29.034
And so, paine says, "look, americans, this is where god has
00:06:29.034 --> 00:06:33.338
Weighed in against monarchy."
00:06:33.338 --> 00:06:35.674
And so, when you're rejecting the british monarch, you're
00:06:35.674 --> 00:06:39.377
Doing what was on god's mind and heart even back in the
00:06:39.377 --> 00:06:42.647
Old testament.
00:06:42.647 --> 00:06:44.015
And that's just one example of the ways that the patriot
00:06:44.015 --> 00:06:46.885
Leaders would make the case for the revolution through the lens
00:06:46.885 --> 00:06:50.655
Of the bible.
00:06:50.655 --> 00:06:52.157
Kirk: one of the interesting characters of our founder, we
00:06:52.157 --> 00:06:54.259
Talk about him all the time, is benjamin franklin.
00:06:54.259 --> 00:06:57.229
And then there were other guys who were deeply religious.
00:06:57.229 --> 00:07:00.632
And you talk in the book about this unlikely alliance between
00:07:00.632 --> 00:07:05.604
Evangelical biblical christians and others who were not so much,
00:07:05.604 --> 00:07:10.041
However, they found this common ground.
00:07:10.041 --> 00:07:12.043
What was it that pulled guys like benjamin franklin and
00:07:12.043 --> 00:07:15.914
Others who weren't so religious in with the deeply religious?
00:07:15.914 --> 00:07:20.418
Thomas: yeah, i think franklin is a fascinating case because he
00:07:20.418 --> 00:07:23.555
Grows up in a puritan family in boston.
00:07:23.555 --> 00:07:26.224
But then it's a familiar story.
00:07:26.224 --> 00:07:27.826
As a teenager, he starts to get into some sort of skeptical
00:07:27.826 --> 00:07:31.162
Ideas and he comes to call himself a deist in
00:07:31.162 --> 00:07:34.199
His autobiography.
00:07:34.199 --> 00:07:35.634
So, you know, we can take him at his word that he was a deist,
00:07:35.634 --> 00:07:39.137
But he was also a deist who knew the text of the bible, i think,
00:07:39.137 --> 00:07:43.575
Better than any of the other major founders.
00:07:43.575 --> 00:07:46.611
And so, when you look at franklin's speeches, even
00:07:46.611 --> 00:07:49.948
Franklin calling for the constitutional convention to
00:07:49.948 --> 00:07:52.484
Open in prayer, i mean, he's confusing because he says he's a
00:07:52.484 --> 00:07:57.522
Deist, he says he doesn't believe in the divinity of
00:07:57.522 --> 00:07:59.558
Christ, but he's so comfortable with and thinks it's essential,
00:07:59.558 --> 00:08:03.762
Especially by the time of the constitutional convention, for
00:08:03.762 --> 00:08:06.831
Americans to call on god to guide their proceedings in
00:08:06.831 --> 00:08:11.202
Framing the constitution.
00:08:11.202 --> 00:08:12.537
And so, traditional christians totally agree with him on that
00:08:12.537 --> 00:08:17.008
Point even though franklin himself is kind of skeptical
00:08:17.008 --> 00:08:20.779
About christian doctrine.
00:08:20.779 --> 00:08:22.213
Kirk: yeah, and the things that we are proposing today and
00:08:22.213 --> 00:08:26.818
Calling them progressive, i can't help but think, 'no, these
00:08:26.818 --> 00:08:30.021
Are regressive."
00:08:30.021 --> 00:08:31.356
These are regressive ideas going back to paganism, going back to
00:08:31.356 --> 00:08:34.593
Before the bible informed people's ideas about how
00:08:34.593 --> 00:08:38.296
Government ought to run, and how we can honor god, and produce
00:08:38.296 --> 00:08:42.167
Individual liberty, and representative government, and
00:08:42.167 --> 00:08:44.336
Keep a check on evil, and all of these things.
00:08:44.336 --> 00:08:48.173
But we're not being taught that in our pulpits like we were
00:08:48.173 --> 00:08:51.242
Early in america, which is why it's so important that you've
00:08:51.242 --> 00:08:53.645
Written this book.
00:08:53.645 --> 00:08:55.013
So, thank you for that.
00:08:55.013 --> 00:08:56.348
Thomas: you're welcome.
00:08:56.348 --> 00:08:57.682
Yeah, i think especially the idea that we're all created
00:08:57.682 --> 00:09:00.485
Equal is deeply theological, but it's also an idea that's shared
00:09:00.485 --> 00:09:06.458
By the whole range of people involved in the patriot
00:09:06.458 --> 00:09:09.694
Movement, whether they're evangelicals, or kind of
00:09:09.694 --> 00:09:11.730
Rationalist christians, or deists, they all believe that we
00:09:11.730 --> 00:09:15.400
Live in a world that's created by god.
00:09:15.400 --> 00:09:18.169
And so, you know, if we lose that in america, i mean, i think
00:09:18.169 --> 00:09:22.474
That's devastating to what has unified us in the past around
00:09:22.474 --> 00:09:26.978
This common idea that all men are created equal.
00:09:26.978 --> 00:09:29.848
Kirk: i want to get back to things that you've said in
00:09:29.848 --> 00:09:31.449
The book.
00:09:31.449 --> 00:09:32.884
You assert that there are five distinct areas that symbolize
00:09:32.884 --> 00:09:36.821
Shared public religious beliefs during that founding era.
00:09:36.821 --> 00:09:40.992
And one of them is an emphasis on republican virtue.
00:09:40.992 --> 00:09:45.964
"ever mindful of the public good was the ideal that would sustain
00:09:45.964 --> 00:09:50.035
The new republic and its leaders, who must be willing to
00:09:50.035 --> 00:09:52.904
Act benevolently, even selflessly."
00:09:52.904 --> 00:09:57.108
I take that to mean that the leaders of the country and the
00:09:57.108 --> 00:10:02.113
People of the country have got to be good.
00:10:02.113 --> 00:10:04.482
They've got to do the right thing before god and even lay
00:10:04.482 --> 00:10:08.019
Down their life for one another, or the whole thing is going to
00:10:08.019 --> 00:10:10.755
Go up in smoke.
00:10:10.755 --> 00:10:12.190
Thomas: yeah, yeah, i mean one of the things we forget about
00:10:12.190 --> 00:10:15.293
The american founding is it's a great new experiment in having a
00:10:15.293 --> 00:10:18.630
Republic, not a monarchy anymore--
00:10:18.630 --> 00:10:20.865
Kirk: explain to people the difference.
00:10:20.865 --> 00:10:22.434
Thomas: so, we don't have a king, the people govern
00:10:22.434 --> 00:10:25.570
Themselves, but they insist that if the people are not virtuous
00:10:25.570 --> 00:10:29.674
And moral, that the republic will fall apart and sow chaos
00:10:29.674 --> 00:10:33.344
And anarchy, and people will start hankering for a
00:10:33.344 --> 00:10:35.814
King again.
00:10:35.814 --> 00:10:37.649
So, i think about when franklin, when he came out of the
00:10:37.649 --> 00:10:40.552
Constitutional convention, they said, "have you created a
00:10:40.552 --> 00:10:43.421
Monarchy or a republic?"
00:10:43.421 --> 00:10:44.923
And he says, "a republic, if you can keep it."
00:10:44.923 --> 00:10:48.326
And i think what that means is it depends on the people's moral
00:10:48.326 --> 00:10:52.230
Character, and the leaders's moral character, in order to
00:10:52.230 --> 00:10:55.133
Sustain a republic.
00:10:55.133 --> 00:10:56.534
Kirk: well, essentially, that's what the republic is saying is
00:10:56.534 --> 00:10:58.503
That if we can govern ourselves under god, we don't need a king.
00:10:58.503 --> 00:11:01.372
We don't need a king charles, or a king james, or a
00:11:01.372 --> 00:11:03.675
King somebody.
00:11:03.675 --> 00:11:05.577
God can be our king, and then we'll have representative
00:11:05.577 --> 00:11:07.979
Government to take care of the few bad guys that are lurking in
00:11:07.979 --> 00:11:10.749
The darkness.
00:11:10.749 --> 00:11:12.083
And i just think what a wonderful thing.
00:11:12.083 --> 00:11:16.121
I think it was de tocqueville who was credited as saying that,
00:11:16.121 --> 00:11:19.457
"america is great because she's good.
00:11:19.457 --> 00:11:21.693
And if she ever ceases to be good, she will cease to
00:11:21.693 --> 00:11:23.995
Be great."
00:11:23.995 --> 00:11:25.330
Thomas: yeah, i mean, i think that all the founders, again,
00:11:25.330 --> 00:11:28.733
Across the religious spectrum believed that a republic could
00:11:28.733 --> 00:11:32.504
Not survive if you didn't have virtuous people and
00:11:32.504 --> 00:11:35.440
Virtuous leaders.
00:11:35.440 --> 00:11:36.841
But happily, we were given washington as the first example
00:11:36.841 --> 00:11:41.379
Of a president who in two notable instances stepped away
00:11:41.379 --> 00:11:45.984
From power, voluntarily gave up power for the good of the
00:11:45.984 --> 00:11:49.988
Republic when he stepped down as the general over the
00:11:49.988 --> 00:11:52.423
Continental army.
00:11:52.423 --> 00:11:53.792
And after his second term as president, he didn't have to
00:11:53.792 --> 00:11:56.094
Do that.
00:11:56.094 --> 00:11:57.428
Kirk: didn't they want to make him king?
00:11:57.428 --> 00:11:58.763
Thomas: well, they wanted to call him "your highness" and
00:11:58.763 --> 00:12:01.132
Things like this, they said, no, no--
00:12:01.132 --> 00:12:02.500
Kirk: he was like, "guys, this is what we're trying to get
00:12:02.500 --> 00:12:04.102
Away from."
00:12:04.102 --> 00:12:05.503
Thomas: that's right.
00:12:05.503 --> 00:12:06.871
And so, i think washington--i think washington is our
00:12:06.871 --> 00:12:09.207
Greatest president.
00:12:09.207 --> 00:12:10.575
And part of the reason why is because he set the example of
00:12:10.575 --> 00:12:13.645
Republican virtue for the rest of our country's history.
00:12:13.645 --> 00:12:16.915
Kirk: yeah, oh, this is so great.
00:12:16.915 --> 00:12:18.283
I want to get into more right after the break.
00:12:18.283 --> 00:12:20.485
When we come back, we'll talk more with thomas about the push
00:12:20.485 --> 00:12:23.755
Of religious liberties that shaped our country.
00:12:23.755 --> 00:12:26.424
And then later in the program, cynthia scott will join us and
00:12:26.424 --> 00:12:29.360
Share about how prayer played an important part in our
00:12:29.360 --> 00:12:32.597
Nation's founding.
00:12:32.597 --> 00:12:33.965
So, don't go away.
00:12:33.965 --> 00:12:35.300
Cynthia: our founders were born and raised out of the first
00:12:35.300 --> 00:12:38.770
Great awakening.
00:12:38.770 --> 00:12:40.138
They lived in the midst not just of a basic biblical worldview,
00:12:40.138 --> 00:12:43.441
But in a time of excitement about god, a god consciousness.
00:12:43.441 --> 00:12:47.712
And we need that again.
00:12:47.712 --> 00:12:54.991
And we need that again.
00:12:54.991 --> 00:12:57.956
Kirk: we're back with professor and author thomas s. kidd
00:13:02.093 --> 00:13:05.463
Discussing the history of our country and the religious and
00:13:05.463 --> 00:13:08.433
Political freedoms that we enjoy today.
00:13:08.433 --> 00:13:12.136
Thomas, you've written so much about the history of religion
00:13:12.136 --> 00:13:17.442
In america.
00:13:17.442 --> 00:13:18.810
And you've said that it's not just the elites who were
00:13:18.810 --> 00:13:20.411
Religious, but it was the everyday people who had a deep,
00:13:20.411 --> 00:13:23.615
Profound biblical faith.
00:13:23.615 --> 00:13:27.385
When i look around america today, there's many people who
00:13:27.385 --> 00:13:31.155
Seem to have no faith at all, or just sort of this nominal paper
00:13:31.155 --> 00:13:34.592
Thin faith.
00:13:34.592 --> 00:13:35.960
What was different back then?
00:13:35.960 --> 00:13:37.295
Why were they so deeply religious, the everyday people?
00:13:37.295 --> 00:13:41.065
Thomas: yeah, i think it's partly because the bible was
00:13:41.065 --> 00:13:43.568
Just culturally the coin of the realm.
00:13:43.568 --> 00:13:45.370
I mean it's the book that kind of knit together
00:13:45.370 --> 00:13:49.207
American culture.
00:13:49.207 --> 00:13:50.909
And it's also because of the great awakening of the 1740s
00:13:50.909 --> 00:13:54.746
That there was a kind of, re-energizing of faith 30 years
00:13:54.746 --> 00:13:59.851
Before the american revolution.
00:13:59.851 --> 00:14:01.185
Now, you know, not everybody were evangelical christians in
00:14:01.185 --> 00:14:04.255
The rank and file, but a whole lot of them were.
00:14:04.255 --> 00:14:07.292
And even non-christians, you know, even people who really
00:14:07.292 --> 00:14:12.664
Weren't that interested, they tended to know a lot more about
00:14:12.664 --> 00:14:15.366
The bible than people do today.
00:14:15.366 --> 00:14:17.969
I mean, i'm afraid that even some regular churchgoers today
00:14:17.969 --> 00:14:22.273
Sometimes don't seem to know very much about the text of the
00:14:22.273 --> 00:14:24.742
Bible and then you compare him to somebody like benjamin
00:14:24.742 --> 00:14:27.645
Franklin who called himself a deist, but he had a lot of the
00:14:27.645 --> 00:14:32.016
King james bible just memorized.
00:14:32.016 --> 00:14:34.552
And so, it's just a different cultural world that they live in
00:14:34.552 --> 00:14:38.823
That if you're gonna explain anything like the american
00:14:38.823 --> 00:14:41.192
Founding the revolutionary war, you have to use the bible to
00:14:41.192 --> 00:14:46.097
Explain what we as americans were doing.
00:14:46.097 --> 00:14:49.434
Kirk: that's really interesting because there are those who want
00:14:49.434 --> 00:14:52.470
To say that we were founded by atheists, agnostics, and deists,
00:14:52.470 --> 00:14:56.207
A product of the really smart people who came out of
00:14:56.207 --> 00:14:59.243
The enlightenment.
00:14:59.243 --> 00:15:00.578
But if you were to go back and talk to our founders, they would
00:15:00.578 --> 00:15:03.648
Say, well, the enlightenment has its influences, but ultimately,
00:15:03.648 --> 00:15:08.119
These ideas are rooted way back into ancient, ancient history in
00:15:08.119 --> 00:15:12.490
Israel and the bible.
00:15:12.490 --> 00:15:14.459
These concepts of limited government and the three
00:15:14.459 --> 00:15:17.762
Different branches of government, all of that
00:15:17.762 --> 00:15:19.998
Stuff, right?
00:15:19.998 --> 00:15:21.366
Thomas: yeah, i mean, what the founders are doing makes no
00:15:21.366 --> 00:15:24.802
Sense without a created order.
00:15:24.802 --> 00:15:27.572
I mean, and so you do have, you know, you have evangelicals and
00:15:27.572 --> 00:15:30.608
Then you have people like franklin who said he was
00:15:30.608 --> 00:15:32.343
A deist.
00:15:32.343 --> 00:15:34.679
But they all believe that there is a created order, that there's
00:15:34.679 --> 00:15:39.417
Virtue and vice and god determines what's moral and
00:15:39.417 --> 00:15:42.754
Immoral, that there's a moral order that reflects
00:15:42.754 --> 00:15:45.490
The creation.
00:15:45.490 --> 00:15:46.858
And so, somebody like jefferson, you know, who is also skeptical
00:15:46.858 --> 00:15:50.528
About christian doctrine, but when he says, "all men are
00:15:50.528 --> 00:15:53.698
Created equal and they're endowed by their creator with
00:15:53.698 --> 00:15:56.634
Certain unalienable rights," he totally means that, he's a
00:15:56.634 --> 00:16:02.006
Pre-darwinian thinker.
00:16:02.006 --> 00:16:04.275
There is nothing, no other option than for us to live in a
00:16:04.275 --> 00:16:08.246
Universe that was created by god.
00:16:08.246 --> 00:16:10.615
That there's--so when people say atheists, there's basically
00:16:10.615 --> 00:16:15.219
No atheists in america in 1776 because they believe that they
00:16:15.219 --> 00:16:20.591
Live in a world that reflects a creator.
00:16:20.591 --> 00:16:23.461
Kirk: that's right.
00:16:23.461 --> 00:16:24.829
I wonder what you think might surprise people about the
00:16:24.829 --> 00:16:28.332
Founding of our nation that you detail in the book, about god's
00:16:28.332 --> 00:16:32.470
Involvement in the birth of our country.
00:16:32.470 --> 00:16:36.707
Thomas: well, i think one thing that might surprise people is
00:16:36.707 --> 00:16:40.311
Just how contested religious liberty was at the time of
00:16:40.311 --> 00:16:43.614
The founding.
00:16:43.614 --> 00:16:45.683
We think of, you know, religious liberty at risk today, and
00:16:45.683 --> 00:16:48.786
It is.
00:16:48.786 --> 00:16:50.154
But i mean there were evangelical pastors who were
00:16:50.154 --> 00:16:53.124
Being thrown in jail for illegal preaching on the eve of the
00:16:53.124 --> 00:16:57.161
Revolution for, you know, baptists, and, you know, quakers
00:16:57.161 --> 00:17:01.999
And so forth, the dissenting groups.
00:17:01.999 --> 00:17:04.168
And religion was very state-regulated at that time.
00:17:04.168 --> 00:17:08.005
You had official state churches and they'd say, "here's where
00:17:08.005 --> 00:17:11.309
You can preach, here's where you can't," and they set the rules
00:17:11.309 --> 00:17:15.113
For all the denominations.
00:17:15.113 --> 00:17:16.914
And so, when you think about how urgent the call was for
00:17:16.914 --> 00:17:20.751
Religious liberty at the time of the founding, it was being made
00:17:20.751 --> 00:17:24.088
By, again, rank and file christians, some of whom their
00:17:24.088 --> 00:17:27.792
Pastor had been horsewhipped, their pastor had been put in
00:17:27.792 --> 00:17:31.295
Jail for illegal preaching.
00:17:31.295 --> 00:17:33.531
And so, when people like jefferson and madison are
00:17:33.531 --> 00:17:36.334
Calling for religious liberty, it's partly because they're
00:17:36.334 --> 00:17:39.237
Sitting on the sidelines and watching these evangelical
00:17:39.237 --> 00:17:42.106
Pastors get beat up and put in jail and they say, "we've gotta
00:17:42.106 --> 00:17:46.944
Have religious liberty.
00:17:46.944 --> 00:17:48.412
This is the most important liberty and we're denying it to,
00:17:48.412 --> 00:17:52.483
You know, these religious dissenters."
00:17:52.483 --> 00:17:54.385
So, i think, that accounts for the urgency of the call for
00:17:54.385 --> 00:17:58.422
Religious liberty at the time of the founding.
00:17:58.422 --> 00:18:01.058
Kirk: is there a way to have full religious liberty in
00:18:01.058 --> 00:18:06.264
America and still protect against heresy?
00:18:06.264 --> 00:18:10.801
Thomas: well, i think it's the church's primary responsibility
00:18:10.801 --> 00:18:13.471
To protect against heresy.
00:18:13.471 --> 00:18:14.939
The problem, i think from the founders's point of view, you
00:18:14.939 --> 00:18:18.109
Want to protect the churches from the state because the state
00:18:18.109 --> 00:18:21.946
Tends to corrupt religion.
00:18:21.946 --> 00:18:24.582
And so, you know, religious liberty was never about, well
00:18:24.582 --> 00:18:27.351
You've got to restrict the expression of the churches and
00:18:27.351 --> 00:18:31.155
So forth.
00:18:31.155 --> 00:18:32.490
I mean that's why they guaranteed free exercise of
00:18:32.490 --> 00:18:33.958
Religion in the constitution.
00:18:33.958 --> 00:18:35.927
The focus is really on the corrupting effect of the
00:18:35.927 --> 00:18:38.896
Government on the churches, and that we don't want, you know,
00:18:38.896 --> 00:18:43.134
Especially groups like the baptists who had been, you know,
00:18:43.134 --> 00:18:46.103
Pastors have been put in jail by the state governments for not
00:18:46.103 --> 00:18:50.141
Preaching what they, the government, considered to be the
00:18:50.141 --> 00:18:53.344
Right doctrine.
00:18:53.344 --> 00:18:54.712
And they said, "oh, let's get the government out of calling
00:18:54.712 --> 00:18:58.082
Balls and strikes on those kinds of issues."
00:18:58.082 --> 00:19:00.718
So, i think that the job of the churches is to know the
00:19:00.718 --> 00:19:04.789
Scripture, to proclaim it boldly, and to try to keep the
00:19:04.789 --> 00:19:09.227
Government out of the business of the churches so that the
00:19:09.227 --> 00:19:13.064
Churches can do what god has called them to do.
00:19:13.064 --> 00:19:15.933
Kirk: that is such an important distinction because so many of
00:19:15.933 --> 00:19:18.836
Us have been taught that you should just get god out of
00:19:18.836 --> 00:19:20.905
Government altogether.
00:19:20.905 --> 00:19:22.240
No prayer, no ten commandments, none of that stuff can be in
00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:24.775
Schools or in government.
00:19:24.775 --> 00:19:26.110
Yet, all of our founders, and you can read it right here in
00:19:26.110 --> 00:19:29.647
Your book, they called for prayer, for days of fasting, and
00:19:29.647 --> 00:19:34.051
Thanksgiving, started out government meetings with prayer
00:19:34.051 --> 00:19:39.557
Services, and oh my goodness, they felt that they couldn't
00:19:39.557 --> 00:19:43.127
Possibly make this work without god's help, isn't that right?
00:19:43.127 --> 00:19:46.664
Thomas: that's right.
00:19:46.664 --> 00:19:47.999
I mean, and so it really is shocking when you see the
00:19:47.999 --> 00:19:49.967
Continental congress, the specifically christian prayers
00:19:49.967 --> 00:19:53.938
They would have during the revolution.
00:19:53.938 --> 00:19:55.840
I mean, it's so they weren't always, you know, the
00:19:55.840 --> 00:19:58.075
Declaration doesn't say anything about jesus, but it's
00:19:58.075 --> 00:20:00.711
Powerfully theological.
00:20:00.711 --> 00:20:02.079
But when you get into the prayers of the continental
00:20:02.079 --> 00:20:04.982
Congress in the 1770s and '80s, they're appealing to the merits
00:20:04.982 --> 00:20:08.619
Of jesus christ.
00:20:08.619 --> 00:20:09.954
I mean, it's just, it's shocking.
00:20:09.954 --> 00:20:12.323
And so, even somebody like jefferson, who's the one who
00:20:12.323 --> 00:20:14.859
Talked about the wall of separation between church and
00:20:14.859 --> 00:20:17.395
State, he just took it as a given that you would have church
00:20:17.395 --> 00:20:20.931
Services in government buildings, whether it's in
00:20:20.931 --> 00:20:23.934
Washington dc or in virginia.
00:20:23.934 --> 00:20:27.605
That's just part of the warp and woof of, you know, what
00:20:27.605 --> 00:20:30.675
Government does, is it, you know, calls on god for his aid
00:20:30.675 --> 00:20:34.145
And guidance and those sorts of things.
00:20:34.145 --> 00:20:36.047
And so, you can see that it's just common sense to them, for
00:20:36.047 --> 00:20:39.450
Instance, you start having the continental congress meeting,
00:20:39.450 --> 00:20:42.086
You have chaplains in the congress.
00:20:42.086 --> 00:20:44.255
Start out in the revolutionary war, you have chaplains in the
00:20:44.255 --> 00:20:47.091
Continental army.
00:20:47.091 --> 00:20:48.426
I mean, it's not even debated that it's just what you
00:20:48.426 --> 00:20:50.428
Obviously do.
00:20:50.428 --> 00:20:51.929
Kirk: yeah, yeah, it makes perfect sense.
00:20:51.929 --> 00:20:55.199
But common sense is not so common anymore.
00:20:55.199 --> 00:20:57.635
And that's why we need to get back to it.
00:20:57.635 --> 00:21:00.604
What do you hope that people this year, america's 250th
00:21:00.604 --> 00:21:04.241
Birthday, will remember on memorial day and veterans day,
00:21:04.241 --> 00:21:08.212
And independence day about our country's founders and its
00:21:08.212 --> 00:21:12.683
Religious history?
00:21:12.683 --> 00:21:14.919
Thomas: i think that the founders have a wonderful
00:21:14.919 --> 00:21:17.421
Combination of an understanding that you have to have a moral
00:21:17.421 --> 00:21:22.193
People for the republic to survive.
00:21:22.193 --> 00:21:25.863
And so that when christians are calling for, you know, morality
00:21:25.863 --> 00:21:30.234
In law, morality in, you know, officeholders, and so forth,
00:21:30.234 --> 00:21:34.405
That all we're doing is asking for what the founders believed
00:21:34.405 --> 00:21:38.242
Would sustain the life of the republic.
00:21:38.242 --> 00:21:41.011
And yet, they also believe so strongly in religious liberty
00:21:41.011 --> 00:21:45.783
That ultimately we don't want a government-run church.
00:21:45.783 --> 00:21:49.387
That ultimately, the church needs to be the church.
00:21:49.387 --> 00:21:52.690
And the best situation for the church is for the government
00:21:52.690 --> 00:21:56.627
Just to leave us alone to preach the gospel and freedom.
00:21:56.627 --> 00:22:00.097
And that that's what the founding fathers instituted and
00:22:00.097 --> 00:22:03.334
That's what we got with the first amendment.
00:22:03.334 --> 00:22:05.703
But there's not gonna be any established national
00:22:05.703 --> 00:22:07.972
Denomination and most importantly we will have free
00:22:07.972 --> 00:22:11.642
Exercise of religion.
00:22:11.642 --> 00:22:13.210
I just think it's such a brilliant solution on issues of
00:22:13.210 --> 00:22:17.348
Religion that the founders instituted.
00:22:17.348 --> 00:22:19.650
I just hope we'll remember that this anniversary year.
00:22:19.650 --> 00:22:23.354
Kirk: i do too.
00:22:23.354 --> 00:22:24.688
And i'm so thankful that you came on to "takeaway."
00:22:24.688 --> 00:22:26.023
So thankful that you wrote this book.
00:22:26.023 --> 00:22:27.591
Get it for your pastor, give it for your local and
00:22:27.591 --> 00:22:31.228
State representatives.
00:22:31.228 --> 00:22:32.563
They need to read this.
00:22:32.563 --> 00:22:33.931
Thanks so much, thomas.
00:22:33.931 --> 00:22:35.266
Thomas: thanks for having me.
00:22:35.266 --> 00:22:36.634
Kirk: after the break, cynthia scott will join us to share
00:22:36.634 --> 00:22:39.069
Several historical events in our nation's history that were
00:22:39.069 --> 00:22:42.072
Powered by prayer.
00:22:42.072 --> 00:22:44.041
Despite the problems that we have in our country, there is
00:22:44.041 --> 00:22:47.044
Still so much to be thankful for.
00:22:47.044 --> 00:22:49.079
One of the things that i appreciate is the faith-filled
00:22:49.079 --> 00:22:53.684
Freedom fighters, the people who just didn't quit because they
00:22:53.684 --> 00:22:57.655
Knew that god was at work and on the move.
00:22:57.655 --> 00:23:00.791
There's a few other comments that i wanted to share with you
00:23:00.791 --> 00:23:03.060
From people who have been on "takeaways" who are also
00:23:03.060 --> 00:23:05.763
Grateful for our country.
00:23:05.763 --> 00:23:07.465
Kirk: tim, what's something that you personally appreciate about
00:23:07.465 --> 00:23:11.135
The united states of america?
00:23:11.135 --> 00:23:12.470
Tim barton: yeah, i love the fact that america historically
00:23:12.470 --> 00:23:15.206
Has been the greatest force for good.
00:23:15.206 --> 00:23:16.574
Over the last 250 years we've had more freedom,
00:23:16.574 --> 00:23:18.676
Stability, prosperity.
00:23:18.676 --> 00:23:20.044
We've had more benevolence in this nation than anywhere else
00:23:20.044 --> 00:23:22.580
In the world in the last 250 years, and all of it is built on
00:23:22.580 --> 00:23:25.850
The biblical foundation.
00:23:25.850 --> 00:23:27.651
Hosanna wong: i really appreciate the diversity, people
00:23:27.651 --> 00:23:31.055
From all different backgrounds and cultures.
00:23:31.055 --> 00:23:34.758
So many of my friends, like our grandparents are from
00:23:34.758 --> 00:23:38.262
Different countries.
00:23:38.262 --> 00:23:39.630
So, i appreciate the diversity of people, of cultures, and of
00:23:39.630 --> 00:23:44.068
Food, good food.
00:23:44.068 --> 00:23:45.803
Kirk: what's something that you appreciate about our country?
00:23:45.803 --> 00:23:48.939
Jennie allen: well, a little context.
00:23:48.939 --> 00:23:50.307
I've been on the road preaching the gospel to the next
00:23:50.307 --> 00:23:54.178
Generation, and we are watching thousands and thousands respond
00:23:54.178 --> 00:23:57.882
To the gospel.
00:23:57.882 --> 00:23:59.283
And i just don't take for granted that we can go and share
00:23:59.283 --> 00:24:02.353
Our faith, and not worry that our lives are on the line
00:24:02.353 --> 00:24:07.258
For that.
00:24:07.258 --> 00:24:08.626
David pollack: man, how do you not love the freedoms that we
00:24:08.626 --> 00:24:10.528
Have that is very unique and very different for everyone.
00:24:10.528 --> 00:24:13.430
Everyone has the right to speak, everyone has the right to
00:24:13.430 --> 00:24:17.067
Opinion, everyone has the right to kind of feel the way that
00:24:17.067 --> 00:24:19.603
They wanna feel, not that that's always the best thing in the
00:24:19.603 --> 00:24:22.306
World, but that's a great country to live in, to have
00:24:22.306 --> 00:24:25.142
Everybody to have that access and that ability.
00:24:25.142 --> 00:24:27.678
Because that is not the case everywhere across the world.
00:24:27.678 --> 00:24:30.681
Lysa terkeurst: the word freedom comes to mind.
00:24:30.681 --> 00:24:32.449
And, you know, we have had so many people make so many
00:24:32.449 --> 00:24:36.186
Sacrifices for the sake of freedom.
00:24:36.186 --> 00:24:40.057
But i think sometimes we lose the perspective that we serve a
00:24:40.057 --> 00:24:44.528
God of freedom.
00:24:44.528 --> 00:24:45.996
Freedom costs a lot of people a lot, and we should be very,
00:24:45.996 --> 00:24:50.134
Very grateful.
00:24:50.134 --> 00:24:51.502
I'm very grateful to live in a country that's free.
00:24:51.502 --> 00:24:58.991
I'm very grateful to live in a country that's free.
00:24:58.991 --> 00:25:02.079
Kirk: my next guest, cynthia scott, is a member of america's
00:25:06.250 --> 00:25:09.286
National prayer committee.
00:25:09.286 --> 00:25:10.654
And she's led prayer initiatives in citywide gatherings and
00:25:10.654 --> 00:25:14.358
National events.
00:25:14.358 --> 00:25:15.693
She's written numerous prayer guides, and now she has a new
00:25:15.693 --> 00:25:18.095
Book called "celebrating god our founder at america's
00:25:18.095 --> 00:25:22.800
250th birthday."
00:25:22.800 --> 00:25:24.368
Cynthia, thanks so much for coming on "takeaways."
00:25:24.368 --> 00:25:26.203
Cynthia: thank you so much for having me and sharing
00:25:26.203 --> 00:25:27.972
This message.
00:25:27.972 --> 00:25:29.340
Kirk: well, i've been singing this song for a long time since
00:25:29.340 --> 00:25:34.545
I came to discover that god really is our founder
00:25:34.545 --> 00:25:38.816
In america.
00:25:38.816 --> 00:25:40.217
Not in ways of other religious leaders have been founders of
00:25:40.217 --> 00:25:44.054
Other religious systems, but god, through his son jesus
00:25:44.054 --> 00:25:49.460
Christ and through his word, the bible, really is the founder,
00:25:49.460 --> 00:25:53.397
And that is the instruction manual for how to run your
00:25:53.397 --> 00:25:57.534
Government, how to run your family, how to run your church,
00:25:57.534 --> 00:25:59.903
And that is what makes america so unique.
00:25:59.903 --> 00:26:01.805
But most people don't really believe it because they were
00:26:01.805 --> 00:26:04.341
Never taught that in school.
00:26:04.341 --> 00:26:06.076
So, let me ask you, why do you think so and make the
00:26:06.076 --> 00:26:10.881
Intellectual historical case for that.
00:26:10.881 --> 00:26:14.051
Cynthia: well, i can tell you that the book started
00:26:14.051 --> 00:26:16.487
As prayers.
00:26:16.487 --> 00:26:17.821
I wrote the prayers first for congregational prayer meetings
00:26:17.821 --> 00:26:20.257
At our church.
00:26:20.257 --> 00:26:21.592
The lord spoke to my heart back in 2020 and said, "pray for the
00:26:21.592 --> 00:26:25.262
Nation out of the history of the nation."
00:26:25.262 --> 00:26:27.698
So, i started to do my research.
00:26:27.698 --> 00:26:29.767
And pilgrims, puritans, education, declaration of--
00:26:29.767 --> 00:26:33.137
First great awakening, declaration of independence.
00:26:33.137 --> 00:26:35.572
And as i went through the history, it became clearer and
00:26:35.572 --> 00:26:38.442
Clearer to me that god didn't just help a few smart men to
00:26:38.442 --> 00:26:43.013
Create our nation, but he was really the impetus
00:26:43.013 --> 00:26:46.150
Behind everything.
00:26:46.150 --> 00:26:47.718
Going back to sort of pushing the puritans and the pilgrims
00:26:47.718 --> 00:26:51.255
Out of england in search of a place where they could worship
00:26:51.255 --> 00:26:54.558
Him freely and live according to his word.
00:26:54.558 --> 00:26:57.094
And by the time i got to sort of that fifth prayer, i thought,
00:26:57.094 --> 00:27:01.765
God himself is our founder.
00:27:01.765 --> 00:27:03.767
He did it, and he doesn't get the credit.
00:27:03.767 --> 00:27:06.236
And that has never left me.
00:27:06.236 --> 00:27:08.238
He doesn't get the credit, and he should get the credit.
00:27:08.238 --> 00:27:11.008
So, it started as prayer 6 years ago, that was they sat in my
00:27:11.008 --> 00:27:14.678
Computer and last may god opened the door.
00:27:14.678 --> 00:27:17.014
And it's my desire that he would get the credit for america.
00:27:17.014 --> 00:27:21.318
Kirk: i think it would change everything in this country if we
00:27:21.318 --> 00:27:24.621
Really understood that.
00:27:24.621 --> 00:27:26.490
That jesus christ himself is the founder of his church, but that
00:27:26.490 --> 00:27:33.130
Through jesus christ, god birthed in the hearts of certain
00:27:33.130 --> 00:27:39.169
Men and women, the principles that would lead them to write
00:27:39.169 --> 00:27:43.474
Things like the declaration of independence, which was also
00:27:43.474 --> 00:27:47.377
Firmly rooted in a dependence upon god as their ruler, and
00:27:47.377 --> 00:27:52.483
Then write the constitution, which would advocate for things
00:27:52.483 --> 00:27:55.853
Like self-government and a limited civil government,
00:27:55.853 --> 00:28:01.458
Representative government, and this is all rooted back in the
00:28:01.458 --> 00:28:04.161
Ancient hebrew republic.
00:28:04.161 --> 00:28:06.563
Most people have never been taught this, and so i'm so glad
00:28:06.563 --> 00:28:08.999
That you've written this book, not as a history book, but as a
00:28:08.999 --> 00:28:11.335
Book about prayer and god's unique involvement in the
00:28:11.335 --> 00:28:15.339
Engineering and the building of this great country that we
00:28:15.339 --> 00:28:17.708
Live in.
00:28:17.708 --> 00:28:19.042
Cynthia: yes, you know, we do need to know our true history,
00:28:19.042 --> 00:28:21.779
And i am very excited to be living in this moment.
00:28:21.779 --> 00:28:24.681
We are living in a profound moment of american history
00:28:24.681 --> 00:28:28.485
Celebrating 250 years.
00:28:28.485 --> 00:28:30.687
Kirk: why is that significant?
00:28:30.687 --> 00:28:32.022
Cynthia: well, it's because everybody is paying attention.
00:28:32.022 --> 00:28:34.591
Two hundred and fifty years is a significant achievement.
00:28:34.591 --> 00:28:38.195
There's been no constitution that's provided freedom for as
00:28:38.195 --> 00:28:41.498
Long as ours has.
00:28:41.498 --> 00:28:42.866
And so when we think about the way america was shaped to
00:28:42.866 --> 00:28:47.037
Provide freedom in our founding documents, freedoms that come
00:28:47.037 --> 00:28:50.207
Directly from god himself, so that no man or government can
00:28:50.207 --> 00:28:53.744
Take them away.
00:28:53.744 --> 00:28:55.112
And we think, "gosh, we've lasted this long," we really
00:28:55.112 --> 00:28:57.147
Need to examine our past.
00:28:57.147 --> 00:28:58.882
We need to understand why, and that's why it's such a profound
00:28:58.882 --> 00:29:01.952
Moment because people are looking back and they're really
00:29:01.952 --> 00:29:05.155
Interested to know our true history.
00:29:05.155 --> 00:29:07.191
Kirk: yes, for those of you who are listening, have you ever
00:29:07.191 --> 00:29:10.093
Thought about this?
00:29:10.093 --> 00:29:11.461
You know, we go to the grocery store and we buy a package of
00:29:11.461 --> 00:29:13.330
Chicken, and there's an expiration date, and you're not
00:29:13.330 --> 00:29:14.965
Going to eat it a week after the expiration date, right?
00:29:14.965 --> 00:29:17.267
You could get really sick.
00:29:17.267 --> 00:29:18.602
Well, nations seem to have an expiration date historically,
00:29:18.602 --> 00:29:22.139
And some have put that expiration date like at a max of
00:29:22.139 --> 00:29:25.375
About 250 years.
00:29:25.375 --> 00:29:27.244
So, think of all the other nations that have changed and
00:29:27.244 --> 00:29:29.379
The regime has changed, like in china.
00:29:29.379 --> 00:29:31.915
Regimes change with countries in the middle east.
00:29:31.915 --> 00:29:34.618
The united states has had a continual, peaceful handing of
00:29:34.618 --> 00:29:38.822
Power to the next president, to the next leader, to the next
00:29:38.822 --> 00:29:41.625
Representative government without wars and without regime
00:29:41.625 --> 00:29:45.896
Changes because of this document and the principles that it's
00:29:45.896 --> 00:29:48.832
Built on.
00:29:48.832 --> 00:29:50.200
That's a very unique thing in the history of the world.
00:29:50.200 --> 00:29:51.702
And the question is, is there something unique about our form
00:29:51.702 --> 00:29:55.072
Of government that will allow us to go another 250 years?
00:29:55.072 --> 00:29:58.842
That would be unique in all the world.
00:29:58.842 --> 00:30:01.211
Cynthia: yes, absolutely, and that's up to us, right?
00:30:01.211 --> 00:30:03.747
Will we defend our founding documents?
00:30:03.747 --> 00:30:06.783
Will we defend our constitution?
00:30:06.783 --> 00:30:08.719
Will we maintain what the founders put in place?
00:30:08.719 --> 00:30:11.321
There are efforts to change all that, and you're well aware
00:30:11.321 --> 00:30:13.390
Of that.
00:30:13.390 --> 00:30:14.758
But i think what's so important is that we go back and remember
00:30:14.758 --> 00:30:18.328
That we began in covenant with god at the time of the
00:30:18.328 --> 00:30:21.865
Pilgrims, right?
00:30:21.865 --> 00:30:23.200
The mayflower compact, i know you love this as much as i do.
00:30:23.200 --> 00:30:25.969
I mean, i just love our history and i love all the many
00:30:25.969 --> 00:30:29.373
Treasures i've discovered in doing my research about god's
00:30:29.373 --> 00:30:33.543
Hand in it.
00:30:33.543 --> 00:30:34.878
And that compact between the pilgrims and god, and the
00:30:34.878 --> 00:30:38.348
Pilgrims and each other, that's a covenant.
00:30:38.348 --> 00:30:40.884
So, we as a nation uniquely live in covenant with god, and god
00:30:40.884 --> 00:30:45.155
Has upheld his covenant.
00:30:45.155 --> 00:30:46.523
You know, what's so exciting to me right now, especially in
00:30:46.523 --> 00:30:49.426
Light of this movie that's just come out, "a great awakening,"
00:30:49.426 --> 00:30:52.029
Is that right before our revolution, god saw the
00:30:52.029 --> 00:30:54.932
Spiritual decline in america in the early 1700s.
00:30:54.932 --> 00:30:58.001
Pastors were calling for repentance and a return to god,
00:30:58.001 --> 00:31:01.371
Just like we're calling for that now.
00:31:01.371 --> 00:31:03.473
Not a pastor, but pastors and people.
00:31:03.473 --> 00:31:05.609
And what did god do?
00:31:05.609 --> 00:31:07.177
He brought george whitfield.
00:31:07.177 --> 00:31:08.545
He brought the first great awakening.
00:31:08.545 --> 00:31:10.647
He reminded people that they were loved by god, that they
00:31:10.647 --> 00:31:14.851
Were free, that they had freedom in christ, which they then
00:31:14.851 --> 00:31:18.322
Translated to their political environment to their--and they
00:31:18.322 --> 00:31:22.392
Reminded them that they needed to be born again.
00:31:22.392 --> 00:31:24.962
And it was this is really exciting for me to think about
00:31:24.962 --> 00:31:28.799
That our founders were born and raised out of the first
00:31:28.799 --> 00:31:32.703
Great awakening.
00:31:32.703 --> 00:31:34.071
They lived in the midst not just of a basic biblical worldview,
00:31:34.071 --> 00:31:37.374
But in a time of excitement about god, a god consciousness.
00:31:37.374 --> 00:31:41.645
And we need that again.
00:31:41.645 --> 00:31:43.547
Kirk: yes, we do.
00:31:43.547 --> 00:31:44.881
We need a third great awakening
00:31:44.881 --> 00:31:46.249
We've had a couple already in this country.
00:31:46.249 --> 00:31:48.118
When someone was, one of the founding fathers, was asked
00:31:48.118 --> 00:31:50.187
About the revolution, he said, "well, what revolution?
00:31:50.187 --> 00:31:53.090
Are you speaking about the war?"
00:31:53.090 --> 00:31:54.725
He said, "no, no, no."
00:31:54.725 --> 00:31:56.093
He said, "you have to understand the revolution that took place
00:31:56.093 --> 00:31:58.729
Was that awakening."
00:31:58.729 --> 00:32:00.097
It's what happened in the hearts and chests of men.
00:32:00.097 --> 00:32:02.299
There was a religious awakening and they turned their hearts
00:32:02.299 --> 00:32:06.403
Back to god.
00:32:06.403 --> 00:32:07.738
The war was just a consequence of that.
00:32:07.738 --> 00:32:09.239
They were emboldened and energized with a vitality that
00:32:09.239 --> 00:32:14.177
Came from god himself in their hearts, and they fought
00:32:14.177 --> 00:32:16.980
For freedom.
00:32:16.980 --> 00:32:18.348
They fought for truth.
00:32:18.348 --> 00:32:19.683
They fought for the future of their culture and their children
00:32:19.683 --> 00:32:21.151
And grandchildren.
00:32:21.151 --> 00:32:22.486
And that's what made them so unstoppable.
00:32:22.486 --> 00:32:26.056
This is the kind of thing that we need today.
00:32:26.056 --> 00:32:27.657
Do you think it's possible?
00:32:27.657 --> 00:32:29.026
Cynthia: i believe that christians are emboldened when
00:32:29.026 --> 00:32:31.361
They know the facts.
00:32:31.361 --> 00:32:32.696
And in my book, i have the facts of history coupled with prayer.
00:32:32.696 --> 00:32:36.266
So, you have the facts of how god was involved in our
00:32:36.266 --> 00:32:39.269
Founding, really provided for the freedoms that we have, and
00:32:39.269 --> 00:32:42.906
Then prayer for the nation for our future.
00:32:42.906 --> 00:32:46.710
And both of those things are necessary.
00:32:46.710 --> 00:32:49.112
We need to know our history, and we need to seek that same god
00:32:49.112 --> 00:32:52.783
Who met us in the first great awakening and then again in the
00:32:52.783 --> 00:32:55.719
Second great awakening to really shape this nation, which has
00:32:55.719 --> 00:32:59.723
Been a beacon for all nations.
00:32:59.723 --> 00:33:01.958
Kirk: cynthia, i think this book is so important.
00:33:01.958 --> 00:33:03.660
I can't wait for people to read it, especially during america's
00:33:03.660 --> 00:33:06.496
250th birthday.
00:33:06.496 --> 00:33:07.831
What a great time to read the prayers and understand how
00:33:07.831 --> 00:33:10.567
Prayer helped shape the nation with god as our founder.
00:33:10.567 --> 00:33:13.804
One of the difficult things we all have to wrestle with is what
00:33:13.804 --> 00:33:16.339
About these fake phony politicians who claim to be
00:33:16.339 --> 00:33:19.142
Christians, and, you know, they'll do--they check the
00:33:19.142 --> 00:33:22.345
Religious boxes, and we just wonder if that's all a political
00:33:22.345 --> 00:33:25.082
Ploy to get support, blah blah blah blah blah.
00:33:25.082 --> 00:33:27.818
Sometimes, you know, you can even see this in your own
00:33:27.818 --> 00:33:29.953
Church, where you have hypocrites.
00:33:29.953 --> 00:33:31.922
Jesus seemed to rail against the religious leader hypocrites more
00:33:31.922 --> 00:33:36.526
Than anybody else, more than the sinners, more than the
00:33:36.526 --> 00:33:38.495
Prostitutes, the tax collectors, it was the religious folks who
00:33:38.495 --> 00:33:42.199
Were feigning piety, but inside they were full of dead
00:33:42.199 --> 00:33:45.702
Men's bones.
00:33:45.702 --> 00:33:47.671
How do we help our political leaders in america, locally,
00:33:47.671 --> 00:33:54.044
State level, nationally to understand the seriousness
00:33:54.044 --> 00:33:59.082
Of this?
00:33:59.082 --> 00:34:00.450
You can't just put on the costume of a christian and then
00:34:00.450 --> 00:34:03.954
Not actually do the things that our founders did.
00:34:03.954 --> 00:34:06.823
How do we pray for them?
00:34:06.823 --> 00:34:08.725
Cynthia: well, first of all, we're told in scripture to pray
00:34:08.725 --> 00:34:10.827
For our leaders.
00:34:10.827 --> 00:34:12.195
So that prayer is the first step.
00:34:12.195 --> 00:34:13.730
And then we have to use the rights that we've been given,
00:34:13.730 --> 00:34:16.533
Our voices.
00:34:16.533 --> 00:34:17.868
You know, one of my favorite lines in "a great awakening" is
00:34:17.868 --> 00:34:20.504
That whitfield was standing there and somebody said, you
00:34:20.504 --> 00:34:26.209
Know, "we are the hands and feet of jesus."
00:34:26.209 --> 00:34:28.578
And whitfield said, "what about the voice?"
00:34:28.578 --> 00:34:31.114
And we, as christians, have a great voice in this nation.
00:34:31.114 --> 00:34:34.918
Not necessarily from a pulpit, but from a phone or an email.
00:34:34.918 --> 00:34:38.955
And one of the things that is really disheartening to me is
00:34:38.955 --> 00:34:43.093
How we as christians have self-censored.
00:34:43.093 --> 00:34:45.595
We've been made to feel that we don't have the right to speak
00:34:45.595 --> 00:34:48.765
And that could be--that is the furthest thing from the truth,
00:34:48.765 --> 00:34:52.569
Especially in light of our founding.
00:34:52.569 --> 00:34:54.771
In the time of our founding, they preached the gospel in the
00:34:54.771 --> 00:34:58.341
Public square.
00:34:58.341 --> 00:35:00.177
They were very--
00:35:00.177 --> 00:35:01.511
Kirk: they were praying--
00:35:01.511 --> 00:35:02.879
Cynthia: outspoken, yes.
00:35:02.879 --> 00:35:04.214
Kirk: they were praying in washington dc,
00:35:04.214 --> 00:35:05.582
As congress would meet.
00:35:05.582 --> 00:35:06.950
Cynthia: that's right, the continental congress as congress
00:35:06.950 --> 00:35:08.618
Would meet, et cetera.
00:35:08.618 --> 00:35:09.986
And public prayer is a part of america's history.
00:35:09.986 --> 00:35:13.957
It is a part of america's tradition.
00:35:13.957 --> 00:35:16.593
Not just private prayer, public prayer.
00:35:16.593 --> 00:35:18.728
Kirk: that's right.
00:35:18.728 --> 00:35:20.063
Cynthia: and both are really important.
00:35:20.063 --> 00:35:21.498
I'm excited that now in america, for 75 years, we've had a
00:35:21.498 --> 00:35:25.135
National day of prayer.
00:35:25.135 --> 00:35:26.570
We are returning to those roots, but we need a push, and i think
00:35:26.570 --> 00:35:31.308
This birthday is the push.
00:35:31.308 --> 00:35:33.243
Kirk: i think so too.
00:35:33.243 --> 00:35:34.611
I'm so excited about it.
00:35:34.611 --> 00:35:35.946
And i've said before, and i think now more than ever, that
00:35:35.946 --> 00:35:40.450
This cultural setback that we're experiencing just might be the
00:35:40.450 --> 00:35:44.354
Divine setup for a spiritual comeback in america led by the
00:35:44.354 --> 00:35:48.725
Family of faith.
00:35:48.725 --> 00:35:50.093
Cynthia: yes, it's up to us.
00:35:50.093 --> 00:35:51.428
Kirk: i want to get into more of the details of your book and
00:35:51.428 --> 00:35:53.296
These prayers.
00:35:53.296 --> 00:35:54.631
When we come back, we'll talk more with cynthia about how much
00:35:54.631 --> 00:35:56.967
Prayer has been an important tool in the shaping of
00:35:56.967 --> 00:35:59.436
Our country, so stay with us.
00:35:59.436 --> 00:36:05.991
Our country, so stay with us.
00:36:05.991 --> 00:36:09.479
Kirk: we're back with author cynthia scott discussing her
00:36:13.650 --> 00:36:16.186
Book, "celebrating god our founder at america's
00:36:16.186 --> 00:36:19.789
250th birthday."
00:36:19.789 --> 00:36:21.591
You know, this is a provocative title, right?
00:36:21.591 --> 00:36:23.960
God our founder, god, america's founder.
00:36:23.960 --> 00:36:26.229
That sounds like some sort of an assertion of a theocracy
00:36:26.229 --> 00:36:30.233
Of sorts.
00:36:30.233 --> 00:36:31.568
And certainly, america is not the kind of theocracy that you
00:36:31.568 --> 00:36:34.571
Would see in israel, ancient days in the scriptures.
00:36:34.571 --> 00:36:38.341
However, it can be argued, i think, that every nation is a
00:36:38.341 --> 00:36:42.579
Theocracy in a technical sense because the laws of that nation
00:36:42.579 --> 00:36:47.150
Are going to come from some religious source.
00:36:47.150 --> 00:36:50.854
And so, whether you're talking about an islamic nation or
00:36:50.854 --> 00:36:53.990
You're talking about a communist atheist nation, you're still
00:36:53.990 --> 00:36:57.327
Talking about
00:36:57.327 --> 00:36:59.062
Some ultimate source of law and truth from which comes all of
00:36:59.062 --> 00:37:04.034
The laws in the form of government and all of
00:37:04.034 --> 00:37:05.802
That stuff.
00:37:05.802 --> 00:37:07.137
And our country, in america, most certainly came from a
00:37:07.137 --> 00:37:09.572
Biblical worldview and the god of the bible.
00:37:09.572 --> 00:37:12.509
That's why we have so much freedom, and opportunity, and
00:37:12.509 --> 00:37:15.045
Blessing, and prosperity, because god has blessed it.
00:37:15.045 --> 00:37:17.947
Cynthia: that's right, and because god is the author
00:37:17.947 --> 00:37:19.849
Of freedom.
00:37:19.849 --> 00:37:21.217
And we see that going all the way back to the garden of eden,
00:37:21.217 --> 00:37:23.953
Don't we?
00:37:23.953 --> 00:37:25.288
God has given us choice, even as to whether or not we believe him
00:37:25.288 --> 00:37:28.958
Or follow him.
00:37:28.958 --> 00:37:30.293
And i am astonished, actually the more i think about it, i
00:37:30.293 --> 00:37:33.463
Keep thinking about these things.
00:37:33.463 --> 00:37:35.031
I keep thinking about our family, or rather our founding.
00:37:35.031 --> 00:37:38.034
And i am more and more astonished at what god did
00:37:38.034 --> 00:37:41.271
Because he created a system of government, not a theocracy or a
00:37:41.271 --> 00:37:45.642
Monarchy, but rather a system that would provide for freedom
00:37:45.642 --> 00:37:49.446
For every person, and that is remarkable and unique
00:37:49.446 --> 00:37:53.650
In history.
00:37:53.650 --> 00:37:54.984
And only god could have done that because god is the author
00:37:54.984 --> 00:37:57.153
Of freedom.
00:37:57.153 --> 00:37:58.521
Kirk: cynthia, you say in your book that our forefathers were
00:37:58.521 --> 00:38:01.791
On their knees before the almighty.
00:38:01.791 --> 00:38:04.127
Can you unpack that for us?
00:38:04.127 --> 00:38:05.495
Cynthia: absolutely, i mean, imagine being on the mayflower.
00:38:05.495 --> 00:38:09.299
That would put you on your knees to begin with.
00:38:09.299 --> 00:38:11.368
But then once they got here, they got down on their knees and
00:38:11.368 --> 00:38:13.803
They thanked god.
00:38:13.803 --> 00:38:15.171
They sought god in everything.
00:38:15.171 --> 00:38:17.040
They were dependent on him.
00:38:17.040 --> 00:38:18.575
The puritans feared the lord.
00:38:18.575 --> 00:38:20.844
You know, their pastors were well trained and they were sort
00:38:20.844 --> 00:38:23.780
Of the arbiters of thinking in those days.
00:38:23.780 --> 00:38:27.217
And so, yes, our forefathers prayed both privately
00:38:27.217 --> 00:38:31.020
And publicly.
00:38:31.020 --> 00:38:32.355
But they weren't the only ones who prayed.
00:38:32.355 --> 00:38:34.124
You know, all the people prayed.
00:38:34.124 --> 00:38:35.892
And i think that is what we really need to stress right now.
00:38:35.892 --> 00:38:40.363
God is calling every single person in america to turn to
00:38:40.363 --> 00:38:43.600
Him, to cry out to him in prayer, and to listen.
00:38:43.600 --> 00:38:47.537
You know, my book encourages people to stop, and pause, and
00:38:47.537 --> 00:38:51.374
Listen to what god is saying to them.
00:38:51.374 --> 00:38:53.910
Because it wasn't just the famous in history that were
00:38:53.910 --> 00:38:56.479
Responsible for our founding and the sustaining of our nation.
00:38:56.479 --> 00:39:00.216
It was everyday people who served an extraordinary god, who
00:39:00.216 --> 00:39:04.921
Brought this nation together.
00:39:04.921 --> 00:39:06.256
And he's calling us to do the same thing.
00:39:06.256 --> 00:39:08.792
Kirk: that's right.
00:39:08.792 --> 00:39:10.126
I believe that 100%.
00:39:10.126 --> 00:39:11.494
I have a friend, ray, who would always say that, "yes, there are
00:39:11.494 --> 00:39:15.165
The famous, there are the apostle pauls, there's the king
00:39:15.165 --> 00:39:18.334
Davids, there's the george washingtons, but it is the habit
00:39:18.334 --> 00:39:21.571
Of god to use nobodies from nowhere with nothing to offer
00:39:21.571 --> 00:39:24.574
But a heart fully surrendered to him to do the heavy lifting."
00:39:24.574 --> 00:39:28.311
It's the prayers of everyday moms and dads and students that
00:39:28.311 --> 00:39:33.416
Move the strong arm of god to do the things that nobody else
00:39:33.416 --> 00:39:37.720
Can do.
00:39:37.720 --> 00:39:40.356
It's been said that gen z, millennials experience an
00:39:40.356 --> 00:39:44.727
Enormous amount of worry, fear, anxiety today.
00:39:44.727 --> 00:39:48.398
How can prayer ease their fears and bring them peace?
00:39:48.398 --> 00:39:53.770
Cynthia: you know, it's so interesting that you would
00:39:53.770 --> 00:39:55.238
Say that.
00:39:55.238 --> 00:39:56.573
I was just having that conversation with my daughter
00:39:56.573 --> 00:39:57.941
This morning.
00:39:57.941 --> 00:39:59.275
She had read the book, but then she listened to it.
00:39:59.275 --> 00:40:00.910
And she said, "you know, it was reassuring to know that there is
00:40:00.910 --> 00:40:05.982
A god who is watching over us."
00:40:05.982 --> 00:40:08.351
You know, so many of our young people have this impending sense
00:40:08.351 --> 00:40:12.555
Of disaster.
00:40:12.555 --> 00:40:13.923
We think about ai, we think about the wars, we think about,
00:40:13.923 --> 00:40:17.494
You know, just the lying that goes on in our nation.
00:40:17.494 --> 00:40:20.096
But yet god is sovereign, and he has helped us in the past, and
00:40:20.096 --> 00:40:24.300
He will help us again if we turn to him.
00:40:24.300 --> 00:40:26.236
So, she found it comforting.
00:40:26.236 --> 00:40:27.770
She said, "i'm really--i was happy to hear that we have hope
00:40:27.770 --> 00:40:32.242
Because we serve a god who hears us."
00:40:32.242 --> 00:40:34.177
Kirk: it is so important to remember that.
00:40:34.177 --> 00:40:36.279
That there is a hierarchy of authority and power in
00:40:36.279 --> 00:40:38.882
This universe.
00:40:38.882 --> 00:40:40.216
And ai is not at the top of the food chain.
00:40:40.216 --> 00:40:42.018
Because above artificial intelligence is ultimate
00:40:42.018 --> 00:40:44.988
Intelligence and ultimate power, and ai has to subject itself
00:40:44.988 --> 00:40:49.459
To that.
00:40:49.459 --> 00:40:50.827
It won't--it would never want to subject itself to it, but
00:40:50.827 --> 00:40:52.595
Those who create it and manage it are men and women who are
00:40:52.595 --> 00:40:59.702
Dependent upon god for their very next breath.
00:40:59.702 --> 00:41:01.938
And ai has got no chance against ultimate intelligence and power.
00:41:01.938 --> 00:41:08.411
And none of it surprises him.
00:41:08.411 --> 00:41:10.280
So, we've got to get back to that.
00:41:10.280 --> 00:41:12.215
We've got to understand that there's one sovereign in the
00:41:12.215 --> 00:41:14.217
Universe and it's not chatgpt, it's not instagram and
00:41:14.217 --> 00:41:17.153
Chat--snapchat.
00:41:17.153 --> 00:41:19.589
It is the almighty.
00:41:19.589 --> 00:41:21.090
And our founders understood that, our forefathers and
00:41:21.090 --> 00:41:23.092
Foremothers understood that.
00:41:23.092 --> 00:41:24.460
And that's why they prayed to him.
00:41:24.460 --> 00:41:25.862
They knew that if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground
00:41:25.862 --> 00:41:29.198
Without the lord noticing it, is there any hope for a nation
00:41:29.198 --> 00:41:32.902
Without god helping us?
00:41:32.902 --> 00:41:34.871
And so, we must pray.
00:41:34.871 --> 00:41:36.239
Cynthia: we have to, and it's not just about the intelligence
00:41:36.239 --> 00:41:39.709
That is so impersonal that you talked about ai, et cetera.
00:41:39.709 --> 00:41:42.879
It's about a personal god who loves us.
00:41:42.879 --> 00:41:45.848
Kirk: yes.
00:41:45.848 --> 00:41:47.183
Cynthia: he cares about us.
00:41:47.183 --> 00:41:48.551
He wants what's best for us.
00:41:48.551 --> 00:41:49.886
He wants good for us.
00:41:49.886 --> 00:41:51.254
He says that all through the scriptures.
00:41:51.254 --> 00:41:52.589
And the bringing forth of america, i think,
00:41:52.589 --> 00:41:55.191
Exemplifies that.
00:41:55.191 --> 00:41:56.593
Kirk: don't you think that's a wonderful narrative that young
00:41:56.593 --> 00:41:59.596
People would love to embrace?
00:41:59.596 --> 00:42:01.831
And yet they've not been taught it.
00:42:01.831 --> 00:42:03.299
And it's--it has the benefit of actually being true, hello.
00:42:03.299 --> 00:42:07.837
How wonderful to say that i was made by a god who loves me.
00:42:07.837 --> 00:42:12.742
I was wonderfully, fearfully created in my mother's womb.
00:42:12.742 --> 00:42:16.412
He's got a plan for my life.
00:42:16.412 --> 00:42:17.747
He's working everything, even the difficult stuff, together
00:42:17.747 --> 00:42:20.617
For my good, because he's given me a love for him and a love
00:42:20.617 --> 00:42:24.287
For others.
00:42:24.287 --> 00:42:25.755
Cynthia: it's amazing.
00:42:25.755 --> 00:42:27.123
Kirk: and i can make a sense of evil, morality is grounded in
00:42:27.123 --> 00:42:29.859
Something objective.
00:42:29.859 --> 00:42:32.295
I can actually understand that i was made on purpose for
00:42:32.295 --> 00:42:35.832
A purpose.
00:42:35.832 --> 00:42:37.166
I'm not just random bacteria and, you know, lucky pond scum
00:42:37.166 --> 00:42:41.604
That got zapped by lightning 15 billion years ago.
00:42:41.604 --> 00:42:44.607
Cynthia: you know, that's where my heart is, that people would
00:42:44.607 --> 00:42:46.743
Engage with god and understand that.
00:42:46.743 --> 00:42:48.845
That they would know him in their hearts, experience him.
00:42:48.845 --> 00:42:52.382
And that's why this started with prayer, and it's a little bit
00:42:52.382 --> 00:42:55.952
Different, i'm finding.
00:42:55.952 --> 00:42:57.320
I wasn't expecting it to be because it seems natural to me
00:42:57.320 --> 00:42:59.622
That we would just launch into prayer for the nation out of
00:42:59.622 --> 00:43:02.592
The history.
00:43:02.592 --> 00:43:03.926
But as we pray for the nation, you know, god encounters us
00:43:03.926 --> 00:43:06.462
Personally too.
00:43:06.462 --> 00:43:07.797
Whenever we come into his presence, no matter what we're
00:43:07.797 --> 00:43:10.333
Praying for.
00:43:10.333 --> 00:43:11.701
I have a prayer call every morning from 7:30 until 8:00.
00:43:11.701 --> 00:43:14.237
I was on it this morning.
00:43:14.237 --> 00:43:15.605
We pray for the nation, since november of 2020, we haven't
00:43:15.605 --> 00:43:18.675
Missed a day.
00:43:18.675 --> 00:43:20.043
And i have watched as we have come into the presence of god in
00:43:20.043 --> 00:43:23.246
Prayer for the nation, god move in every one of our lives.
00:43:23.246 --> 00:43:27.083
Kirk: i believe that 100%.
00:43:27.083 --> 00:43:29.786
I don't think that we live in a post-christian universe, or
00:43:29.786 --> 00:43:32.689
Post-christian world.
00:43:32.689 --> 00:43:34.023
Like try delivering that message to the throne room of god.
00:43:34.023 --> 00:43:37.026
Father, son, holy spirit, i've got news, we live in a
00:43:37.026 --> 00:43:39.128
Post-christian--no, jesus christ was exalted to the right
00:43:39.128 --> 00:43:41.731
Hand of the father.
00:43:41.731 --> 00:43:43.099
All authority in heaven and on earth was given to him.
00:43:43.099 --> 00:43:45.068
He has the keys to the kingdom.
00:43:45.068 --> 00:43:46.602
He is ruling and reigning over the nations right now, and we
00:43:46.602 --> 00:43:48.938
Get to be there with him as he brings all things together
00:43:48.938 --> 00:43:53.176
Under christ.
00:43:53.176 --> 00:43:54.510
Cynthia: think about that, the fact that god is on his throne,
00:43:54.510 --> 00:43:57.146
He has not changed, in terms of where we are as a nation.
00:43:57.146 --> 00:44:00.983
We face these existential threats, do we not?
00:44:00.983 --> 00:44:03.419
War, nuclear--the potential of nuclear war, ai, all of these
00:44:03.419 --> 00:44:06.689
Things, and yet god has not changed.
00:44:06.689 --> 00:44:09.826
He revived us not only once, he revived us twice, and he is
00:44:09.826 --> 00:44:14.664
Certainly able to do it again, to bring glory to himself by
00:44:14.664 --> 00:44:18.901
Turning this nation fully to himself.
00:44:18.901 --> 00:44:21.337
What could be more hopeful or positive?
00:44:21.337 --> 00:44:24.040
And this is the moment that we're living in.
00:44:24.040 --> 00:44:26.142
Kirk: and you know, watch for it.
00:44:26.142 --> 00:44:28.811
Juneteenth is going to be a big focus for those who do not know
00:44:28.811 --> 00:44:33.549
God, do not love god, do not understand the true founding of
00:44:33.549 --> 00:44:36.586
Our country and the role that prayer played in that, and they
00:44:36.586 --> 00:44:39.555
Want to focus us, particularly this year, back on the ultimate
00:44:39.555 --> 00:44:42.658
Sin of america, which is slavery.
00:44:42.658 --> 00:44:46.162
And children need to be educated to understand the context of the
00:44:46.162 --> 00:44:52.268
Beginnings of america, and slaveholders, and george
00:44:52.268 --> 00:44:54.937
Washington, and jefferson, and and all of this stuff.
00:44:54.937 --> 00:44:58.141
Slavery for one, was just the way the entire world worked.
00:44:58.141 --> 00:45:05.281
America didn't invent slavery.
00:45:05.281 --> 00:45:07.016
I mean you had slavery in ancient egypt, you had slavery
00:45:07.016 --> 00:45:09.619
In ancient rome, you had slavery in ancient everywhere, because
00:45:09.619 --> 00:45:13.156
In those days, it wasn't wrong, it was just good business.
00:45:13.156 --> 00:45:16.592
You have different classes of people, that's how it worked.
00:45:16.592 --> 00:45:18.961
And it was actually the bible-believing people who came
00:45:18.961 --> 00:45:23.132
And founded america that abolished slavery and had it
00:45:23.132 --> 00:45:26.602
Written into the constitution.
00:45:26.602 --> 00:45:28.404
But for political war reasons and the union around the
00:45:28.404 --> 00:45:31.607
Revolutionary time period, a couple of states wouldn't agree
00:45:31.607 --> 00:45:34.410
To it because their economies depended on it, so they had to
00:45:34.410 --> 00:45:36.913
Forego it to a later generation.
00:45:36.913 --> 00:45:39.081
But america and its unique successes are rooted in prayer,
00:45:39.081 --> 00:45:46.856
And the understanding that "all men are created equal in the
00:45:46.856 --> 00:45:50.793
Image of god."
00:45:50.793 --> 00:45:52.161
Men, women, children should be free to love god and to love
00:45:52.161 --> 00:45:55.364
Their neighbor, and we are here where we are today with these
00:45:55.364 --> 00:45:59.235
Elevated moral ideals because of those who went before us and
00:45:59.235 --> 00:46:03.940
Wrote this stuff down, and they all drew from the bible
00:46:03.940 --> 00:46:06.809
And prayer.
00:46:06.809 --> 00:46:08.144
Cynthia: yes, slavery was always a sin, whether it was in america
00:46:08.144 --> 00:46:10.246
Or anywhere else.
00:46:10.246 --> 00:46:11.614
But the fact that we actually turned from it at great
00:46:11.614 --> 00:46:14.750
Cost, twice our fragile union was threatened.
00:46:14.750 --> 00:46:17.887
And both times it was over the issue of slavery.
00:46:17.887 --> 00:46:20.623
At the time of the constitution, because most of our founders did
00:46:20.623 --> 00:46:23.926
Not want to continue with slavery in america, two states,
00:46:23.926 --> 00:46:26.629
As you know, south carolina and georgia, refused to join.
00:46:26.629 --> 00:46:30.199
And i mean, it was a very stressful time.
00:46:30.199 --> 00:46:34.437
I mean, these states were broke.
00:46:34.437 --> 00:46:36.672
Many people had died.
00:46:36.672 --> 00:46:38.107
They were just struggling to maintain their statehood and
00:46:38.107 --> 00:46:41.244
This whole idea of the union.
00:46:41.244 --> 00:46:42.812
I mean, it's miraculous that we got through that.
00:46:42.812 --> 00:46:44.747
And then again, of course, at the time of the civil war.
00:46:44.747 --> 00:46:46.916
But god never forgot that he created freedom for all people.
00:46:46.916 --> 00:46:51.053
And so, in america, that's the way it is.
00:46:51.053 --> 00:46:53.356
And we always have to strive for that freedom.
00:46:53.356 --> 00:46:57.393
Kirk: cynthia, in your view, what would it look like for
00:46:57.393 --> 00:47:00.529
America to rededicate itself to god in this 250th birthday year?
00:47:00.529 --> 00:47:07.570
Cynthia: you know, part of the reason i wrote this book is
00:47:07.570 --> 00:47:10.973
Because i want that this celebration to be personally
00:47:10.973 --> 00:47:15.478
Meaningful to each person who's living in america.
00:47:15.478 --> 00:47:18.547
I wish all of america would humble themselves before god and
00:47:18.547 --> 00:47:22.718
Understand our history.
00:47:22.718 --> 00:47:24.420
So, i think what it looks like first is to understand that god
00:47:24.420 --> 00:47:28.891
Is with us, god created us.
00:47:28.891 --> 00:47:31.427
He loves us, we're his creation.
00:47:31.427 --> 00:47:33.062
He is for us.
00:47:33.062 --> 00:47:34.397
So, to--for us to rededicate this nation, which it starts
00:47:34.397 --> 00:47:37.900
Person by person, it starts with you, and with me, and with all
00:47:37.900 --> 00:47:41.404
Of your viewers, that we would take the time to understand what
00:47:41.404 --> 00:47:44.774
God has done and be grateful to repent for our sins, to repent
00:47:44.774 --> 00:47:48.878
For the sins of the nation.
00:47:48.878 --> 00:47:50.313
And then having done that personally, we do it publicly,
00:47:50.313 --> 00:47:55.084
And we do it at things like national day of prayer, the
00:47:55.084 --> 00:47:58.187
Rededication, rededicate 250, and every opportunity that we
00:47:58.187 --> 00:48:02.391
Have to continue in this tradition of praying, coming
00:48:02.391 --> 00:48:06.829
To god.
00:48:06.829 --> 00:48:08.164
You know, our forefathers, they had days of prayer and fasting
00:48:08.164 --> 00:48:10.733
When they were in trouble, they had days of prayer and
00:48:10.733 --> 00:48:12.868
Thanksgiving when they were rejoicing.
00:48:12.868 --> 00:48:14.670
So, that's what we should be doing, publicly thanking god for
00:48:14.670 --> 00:48:17.473
What he's done in america.
00:48:17.473 --> 00:48:18.808
Kirk: i love it, thank you for writing this book.
00:48:18.808 --> 00:48:20.176
Thank you for coming on "takeaways."
00:48:20.176 --> 00:48:21.510
Cynthia: thank you so much.
00:48:21.510 --> 00:48:22.878
Kirk: and i hope all of you will get a hold of this on america's
00:48:22.878 --> 00:48:25.548
250th birthday year.
00:48:25.548 --> 00:48:27.149
After the break, we'll review today's takeaways.
00:48:27.149 --> 00:48:34.993
After the break, we'll review today's takeaways.
00:48:34.993 --> 00:48:38.527
Kirk: as our nation celebrates 250 years of freedom and
00:48:42.665 --> 00:48:46.102
Democracy, there has never been a better time to recognize that
00:48:46.102 --> 00:48:50.239
God's not just been part of our history, he established our
00:48:50.239 --> 00:48:53.642
Nation, and he's directed it from the very beginning.
00:48:53.642 --> 00:48:56.979
In today's conversation with thomas s. kidd and cynthia
00:48:56.979 --> 00:49:00.249
Scott, we talked about how our history of liberty points back
00:49:00.249 --> 00:49:04.286
To a founding leadership submitted to god, and how we as
00:49:04.286 --> 00:49:08.591
Christians today can step in, educate ourselves, and our
00:49:08.591 --> 00:49:12.328
Children, and play our role as everyday citizens.
00:49:12.328 --> 00:49:16.198
Here's a look at a few of our takeaways.
00:49:16.198 --> 00:49:20.069
Follow the faithful.
00:49:20.069 --> 00:49:22.171
In both discussions, a common thread came up.
00:49:22.171 --> 00:49:25.408
We tend to focus on the famous founders, while overlooking how
00:49:25.408 --> 00:49:30.112
Many faithful men and women were behind the scenes.
00:49:30.112 --> 00:49:33.816
These were the everyday americans who relied on god, on
00:49:33.816 --> 00:49:37.520
The bible, and their pastor to inform their thinking about what
00:49:37.520 --> 00:49:41.490
Was happening in our country.
00:49:41.490 --> 00:49:43.526
They showed up to pray over troops, they led prayer meetings
00:49:43.526 --> 00:49:47.229
At congress, and ultimately built their homes and businesses
00:49:47.229 --> 00:49:51.634
On christian values.
00:49:51.634 --> 00:49:53.969
America's liberties and freedom depended on everyday people, not
00:49:53.969 --> 00:49:58.507
Just the famous ones.
00:49:58.507 --> 00:49:59.942
So, that should prompt us to ask, how am i being faithful to
00:49:59.942 --> 00:50:04.580
Our nation's christian roots in my own life?
00:50:04.580 --> 00:50:09.151
Freedom is in the facts.
00:50:09.151 --> 00:50:11.754
Cynthia and thomas both reminded us, we need to know our true
00:50:11.754 --> 00:50:16.992
American story.
00:50:16.992 --> 00:50:18.461
250 years of democracy, a constitution, and freedom that
00:50:18.461 --> 00:50:23.632
Come directly from god's design.
00:50:23.632 --> 00:50:27.436
Just like we study scripture in context, we need to look at the
00:50:27.436 --> 00:50:31.674
Facts of our own country's history in context.
00:50:31.674 --> 00:50:35.845
Cynthia said, "christians are emboldened when they know
00:50:35.845 --> 00:50:39.548
The facts."
00:50:39.548 --> 00:50:40.883
And the fact is, this year is a great time to ask, where was god
00:50:40.883 --> 00:50:46.355
In our nation's founding?
00:50:46.355 --> 00:50:48.424
We have to get back to being inspired and informed by our
00:50:48.424 --> 00:50:52.194
Biblical roots as a nation.
00:50:52.194 --> 00:50:55.865
Understand what's at stake.
00:50:55.865 --> 00:50:58.601
As we look deeper into america's history, it becomes
00:50:58.601 --> 00:51:01.604
Really clear.
00:51:01.604 --> 00:51:02.938
America's survival and flourishing depends on the
00:51:02.938 --> 00:51:07.042
Goodness of the people.
00:51:07.042 --> 00:51:09.512
Historically, when the gospel is preached freely, it shapes the
00:51:09.512 --> 00:51:13.516
Moral code of our nation.
00:51:13.516 --> 00:51:15.918
Whether everyone agrees theologically or not, is not
00:51:15.918 --> 00:51:19.121
Quite the issue.
00:51:19.121 --> 00:51:20.456
The pattern is clear.
00:51:20.456 --> 00:51:22.658
The gospel is preached, which changes hearts and minds, that
00:51:22.658 --> 00:51:28.097
Makes us good on the inside, which sustains freedom and
00:51:28.097 --> 00:51:33.502
Maintains our republic.
00:51:33.502 --> 00:51:37.473
Pray privately, speak publicly.
00:51:37.473 --> 00:51:40.843
I loved how in our conversation with cynthia, she highlighted
00:51:40.843 --> 00:51:43.946
The importance of coupling facts with prayer.
00:51:43.946 --> 00:51:48.217
She encouraged us to pray privately and then publicly.
00:51:48.217 --> 00:51:52.821
Public prayer is not something new.
00:51:52.821 --> 00:51:55.691
It's part of our history.
00:51:55.691 --> 00:51:57.560
Christians today often self-censor.
00:51:57.560 --> 00:52:01.263
We close up and we're tight-lipped about our faith.
00:52:01.263 --> 00:52:05.301
But god calls us to use the rights that we're given, to use
00:52:05.301 --> 00:52:10.005
Our voices.
00:52:10.005 --> 00:52:11.340
And with social media and national prayer events, we have
00:52:11.340 --> 00:52:14.510
More opportunities now than ever.
00:52:14.510 --> 00:52:17.279
So, start with private prayer and then don't shrink back, step
00:52:17.279 --> 00:52:21.850
Into the public spaces, online and in person to pray and point
00:52:21.850 --> 00:52:27.156
People in our nation back to god.
00:52:27.156 --> 00:52:30.459
That's all for this episode of 'takeaways,' and thanks
00:52:30.459 --> 00:52:33.062
For watching.
00:52:33.062 --> 00:52:34.396
And if you've enjoyed the show, don't forget to set your dvr so
00:52:34.396 --> 00:52:37.299
You never miss an episode.
00:52:37.299 --> 00:52:39.235
And, of course, you can always catch up on past episodes by
00:52:39.235 --> 00:52:42.338
Searching for "takeaways" on tbn plus or by visiting "the kirk
00:52:42.338 --> 00:52:47.042
Cameron on tbn" youtube channel.
00:52:47.042 --> 00:52:49.678
I hope to see you here next time for more great conversations.
00:52:49.678 --> 00:52:49.678

Thomas S. Kidd & Cynthia Scott: Celebrating our Freedoms and Independence | Takeaways with Kirk Cameron

May 25, 2026 | 53:10

Closed captions

Share